(Big deep breath!!) I got a phone call from the after school program that went like this. This is Leslie Sylvan from the afterschool program you need to pick up your son!. (click!) What I thought?? So I called the number back, got no answer. I called my husband asked if he could meet me to pick up our son sounded important enough for both of us to be there. Well then mean while the after school director Leslie called back and asked did you call? I said well yeah, is my son ok??? No he is not, his behavior is unacceptable and you just need to come pick him up. We will talk when you get here. Ok I replied.
My kindergartener told us that he spit on another child as they walked past him. (later I learned that this child was being mean to him.) He got in trouble for it, and had to apologize to the child and their parent. ( which I am so very okay with what they made him do) While he was in trouble with the teacher behind the desk he decided to push the chair in an angry way (not clear how he did it) she also stated that he was defiant with the conversation she was trying to have, and was throwing himself up against the wall. All of the statements she made did not seem to surprise me of his behavior expect the throwing himself up against the wall. I did not even bring that up to her, because it just was not right to. It was apparent she was extremely frustrated with our child. We are willing out an Behavior Improvement Contract for him. He has to acknowledge his bad behavior, what he is going to do to not
be that way, and what punishment HE thinks he should have for the bad behavior.
My husband and I are completely frustrated and at our wits end. At dinner last night our son was trying to talk to us about something to distract our being angry. I looked directly at him and said, you are not allowed to talk to me, I don’t like the way you acted today and I am disappointed. He did not know what to say, and was taken back. We had a planned event for our older child that we went to, but Grandma kept our 5 year old. When picking him up she told me he wants a picture of his family in his back pack so when he is sad he can look at it. I told my mom don’t let him play your heart strings. As we left she said he is just a child, and I think you need him to talk to someone. I have!! The doctor told us that he is child who wants all the attention, and when he don’t get what he wants when he wants it he throws fits. The doctor said he shows signs of ADHD, but still too young. She stated he is just a boy.
What’s my question?? Help I don’t know what to do anymore. We use rewards for good days. In the classroom he has a chart with good happy face and bad sad face for when he is good and bad in class. We have a special toy he gets to play with at home when he is good. We constantly give praise for when he makes a good choice. We don’t let him do something if he makes a bad choice. There has been many times that I have made him sit next to me while I am cooking dinner because he did or said something that was not right. For instance he pushed his little sister so he could get to the front door first. Is there a cure for “wanting what he wants when he wants it???”
I don't think my actions of tell my 5 yr old son that I was very angry with him and could not talk to him. I did not ignore him, if it was something we had to speak about dinner, like if he wanted more food, drink, worked on his reading homework. We talked, I just was not going to let him talk about other stuff that night. The teacher who is a behavior teacher, suggested us to overly make things uncomfortable for him. To make a point of how important it was he not act like that, the teacher stated she thought he was going to hurt himself. I think that point was taken for him. I did copy a picture of our family photo and placed it in a plastic sleve for him to put in his back pack. When I handed it to him, he smiled from ear to ear and said thank you mommy. This morning he asked me how is is supposed to put that big sheet in his pocket. I just smiled to myself and said we will fix that afterschool.
I'm only going to address one issue. Where you say you make him sit right next to you while you cook. Attention is attention...good or bad, it is attention. Sitting next to you is attention. I would suggest making him sit somewhere by himself, no TV, no stimulation. A time out spot. Then on days where he's been good, have him come in while you cook as a reward. Besides, he needs to learn to cook anyway!
Staying mad at your child for the entire night and not talking to him because of his behavior earlier in the day doesn't make sense to your child. And, to be honest, it doesn't make sense to me either. Did he make a bad choice earlier in the day? Yeah. Does making that bad choice make him not part of the family? It seems like that is what it is coming across to him as. You have been told that he is a child who wants attention. Could it be that he feels loved by attention from you (and not by the toy, or the chart, or words of praise). He wants your TIME and attention. That may be how he spells love. Which means the punishment of sitting right by you while you make dinner is backfiring on you. If he has to be right by you, then he's getting at least some attention from you.
Every child is different -- and they all "want what they want when they want it". With this child you just need to figure out what will motivate him to be willing to delay gratification. And be very careful that as you discipline that he still feels loved -- not just saying that you love him, but that he actually feels loved.
I think your mom is absolutely right. He is just a small child. And children need attention, they get frustrated, they get mad - so do adults. He is supposed to want what he wants when he wants it. We all do. We just all learn tools that help us cope and gain impulse control as we mature.
It has helped my son to have tools to use when he is mad. He can use his words, he can walk away and stomp his feet, he can ask for a hug. He cannot hit. And yes, I will give him a hug when he is angry - I think it's important that he know he is lovable even when he feels his worst.
I am so happy my son is in a kindergarten with a non-punitive approach. Yesterday he had a fight with his best friend. Apparently they had a physical pushing, shoving, knocking down fight (first ever for both of them). When I got there at the end of the day to pick him up, the teacher told me 'DS and X got into a fight today'. I asked if they were still friends. She said yes, she sat down with them and they talked through it and they are fine but she thought I should know in case my son mentioned it.
She did not call the parents to have them pick the kids up (teachers should be able to handle five year olds fighting, they are not teenagers with weapons), she did not punish them. The two kids had a fight, they talked, they came up with their own solution and they are friends still.
Having a picture of his family to look at when he is sad is something my son has at his school. I think it is a perfectly legitimate thing your son requested and not at all manipulative.
Actually, he sounds fairly normal. All 5 year olds want what they want when they want it. So do most children and many adults. What needs to change is how he acts when he doesn't get what he wants.
The first thing that struck me was his request for a picture of his family. This is not playing heart strings. It's a legitimate request which can be used to help him control his behavior. Feeling sad is one cause of acting out. When he's sad, he can look at the picture which will remind him of the love within his family and the rules. It could be like Mom encouraging him to be good with the picture of her smile. It reminds him he's loved.
My granddaughter's kindergarten teacher asked parents to give their child a picture of mom and dad. It's a proven technique for managing behavior.
I suggest that the school may have handled this poorly. First, the fact that they hung up without telling you what was going on tells me that they were too emotionally involved in the situation. I also see that they continued with discipline after having completed discipline. He apologized to the child and his parents. It's over at this point Why did he have to stay behind the desk? Why did the teacher try to talk to him some more about an incident that was over. Why did the teacher insist on talking with him when he was obviously too upset to have a conversation?
He may have been acting out still but the more he's pushed the more he's going to push back. In many situations it's best to allow the child to deal with their feelings without intervention other than to separate him from the situation which is making him angry.
The after school program that my grandchildren attended had a quiet corner with a bean bag chair and books. The kids could go to the corner until they'd calmed down.
I suggest that the after school person was trying too hard to change him instead of trying to help him deal with his feelings. Take a look at how you're handling it also. I suggest that instead of bringing the situation to dinner with you feeling angry, that the situation is over and you need to let it drop. I suggest he was over disciplined for the initial behavior. When the adults don't drop the lectures the child feels he can never do anything right so why try. He feels defeated. He wasn't allowed to have learned that an apology is the right thing to do. His apology is overshadowed by the continuing focus on him by the adults.
First try to find a way to discipline without being angry yourself. It is normal for your son to react in anger to your anger. Yes, you're reacting in anger to his anger but you're the adult and need to learn how to manage your own anger before expecting him to manage his.
I suggest you need to get discipline out of the realm of emotions and into a matter of fact, this is the way we behave and this is what will happen when we don't way. No anger on the parents/adults part.
Put away the idea that he's playing on people's heart strings. He is just 5 years old and needs to learn how to behave. He also need his feelings recognized and be taught a way to manage them. He needs to know he's loved. He does not feel loved when you're angry with him. And it sounds like you're angry with him a lot.
You cannot acknowledge his feelings nor teach him how to manage his anger when you're angry. I understand your frustration. I have 2 grandchildren who have been diagnosed with ADHD. The family has been in therapy to learn how to accept and deal with feelings. I suggest that this might help you with your frustrations and help your son learn how to behave better.
Viola,
I really feel for you. Based on the questions you have been asking lately it's clear that you are completely overwhelmed and need some real help.
Please seek out some parenting classes and/or support in your area. See if you can get your son in to see a behavioral therapist. Start at school, they usually have a psychologist on staff that your son could see at no cost.
If you don't get some help his behavior problems will only get worse. It would also help to check out a few child development books from the library. In addition to parenting classes these books can help you understand where your child is at and what methods of discipline are most effective.
I think you handled it very well. You were honest, you got his attention and it sunk in. It had to be stated bluntly, because obviously otherwise he just does not seem to understand his behaviors are HIS. He does not get subtle.
Yes, he is in a defiant stage and so ALL of the adults in his life need to make sure he knows he cannot get away with ANYTHING. It is the loving thing to do. Nip it in the bud now, so it is not when he gets in real trouble you are wondering what to do.
Children NEED this type of direction and attention.. They do not even realize it, but they are just testing.
So keep an eye on him. When he is good, when he keeps it together, when you see him control himself. Mention to him in a positive manner.
"I sure do like how you sat right down." "Thank you for holding my hand while we walk through the store." "Wow, you were a big help getting your jacket and boots on."
"You are a great helper when you carry that bag for me." "I like how you said goodbye to your friends so nicely. " "Nice manners!"
The last thing is for you and your husband to model good behaviors. You are going to feel foolish putting words to it, but your son needs tohe auditory and the visual of behaviors..
You drop and break something. "Oh no! I dropped the glass. How frustrating! I need to get the broom and sweep it. I did not mean to do it, but it was just an accident."
You are running late. "Yikes, I am off of my schedule. I cannot be late. I better move faster. I need your help. Please put your own jacket on and meet me by the front door. I should not have dilly dallied around. I have made myself late."
You forgot to purchase something at the store. "Ugh, I forgot to buy milk at the store! That was the main reason I went. I guess I just forgot. Well I am going to write it down so next time I will not forget.. Not a big deal, we all forget sometimes,"
You are angry because of the weather. "Wow, it is raining? I am so frustrated, I was going to do some work out in the yard. Now my plans have to all be changed. Well there are other things I can do instead, but I am still disappointed and kind of frustrated. "
He needs to see, hear and then see how you all handle these situations. He needs to know "you do not hit or spit at dad when you get upset, because it would hurt dads feelings. Dad would never spit at your son, because it would hurt sons feelings and so son should never spit at a classmate, because it will hurt his feelings. "
"We listen to the teacher, because she needs us to behave at school so we can learn. "
I know it sound like a lot of time, but better to take the time now while he is still young enough to control , rather than later when he is bigger than you.
I think you are overacting here a bit. Forgive me, but you should be on your child's side always, no matter what. I never, never, never discipline or shame my children at school no matter what their crime. I calmly listen to teachers, say MY apologies and then tell then that I would talk to my child at home and will get back to them. There is always another side to a story.
In the case you describing you wrote that it appeared to you that the teacher was very frustrated with your child. Do you think it is easy for your child to interact politely and respectively with an adult who has poor control of her own feelings?
Your child is impulsive, angry, has poor self control and wears his heart on his sleeve - normal kindergartner if you ask me. He is trying to make amends by talking to you about something else during dinner, he thought you are done being angry, he apologized, after all. You are pushing him away. Not a good strategy. Any mistake the child makes should include the discussion about Why it happened, What was he feeling, How to make it better next time, and follow up with people involved.
Ask your child if he likes the teacher in question and, most important, WHY? That should open your eyes a bit. Some teachers are boring, have poor control of the classroom and very preferential in their treatment of children. Kids sense that and pay them back with the only thing they can- bad behavior.
Small kids do make bad choices all the time. They have no experience, they weren't born with a manual of proper behavior. They learn from their mistakes. Help him learn and not to feel bad about himself.
And, yes, he is a boy, I have two of them and yes, they can be aggressive but in my experience there is ALWAYS a reason for that whether real or perceived by the boy.
This is interesting but I wrote my response first and then read all the other responses and many people picked up on the same thing - that you seem to demand way more than this child is able to give at his developmental level. And I am a strict and very involved parent myself so you cannot tell me I am a permissive mother with rosy colored glasses. If you push to hard - the child will shut down and lash out. It is very harmful to him. LOVE him while CORRECTING his behavior - that is what you suppose to do and not depriving him of love and family interaction as punishment for his behavior.
Good luck with this.
I have read some of your previous posts to get a sense of what your son's issues may be. What I read is pretty troubling. I realize you can't give us all the details around this issue, but your son sounds genuinely unhappy, and harsh family dynamics could be part of the reason why.
If he's acting out because he's anxious, afraid, or feels unloved or misunderstood, which is what my question was just after reading your request above, then the changes that need to happen go deeper than just his behavior. It sounds like he gets hit with a belt when he has potty accidents, and treated as if he should be more in control of his feelings when he acts out.
Perhaps he "should" be able to control his feelings better. I'm pretty sure his behavior is distressing to you and his father. And it's possible that your behavior toward him is only making things worse. What happy child is not given a right to speak up in his own defense? What happy child gets continuous punishment into the evening for misbehavior earlier in the day? What would be the point of even trying to be 'good'? What child, or adult for that matter, can be taught not to "want what he wants when he wants it?" You want him to behave, and to do it now, right? So you also want what you want when you want it. All parents do. And most parents understand that a 5yo child is only beginning to learn that kind of impulse control.
Please, Viola, get some family counseling. There's something really troubling and sad going on in your family. I wonder if your husband is driving this frustration you feel toward your son, and you're afraid of being hit, too. If that's the case, seek help from a women's shelter. Your son is not a monster. He's a little boy who needs help, love and understanding. Beatings from Dad are obviously not moving things in a healthy direction.
I would not express such strong feelings if I didn't see several white flags in your previous posts.
I think you are mistaking him trying to play heart strings here. He is having a hard time with life, and saying he wants a picture of his family while he is not with you is a GOOD thing.
All children want what they want when they want it. They have to be taught over and over and over that it doesn't work that way. WIth love, with firmness, and with understanding. Your son has some issues and just because you don't like it, doesn't take away his issues.
Children are complicated. Accept that and understand that just "talking" to someone isn't all it takes to help the child. Talking isn't enough. Ask the doctor for concrete advise other than "he's too young for ADHD".
A play therapist might help. She could go to the school program and observe him, and come to your home to observe YOU with him. Talk to her about exactly what you do. Don't mince words - tell her all your frustrated feelings. You should listen to what she says, even if she tells you something you don't necessarily like.
Your son IS a boy. Boys can be hard. They can have difficult temperments. They can be impulsive. But they need love and tenderness just like girls do. Above all, they need help when they can't handle themselves.
It won't be long before he won't be caught dead looking at a picture of his family at school in front of anyone, or even want one in his backpack. Try to understand this when you are mad at him for having to go pick him up at school.
Dawn
That statement about wanting a picture of his family actually pulled at my heart strings!! I don't think he's playing you, I think he's calling out for some love and attention. Not allowing him to talk to you seems a bit harsh, as mad as I get at my children's behavior I never want them to feel like I'm pushing them away. Especially when this was later at night, he needs to know you support him and are trying to understand what he's going through. There may be reasons he's acting out at school and you need to find out why to try to correct the behavior, reward him appropriately for good behavior and have consequences for bad behavior. I know it's hard to hold back anger when you're angry, but I think if you can be firm but still loving, he may start to react more postively.
I have a K age son too and I see similar kinds of behavior. It can be so frustrating! I have done the same thing and said "I am too mad to talk to you right now--talk to me later." I don't think what you did was wrong, it just needs to be balanced out with positive attention soon. After a bad day do give him a hug and make sure you can find something positive to say by the end of the day. BTW, my mom (who is usually good with my kids) also takes my son's side when I get mad at him--I figure that is her job as a grandma to be sympathetic but I am the parent and sometimes have to be firm with the discipline. I think that we balance each other out.
first of all i'm assuming your son is 5 or 6 if hes in kindergarten. With that being said he IS NOT too you for any kind of treatment (medication). By the sounds of the way he is acting, which is what my 8yr old daughter did when she was that age, he could be ADHD & ODD. It got real bad before it got better. She is now on risperdol & straterra. We also had intensive in home therapy for a yr and a half where the counselours came to the home, also known as a wrap around program. Try anything and everything out there til you get the the results that you want and the help he needs.
As for the grandmother "Boys will be boys." is total bs. I had/have the same problem with my mil, whom lives with us, she babies the kids when they get in trouble. its been an ongoing fight for years that i don't think will ever end.She undermines us but, that is another topic.
hope things out for you.
