My friend has a son and daughter. The boy just turned 8 and I have some concerns about him. Yes, so does the mom. I have known them for almost 3 years now and the boys behavior has only gotten worse. My son is almost 3. At first it was just that he was rough with his little sister. Then he started having tantrums regarding not wanting to ride the bus, not wanting to leave the playground, wanting to take a pool toy home, and wanted to bounce on an excersize ball that we have. In the last year, he says a lot of odd things like yesterday when I picked him up from school I was explaining what was going to happen for the rest of the day and he said "I want to sleep on the stairs and EAT COKE!". He says odd things like this a lot, like to get negative attention. Then he got really excited and explicit about ripping out barbies guts when his sister starting talking about barbie. When we got to our house he was deliberatly trying to make our 3 year old son cry by teasing him and not responding when he would say excuse me to the older boy. Then the older boy pushed or son 2 times because they both wanted the exercise ball. The first time I told the boy to please get me if there is a problem and not to push because that is what a bully does. The second time he pushed my son so hard that he literally flew across the floor and fell very badly and hurt himself. I reprimanded him strongly and told him to go stand in the corner. I spoke to the mom and she was receptive and sorry. The boy also felt bad. The boy gets extra help in school for his academics and they had him tested for ADD (negative). I don't think any of this is normal. I forgot to mention that he the last time he was over (he doesn't like cats) he was yelling at our cat repeatedly calling her a ":Filthy animal" (I told him that I respect his opinion but that hurts my feelings) and when he saw my son's new bed he started jumping on it and throwing his stuffed animals off aggressivly. Your thoughts???
The mom was upset by his pushing but says that all the boys talk gross and crazy like her son. When she spoke to the boy he told her that he wanted the ball and that my son was "annoying him" . She also said that she didn't tell him that we were coming and that threw him off. I don't believe that at all.
The boy has a father and he is very clear and stern with him. I never see these issues when the dad is around.
I had to respond to Martha who is usually an informed and welcome addition to this forum. Because I used the "N" word instead of "Typical" that somehow makes me not "like" this boy?? I do not like his behaviors. They have escalated and they concern me. I like and care about him and his family. That is why I am asking this question. Obviously the pushing is not "TYPICAL" l but I needed some feedback from other moms as to what would be "TYPICAL" for an 8 year old boy especially because the mom seemed to dismiss what I was saying with the exception of the physical violence. I am somewhat offended that the boy should not be at our house "For His Sake". Many moms would just dismiss him as a "bad boy" while I think there is something else going on. And FYI after the mom told me they took him to a psychologist for his "attention issues" and he was screened for ADD (her words) I recomended she see a neurodevelopmental pediatrician who could look at an overal picture of the boy (this was several weeks ago). As to what I plan to do next, I doubt that she will ask me to pick up her son from school for a while because she was embarrassed by his behavior. Thank you all for your valuable thoughts.
The kid sounds like he's spoiled rotten and has had no discipline in his life. It's like he's 2 and searching for attention. Why is he allowed to do all this stuff with no consequences? His mom and dad need to pull in the reigns.
He needs someone to talk to like a doctor. His parents really need to look into this. I would suggest this to the.
You do not like this boy. He does not need to be at your home or in your car, for his sake. Mom needs to find a more appropriate outlet for him. If he was evaluated at school, or by a pediatrician for ADD (an antequated term that is no longer used, so he was not appropriately evaluated by anyone) he is in great need of a full developmental evaluation. His psychiatric, medical, neurological, speech/langague, sensory, fine/gross motor, visual processing, behavioral, social, and educational satus should be fully evaluated privately by either a Developmental Pediatrician or a cafefully supervised combination of psychatric oversight for Neuropsychological-educational and ancellary evaluations.
Some of what you said is a dead give away for a child who has a very specific developmental pattern that needs intervention now, and while it is clearly very annoying to be around him, spending any time at all with adults who do not have compasion for what he more than likely can only supress for a few short hours at a time is counter productive for him.
Mom needs to find ways to set this boy up for more success until she can get him the therapy and medical care that he so clearly needs. I don't think he is successful at your home or in your car, and the more they practice being unscuccessful, the more unsucessful they are. Success breeds sucess. He needs some of that soon, and a compasionate and knowledgeble advocate.
M.
PS:the word you are searching for is "typical." All children are normal.
Allright-I really don't want to get into WHAT could be the boys problem but he definitely has one. What I do want to tell you is to please keep him away from your children and out of your house. Seriously...your friendship with this woman is not at all worth your kid's well being. You call her and say that you are so sorry and that you feel terrible but after carefu consideration you just cannot have their son over anymore or mixing with your family at all. Say that you value her friendship very much but as a mom your first obligation is to your family. You will understand completely if she is too hurt to continue the friendship. I would also urge her at that time to get some help for her son.
Bottom line-never ever ever do for others when it comes at the expense of your family's well being. They are your first priority. You are actually being negligent in my opinion if you knowingly put your son in a situation with a known abuser-no matter what age.
Sounds like he has some issues that need to be treated by a mental health professional. I mean, if this boy is a terror now, imagine what he will be like when he's 16, 6 feet tall, and 180 pounds!!! Usually, kids with mental disorders do not improve as they grow up...they get worse.
Boys like this need to learn good coping skills NOW. If your friend waits, it will be all the harder to "unlearn" these bad behaviors and replace them with good behaviors. I would suggest that she have him evaluated. Most medical plans cover this.
It is worth it to have him checked out. It may save her a lot of trouble down the road.
http://keystosimpleliving.com/
If his behavior is only getting worse (and if he's picking on my kids) I don't care what kind of attention he wants - he doesn't get to pick on my kids (or my pets).
Tell him (and his mother) if he can't be nice you're not going to see him anymore. One more strike and he's out.
Actually it seems he's past that point already. He's been warned and he doesn't care, or he does care for a few minutes then he's right back to doing it again.
He may not be able to control himself - personally I don't care - that still doesn't mean he gets to pick on anyone, make them cry, threaten pets, eviscerate dolls, etc.
Friendships are nice but when friendship collides with the welfare of my kids - my kids win every time. I feel sorry for his mother, but what ever his problem is - you can't fix it. Just protect your kids from him. No more play dates or car pooling with him.
Additional:
My son never acted like that at any age. From your What Happened, it sounds like your friend is begging to break off the friendship but doesn't have the guts to say so directly. Making excuses/whinning is lame.
It's still not your problem. Just make a clean break of it and protect your kids.
Nothing about his behavior screams "mental illness" to me, but it does scream lack of discipline and, perhaps, attention.
While I think it is unrealistic to expect an 8 yo boy (and I have O.) to consistently tolerate a non-sibling 3 y.o. as a playmate, I will say that the 8 y.o. boys I know (my son and his friends) tolerate little ones pretty well.
I think you are within your rights to request that the mom understand that he needs to follow your rules in your house when he is there.
BUT, I think this is an issue for his parents to investigate if there is something more going on. He sounds a bit on the "spoiled" side to me...
Some folks are saying, more discipline, more punishment, but it sounds like he is past that helping him. The phrase "lack of impulse control" ran through my head when I read this. The repeated yelling of certain words at an animal, the odd statements and word choices, etc. might indicate some kind of developmental or mental issue that needs professional intervention. I am not ever quick to say "get a diagnosis" because kids often are over-diagnosed these days and every little issue becomes a medical thing, but he sounds in need of help. Most kids find it funny to say random, goofy things, but he sounds like he may be doing more than just finding it gets the adults' negative attention.
Especially since the mom seems receptive and aware he's not behaving like an 8-year-old, talk to her kindly about getting him professional help as soon as possible. If she feels overwhelmed and doesn't know where to start, she can try the school counselor and ask for referrals, and/or their pediatrician. But waiting could end up making him more difficult to handle. As for you -- you are great to be helping them out with pickups etc. and you may be a stabilizing force for him whether you know it or not. If you must continue to have him in your home at all, I'd keep him away from the 3-year-old entirely -- as in, not even in the same room -- and be sure you are where you can see and hear the 8-year-old at all times so he doesn't seek out the other kids. I hate to say isolate a child, but his pushing your son was way out of line and likely could escalate.
Sweetly and gently encourage the mother to seek out help for her son. At this age he can be helped, but it will harder as he gets older. If she refuses then stop having him around your children, you need to protect them.
if you're going to ask a question like this, you need to be prepared for all kinds of responses. So don't get all defensive when someone calls you out on something you wrote, such as "not normal" vs. "typical." You don't need to mock the woman who took valuable time to make some very good points to help your plea.
I agree that this isn't typical behavior of an 8 year old but have no idea how I'd handle this if a friend of mine had a child like this. It would be very difficult for me to suggest things since I wouldn't want to upset her. So to be quite honest, I think I'd just step away from the family for awhile if his behavior makes you uncomfortable (which it would make ME uncomfortable also) and see what happens.
I know you want to be a good friend and it sounds like you're a very caring person, which is wonderful, however it's so hard when we see a friends child having "issues." I've been through similar experiences and have always chosen to just keep my trap shut for fear of upsetting a friend who is quite possible, already upset about the whole thing.
Good luck,
Lynsey
Maybe he just needs more love and positive influence and reinforcement...
nope, not normal behavior. It sounds like he is acting out for any kind of attention. i think counseling at a minimum and possibly there is something more. But for you, I would limit the time your son spends with him.
I have a seven year old son and he would never act like this for a friend and if he did serious, serious consequences. and while, yes, boys of that age do love the "gross" language it is usually centered around poop, bug guts, bones and mud from what I have heard.
I agree that there is a serious lack of discipline and follow through on part of mom and that is translating to disrespectful attitudes to other adult women in authority figures.
Hand your friend the book, Kid CEO. Helps put it all in perspective!!
I would also start asking your friend what levels of discipline and punishment (consequences for actions, not spanking) she is comfortable you enacting whild child is in your care.
Honestly, the kid sounds a little "off" if you know what I mean. . .
This does not sound normal. It also does not sound like typical attention-getting negative behavior. While some of it may be in his control, he can hardly control his odd thoughts (he is still a young boy!!), and they do not sound normal at all. I would be very cautious with him around you and your children.
Sounds like he needs all the help he can get. Explain to your children why he needs extra patience (this doesn't excuse his behavior, but it can help YOUR children cope with it!). I would let the mother know what is happening in a non-accusing, gentle manner, and let her know you are there to help support her. She needs to know what is happening, and that you are concerned for her son. Hopefully you will help encourage her to seek help for her son.
Sounds like he has found a niche - he gets attention - doesn't matter if it's negative or not - he gets attention for his behavior.
If another child pushes my child to the ground - they won't be playing with my child - my boys are Tae Kwon Do black and red belts - they don't take to people pushing them - they will defend themselves if necessary.
Mom doesn't step up to the plate and tell him this is NOT acceptable - and let's him get his way to keep him from having a tantrum. If this is NOT the case - he should be evaluated by a child psychologist to see if there are some mental health issues he is having.
IF he is getting IED help (extra help) in school - they have determined an issue - and someone is not being honest with you. They don't just give kids "extra help" in school...sorry - tests have to be run and such - especially in public schools.
I would tell the boy that even though he doesn't like cats - YOU do and he WILL respect your animals and your property. if he cannot do that - he will NOT be invited back to your house. AND MEAN IT. You have a level of expectations - IF he cannot meet that level - then he cannot be welcomed into your home. PERIOD. No, welllllllll,,, okay this one time - this will lead to more bad behavior. STAND UP FOR YOURSELF AND YOUR FAMILY. This boy needs to have boundaries and limits with consequences for those actions...whether he is your son or not - he is in your home - he must abide by YOUR RULES.
Just FYI, my son is almost 8 and I have a 3 year old as well. My son NEVER acts like that and plays very politely with our 3 year old. The behavior you are describing is super aggressive. Personally, I would never have him at my house again. It just wouldn't work for me.
Good luck!
L.
Please ask his mom to have a full neurodevelopmental evaluation done. I was told for several years by my pediatrician that my son did NOT have ADHD, but I still thought something was not right. He is 5 and still throws tantrums like his 2 yo sister. The boy you described above has a lot of tendencies my son does. We did see a neurodevelopmental pediatrician and he was diagnosed. My son does not need medication, but is going for OT and behavioral therapy. Also the developmental specialist did recommend swinging and bouncing on an exercise ball as outlet means, so maybe this kids knows something he needs without even realizing it.
I'm not sure where to start. I think this child needs further evaluation since 8 is getting too old for most of the behavior you describe. Even if he doesn't exactly fit an ADD/ADHD diagnosis it seems like there is something going on that needs to be addressed. Also, different clinicians can have different opinions. Hackensack University Hospital has a good program for sorting out these issues (email me if you want the specifics) but there is probably a similar program in the Morristown area. An evaluation by a developmental pediatrician is a good starting point.
I can easily identify with this child's mom since my son is also a handful but younger (just turned 5). I worked in the mental health field doing case work and family counseling. I dealt with lots of other kids with various behavior problems and it never wore me out the way parenting my high energy little boy does. I've been reading up and gross talk, pretend violence, heros/bad guys play are all in the fairly normal range. The physical aggressiveness is concerning. The comment about "coke" depends entirely whether he was talking about soda or drugs (you would have to ask him). Although a child with his issues would probably be better avoiding all the sugar and caffeine anyway. Having a high energy, impulsive kid is a lot of work and sometimes the discipline methods that work with most kids don't work that well. If the mom is open to family counseling that may be a way she can get some support and new behavior management techniques. I got a lot of good ideas from the book "Setting Limits with Your Strong Willed Child."
I could definitely understand why you might not want this kid around your younger child. But if you have in in your heart to stay friends with the mom she could probably use a friend.
Nope. Not normal 8 year old boy behavior. Definitely sounds like there is much more going on. For your children's sake, I would limit the time you spend with them.
Just my two cents,
R.
Distance yourself from this family until they get help for their son. Any child that wants to torture small children and aninmals is deeply disturbed and needs immediate help. I'm sure I don't need to tell you what a single head injury as a result of being shoved can do.
Is the boys father in his life? It seems like he is at the age where he needs some serious positive male attention. I healthy and good suited role model to mimic. I bet its really hard to deal with such a difficult child but at this age it seems like there is an underlying issue. The child obviously needs help because this type of behaviour will only get worse if it is left to be brushed off as just a phase.
Good Luck
You really need to talk with your friend. Something is definately wrong and the child needs psycholigical help ASAP. Children do not go around talking about doing drugs unless they've see it somewhere. It may not be at his home. It could be at school or from a baby sitter. This is serious stuff and you don't want anyone getting hurt. One of my cousins was like that growning up. He'd break things and even tried to set my nephew on fire! My Aunt just said he was facinated by fire and was diagnosed as hyper-active. My cousin's an adult and guess what? He does drugs and can't hold on to a job to save his life.
My advice? Don't EVER leave him alone with your child. I have a nephew like this and I totally don't trust his behavior around my kid. I would try not to hang around these people. Good luck.
