Clueless In-Laws

You can be close to someone, but have boundaries, which you have NONE.

They are not taking advantage of you, at all. They just are not great communicators and you are giving them too many options. YOU set the rules....stop flailing in the wind and make a decision. "Mom and Dad, we are going to Bob Evans for Thanksgiving. We'd love it if you can make it. I NEED to know by November 20th, so I can give an accurate count to the restaurant."

When you visit them at the Truck Stop, then have THEM call you when THEY are ready. Let THEM wait for you. If it's too much, then tell them that you can't meet them this time. They only don't drive to your place, because they know you will drive to them.

SET THE BOUNDARIES. You need to practice with your in-laws so that you can set boundaries for your children. Trust me. I have 4 kids. ;)

I think the problem is that: You and Hubby, LET THEM... decide what to do.
And then you do it, even if it is highly inconvenient to you.

So, just tell them, what works for you or not.
Or you can just continue on letting them control things.
It is a choice.

They are the way they are.
You are the way you/Hubby are. And you have 2 young kids.
So then, YOU and HUBBY decide, what YOUR plans are.
And you can say yes or no, to them.
And explain it to them in a mature calm, manner.

And NO, they don't think of everything you/Hubby/Your kids need to go through to accommodate them and their non-traditional schedule and lifestyle.
So, YOU and Hubby need to, decide, what YOU want to do or not.
Or you will just be caving in each time and not liking it and just doing what they want.

it sounds to me like they are just clueless. i am sure they don't mean for things to be so h*** o* you.

honestly if it's the only family you guys have contact with between four parents, then yes, i'd suck it up and keep dealing with them. it's not as though you have three other families vying for your time on holidays, right?

focus on the good, try to accept that it will be insanity, and love them as they are. they won't ever change. but to me, it sounds like one of those things you do, for family. they love you guys - you guys love them.

and then come here to vent all you want ;) (that would drive me nuts too!)

ETA after reading the other responses: i think it would be great if you could plan and let them know, and make them work around you...but there's always room for compromise especially if there's no other reason than just the aggravation - when it comes to the kids' bedtimes or routine is when i would choose to put my foot down.

and also, ignore the war mongers on here...yikes some seriously angry answers- for no reason. i didn't think your tone was rude or ungrateful at all. i think most rational human beings - especially mothers - would have trouble with the chaos that these visits bring. it has to be h*** o* your kids. don't feel bad about it bothering you.

Wow you sound like the selfish person to me. I have been around that situation all my married life, and growing up too. Do you realize the sacrifices that THEY MAKE to come see you? All they need is a ride to come see their loved ones, and you are bitching about having to wait 2 hours for them and eating a late dinner. How about the 2 hours they were delayed in coming to see you? How do you think they feel about that? I think you sound like a control freak. Why did you have a falling out with your family? In one breath you are totally complaining about them and everything you have to do to see them, and the next breath you are saying that you love them and your MIL is like a mother and a close friend to you. I find it odd that you are complaining about waiting to see a close friend. And as far as complaining about your FIL never being home when your husband was growing up, and he is clueless about raising a family. Do you realize what he goes through to support his family everyday of his life? I think it is pretty sad that you are so unsupportive and unloving regarding this. You need to look at the big picture. They obviously love you and want you in their lives otherwise they wouldn't sacrifice to come see you when they are in the area. It is hard for truck drivers to get home on a regular basis unless they have a set schedule. And then they have to deal with the rules and laws of the road and make sure they have enough hours to get home. Maybe that is what is making them late in getting to your house. Give them a break.

Happy Thanksgiving.

At all times you have plan A and plan B. The biggest problem I see including myself is that we all want things for holidays to be peaceful and easy to accomplish.And for people to be nice. I'm afraid unless you change Father in laws, that you just continue as you have but know things like this are going to happen, have books in the car for kids for the two hour wait, set up some ways to enjoy yourself. As for the cats, etc. I actually think they probably think they are doing you a favor.

There are many factors coming into play here. Most can be tamed and you still have a relationship. From their end, they are constantly traveling. They are used to having their schedule be fluid, adjusted all the time with traffic and loading delays. They think everybody else is just as flexible. Then there is the cat issue. They are good company on the trip but pose problems when they stop. They have forgotten anything about having little kids.

You want to include them in your lives but it's becoming untenable. Before there is another holiday you need to be open and frank with them.
Something along the lines that you have explained here. I think they would appreciate truth and being open with them even makes you more like family because you are sharing with them the details of your life. They might even have a solution themselves. Meeting late at a truck stop is only a good situation for them not you. Can they leave the cats in the truck for a couple hours by themselves? Yes. Maybe your H can pick them up and bring them to you. Hope you can work it out!

I am sure you have had some fabulous answers, so forgive me if I sound like I am parotting another mom.
I just wanted to give you a big hug. Having two little ones at this age are quite a chore to handle for any period longer than 20 minutes. I know you probably already have one, but the dvd players were a lifesaver for us when our son was little and we made long, (six hours) grueling trips back home. Snacks, toys, puzzles for little hands always helped as well. I know you are thinking it might ruin the dinner you are headed to, but it's better than being having an ogar parent already put into a bad mood before you even get to the destination. I guess what I am saying is don't take it to heart. The little ones will grow up quicker than you will want them to, and the these little aggrivations will be worth it one day when you look back. (Thank goodness.) :)
As far as your FIL's job goes-it sounds like he is at the mercy of whoever he is carrying the loads for. Flexibility isn't always an option fir lots of folks that are working for someone else-please try to keep that in mind no matter how aggrevated you seem. Most men are scatter-brained to a fault. To address your concerns with his wife would be a moot point. Chances are she already knows or they will think you are being petty. Let it go. Things come up-as the ways of the world. Always make alternate plans just in case you need to execute them.
Lastly, they probably adore their pets. I think it's fabulous that they don't try to force them on your family knowing your husband has allergies. I also understand not wanting to leave an animal(s) unattended, even for a few hours. If they are having to live in the truck, they might not want the pets having a break down and tearing up stuff or spraying the inside of the cab. Yuck.
I am all for keeping family ties if you can. Sounds to me like their hearts are in the right place. Chin up dear. :)

Start meeting them at places where your kids are able to play, run around, be kids. Like McDonald's or Burger King or a public park. That way it doesn't matter if they are running behind. They can call and say "We are at the truck stop right now" and then you can go meet them physically since their truck most likely won't fit in a McDonald's parking lot...lol.

I would just do this each time. It doesn't matter if the actual plans happen or not. You guys could have already eaten too. What does matter is that you get to see them and visit a bit.

Let them set the pace for this. You have traveled before, you know how goofy traffic can be. There could be a pile up like there was on I-35 a few weeks ago due to the dust storm or there could be a wreck or someone breaks down. There is no guarantee that they will ever be able to make a time table.

Plus, they are a married couple just like all other married couples. Sometimes they don't communicate well. I would suggest you make the plans with the plan maker. It sounds like that is her. This way you're getting it "from the horses mouth". She knew they weren't going to make it and thought he told you. That tells you that dad fell behind, not her.

If she wants to cook for you guys she has to be in town at least one day ahead so she can shop and start the cooking early. If they don't make it you just go out to eat anyway....

So all in all, do plan to meet up with them but do it better. Plan on seeing them at the truck stop BUT don't sit in the parking lot for half an hour waiting, plan ahead and go to someplace good for the kids to goof off. Then go meet them when they are actually there. It helps to give them time to get out, walk around, go the showers, take a few minutes to freshen up before going someplace, let them get out of the truck and get settled before getting there and having a hard time managing the kids. This will make it so much easier on everyone.

As for eating out, you could say this "We are planning on eating at Bob Evan's at 2pm, if you'd like to join us we'll gladly make the table set up for 6 instead of 4". The end.

They are traveling cat people. They are WAY out of touch with how families with infants/toddlers function. It's not a function of education level, it's a function of lifestyle.

I like Jamie J's idea of having dad pick them up at a spot for their truck and him bringing them to you for the holiday. Your schedule is yours and you need to keep it. Son needs to tell them that you need to get together between 10am and 6pm for the kiddos. Build in something for them that can move around. Like if you do dinner at 4, make it flexible, or keep the leftovers and just hang with them while they eat with you. If their time falls outside of that, it'll just be him because you'll be taking care of the babies - and if they'll be in town long enough to get together for breakfast the next day, great!

Kitties are very self sufficient, and they should be able to stay in the car for 2-4 hours if it's not freezing. I found this online - http://www.sportsunlimitedinc.com/benchwarmer.html - perhaps it would be a good gift for them for their kitties when it's cold. The kitties can cuddle on them when they park for dinner anywhere. Everybody wins!

It sounds to me like they consider their cats to be their children. I'm sorry about that - really. I wonder if you had 4 cat carriers at the ready, if they would come and put the cats in the carriers so that they could come to your house. I just don't understand why they would never want to visit you at your house. Have you had a talk about this with them, an earnest and serious one?

Families who love each other compromise. You are doing all the compromising. I know you are willing to do that - that's ALL you've been doing (and I don't think you sound selfish at all - somebody here is in a really bad mood...) You do sound frustrated and SAD about the fact that people who used to live beside of you never want to walk in your home anymore. I don't blame you for not understanding.

In the spirit of Sheila's plan A / plan B advice, I'd put together a couple bags with "grandparents visit" items and keep them put up. These are toys, books, etc that the kids only see when you are "waiting" for them to show up. That way the children won't be bored. On the day you think they are coming, don't plan anything around that time. Just keep busy until you get the call. They have cell phones, right? Tell them to let you know when they are x amount of time away so that you know when to leave. They have GPS, surely, so they should be able to do that. Something tells me that they aren't really trying to give you a proper ETA. Your husband should be asking for that.

I would NEVER believe your step-MIL when she says she wants to cook you a dinner. Never! It's evidently a little pipedream of hers, but will never come to fruition.

I'm sorry you ended up at Bob Evans, though I hope the food was okay.

Good luck next year.
Dawn

Find a near by spot for the truck have your husband pick them up (from the spot) and they come to you!!! OR your husband can meet them for lunch/dinner, taking to small kids to a restaurant is HELL and not fun for anyone!

Yes, you are expecting to much from them because people do not change. They have their quirks, and your problems are partially due to ages of your kids (temporary-that will improve with time).

The bottom line is that you like them and want them in your life. Thye're not really taking advantage of you, like my in-laws who invite themselves to stay with us, stay days longer than they say they will, eat us out of house and home, make messes, drink too much, don't help out, and never offer to pay for anything..or when they came to visit for a MONTH (subletted a place near us in NYC so we coudln't say no) when I was 8 months pregnant and on bed-rest and hadn't seen my touring husband in months and said it was a bad time, but they came ANYWAY and kept him out day and night......

Yours just don't handle the occasional drop-by visits as you would like: Orderly, planned definitely, lots of notice, in synch with your kid's schedule...and for eccentric truck drivers (they do sound groovy) who drive thru occasionally, this is all you're going to get from them. And you like them. So you have to deal with it.

You have to draw a BIT more of a boundary line which will be hard after catering, but you can do it. Offer what you can, and stick to it. If they cant' conform, KINDLY say this time won't work, don't start a fight or mope, and maybe next time they can manage things better, or you'll be up for the dramatics the next time...but you can't change them. Just stick to your own boundaries a bit more.

I'm happy to say I started drawing the line with the in-laws a few years ago (after 10 long years of their nonsense) and it WASN'T EASY but I got them in check. And now I'm getting divorced soon so PHEW, Sionara, Suckas....

But your in-laws sound cool, so just try to both go with the flow AND keep your boundaries a bit more.

Decide what YOUR plans are before you talk to them. In that case, the conversation will be more like "we decided we are going out to XYZ restaurant this year for Thanksgiving, we're really looking forward to it." If they say they want to come by, simply say - "great, I'll make a reservation for all of us for 6 PM. Just remember that since it's a holiday, you'll have to be on time or you'll miss eating with us. We are sitting down promptly at 6 because kiddies will be hungry by then and we need to get them to bed at a decent hour." Then just repeat as needed. Do not re-arrange your life for them. Invite them to join you and leave it at that. As far as a place to stay, find a nearby hotel that takes animals and ask if they want you to make a reservation for them.

Yes, they do appear to be clueless. They clearly don't know or don't remember how hard it is to have small children. Waiting for hours for them in a car somewhere is not fair to your children.

I would make plans that do not hinge upon anything they do. In other words, I would plan dinner for my little family at home. If they choose to come, great. If not, then that's OK too. Surely they can come somewhere closer to you so that perhaps your DH can pick them up and bring them to your house? It would be hard to be nice about this for me, but I would just tell them that your kids are young and it's pretty hard for them to wait that long for them. Therefore, they can come at their leisure and you will be waiting at home with the kids.

FOUR CATS in a truck? Oh my...I don't see how this is remotely possible....If they want to see you, it seems they have to compromise somewhere. It seems that you have given them a perfectly acceptable situation in the utility room idea....

Bottom line, you do what works for YOUR family. If they change plans, you don't let them change them a second time. You tell them unfortunately unless we go with original plan, we won't be able to get together.

You tell them you have little ones---they need to abide by plan or it won't work. Next time if they change plans at last min. you tell them you will see them next time and then plan something else. Never wait for flaky people--they have no idea how it is with 2 toddlers. Also, have a backup plan for if they dont come---Good luck~!

Try sittiing down when you are calm and re-read your own post. Try to read it as if you were one of us -- a stranger.

You end with:
"MIL is like a mother/ close friend to me. They're both great to us and our children. And they go above and beyond to be supportive of our life decisions. It's truly a blessing to have them in our life.:

That ending surprised me after the long description of how they are unreliable, don't ever come to your home when invited, etc.

So, can you possibly reverse your whole post, in your mind, and put your focus on those last few positive lines?

If you really DO love your MIL like you say, and if they are great to your children, you will need to accept that they are not, and possibly never will be, like "other" in-laws. They live in a truck. LIVE in a truck. With all the things that entails, like breakdowns and traffic issues and unreliable schedules. Is it ideal? No, not for you and your family. Should you just stop going to see them? Only if you want a rift and want these people whom -- at the end -- you say you love to be cut out of your lives.

If they lived in the same town and always refused to come over or were otherwise demanding etc., that would be different. But they live in a truck and they want to see you when they are in town -- you may not realize it, but you likely are their roots and their rock and their "hometown" in their minds. I agree, it is not considerate or thoughtful of them to fail to realize that with two very small kids it's not easy on you to haul everyone out to see them. But...you love them and they are a blessing and your MIL is like a mother/close friend. Your words.

Which will win? Your frustration at their lifestyle or your professed love and kinship with MIL?

Can you work on this? Can you and your husband -- it is really HIS job, they are his parents -- have a talk with them about their schedule and see if you can arrange visits that are planned farther in advance? Can you arrange visits where they stay in a nearby pet-friendly and trucker-friendly hotel? Such things do exist; they do not have to be under your roof to "stay" with you for several days. If you go out of your way to locate hotels where they can stay with their cats and park the truck, and can hook them up with those hotels and maybe even offer to pay part of the cost, think how much that would show them your affection and initiative and desire to see them.

I do agree that they ask a lot doing this over and over -- BUT it is every few months, right? Look at some of the Mamapedia posts about in-laws who live in the same town and who are nothing but demanding and nothing but critical. Be thankful that your in-laws are great folks and not living two streets away. So when they DO come into town -- maybe relax a little about it, and at the same time, take the situation in hand, talk with them about more scheduling than they do now, and try to find them accommodation so you can all be OK with the arrangements.

From now on, you tell your in-laws that they are welcome to stop at your home when they're in the area. Since plans are always so up in the air with them, don't count on anything they plan that's further away than 24 hours. Even then, it seems that you can't count on them to keep a solid plan.

So. Tell them "It would be great to see you, but traveling with two littles at a moment's notice/for long car rides isn't easy for us so it would be better if you drive by our house."

If they refuse to do that, and they expect you to drive to meet them, don't travel longer than 20-30 minutes one way and tell them to call you when they get to the meeting place so that you can pack the kids into the car. Make it sound like it's for their benefit.... "...so you can freshen up from the road and use the ladies room, grab a cat nap, etc."

It's time to stop bending over backwards. This sort of fussiness on their part isn't good for the children. Or your gas tank.

How did your F.I.L. Get a Job driving without a G.E.D.? You can get a C.D.L. with out a G.E.D. But Not A J>O>B>That is Not possible because No company would hire him without one. If He Works for himself as a driver He would need a brokers license, pretty hard to get one with out a G.E.D.. Why would you say that he did not even get a G.E.D? It is h*** o* drivers. I own a small trucking Company and know that the truckers want to be with there family on holidays.. I do not understand why? But they do and get mad if they can not get home on holidays. It is not always easy to get them where they need to be. The load has to be accommodating.. You should try to be understanding. The fact that he was not around for your husband that much as a kid may have more to do with his first wife then his son your husband.. If he wants to spend time with your family you enjoy the time and not be concerned with them not being on time or you having to changing plans. You should be HAPPY they made it!

I have a friend who is flaky like that. But I love her so I learned to make plans that work for me and my kids even if she is late or changes plans at the last minute.

For the most part, we meet at my house so if she's late or can't make it, I'm home and comfortable and not sitting in my car someplace or waiting at her house. Or we'd meet at a park where my kids can play and are happy til she and her kids come. This is inconvenient for my friend and she'll ask if I can come to her place. But I'm not willing to sit around and wait for hours, so this is what works for me.

Your in-laws sound like good people and I think it's wonderful that you are willing to work around their quirks in order to have a relationship with them. You're doing a good job looking out for your children's needs while doing what you can to stay connected to family. This should get easier as your kids get older, and hopefully you will find ways to be together that work for everyone.

This has nothing to do with their level of education, it's that they are clueless about raising kids. They don't realize how difficult these plans are for you with two toddlers and don't understand why you can't be spontaneous.
I realize that they can't just meet you at a restaurant because they can't take the rig there, and they need you to bring them, so telling them you'll meet them at Applebees at 5:30PM and if they're not there by 6:00, eating without them, is not an option. What I don't understand is why you would be waiting two hours at a truckstop. Don't they own a cell phone? Why can't they call to let you know that they are ready, so you can pack up the kids and go meet them when they arrive? Let them know that you can't take babies out to dinner at 8pm, so hubby can meet them alone if they come in late (they are HIS parents) or get a babysitter for the girls so you can join them for dinner too. When they ask why, just explain simply that babies can't be expected to sit in a car for two hours waiting, then sit down to dinner when it's already their bedtime, etc.

This post look very familiar. Did you post this last year too?

I think they should come to you, since you have kids. There's an unwritten rule in our family that everybody goes to the kids at the holidays. That way the kids don't have to be out of their routine and familiar surroundings. We don't usually travel during holidays. Now the only downside is that my family won't travel either so my kids don't know my side of the family very well. So we have to always spend holidays with my MIL because she lives 5 minutes away. The good news is we avoid holiday traffic and airports. My kids are happily playing today. One kid is flying a kite with Dad. The other two are playing Wii. I'm relaxing.

I would simply and politely say that to make your family's life a bit easier, it would be wonderful if they would come to your house because at this time, traveling with two small children is quite stressful. However, note that you do love visiting with them as do your children. If you can put your request out to them in a positive way, maybe they too will respond positively..

Also, not sure what your FIL's "formal" education level has to do with any of this .. You needn't be formally educated to have a clue..
Commonsense if commonsense. Either you have it or you don't.. formal education can't teach it to you.. I well imagine that his being a truck driver has given him an education that money can't buy...