Is This Friendship Normal or Pathologic?

this is a false equivalency for starters. there's a HUGE spectrum of 'normal' friendships, and a vanishing small number of 'pathologic' ones among 7 year olds.

i think your son and leo have a pretty normal friendship, despite leo's clinginess. some kids are needier than others.

i see much more of the 'pathologic' in your micromanaging of the friendship. sleepless nights? really?

i ALWAYS cried when sleepovers with my bestie ended. i remember my mother exasperatedly promising we wouldn't have any more sleepovers if it kept happening, but she actually got it- at that age it was just hard for the fun to end. a few tears among 7 years olds does not equal pathological.

i absolutely agree with you encouraging your son to widen his friendship circle, and not to get too intensely one on one with young leo. but it sounds like what you really want is for him to cut ties altogether. that goes against your stated purpose for your son to demonstrate kindness, and to play with everyone.

it's also not unusual for kids to go through phases of intense closeness with another kid, where they just want to play with each other.

i find it a little ironic that you refer to leo's parents as 'the ultimate helicopter parents' when you're losing sleep and requesting class placements in order to manage your own child's schoolyard friendships.
khairete
S.

Frustrating! I just lost my whole answer!

I was going to say - in a nutshell

1 - kids often had meltdowns here in kindergarten when leaving playdates. I gave plenty of notice. It wasn't sadness but disappointment that the fun was ending.

2 - my kids have all played with one kid at some point or another. Fairly common throughout childhood. Usually a phase.

3 - Did you ever talk to his mom?

4 - some anxiety is common with some kindergarten kids (up to grade 1). There's a developmental leap at age 7. I think Leo had some (tummy aches, crying).

5 - Empathy is great. Pity, obligation - not. I don't get the sense Leo was pressuring your son. If your son just liked Leo and playing with him, that's fine. If it's pity, that's not ok.

6 - Friendships are only 'bad' if your son is suddenly acting out or not happy. Then it's not a 'good fit' and you deal with it. I don't get the sense of that here. That's pretty uncommon and the school would let you know if they saw signs of it typically.

7 - it's ok to have a bestie, and you just encourage other friendships outside of it.

8 - Your son needs to learn how to have this balance. Extremes, like cutting off ties, prevents him from learning how to handle it. It's like avoiding it.

So you're not actually helping him in the long run.

I wouldn't worry about next year. If it gets bad, you can always talk to the school. They deal with this stuff (i.e. if Leo is having a hard time). If your son plays with him all the time, and you are worried your son is shucking off is friends, then that's just an ongoing conversation you have with your son about friendships. Say "How do you think Joey feels that you don't spend time playing tag with him and the other boys?" and listen (really understand where your son is coming from). Then you can role play.

I wiuld not interfere with the friendship - but i would slso make a point to set up playdates with a variety of kids this summer and once school starts. That way your son can play one-on-one with the other child when he chooses to (eg, at recess at school) but also keep developing othet friendships.

Hi P.,

First of all, I suggest you change the children's names to pseudonyms (put them in quotes the first time so we know, and so that predators who troll sites like this know these are not real names) or use A, B, and C. It's not safe to have kids' real names on an anonymous internet forum. I'm going to use A for your son, B for the emotional friend, and C for the new friend so that my answer doesn't contain their real names and you can edit your question.

It sounds like your son is a caretaker type, and while some of that is a good thing, it's really not healthy if it interferes with his lifestyle. Some kids are introverts and don't do well in groups, and Child B may be one of those. It's way too early to know if he will stay that way or if this is developmental and he will gain confidence over time. Once your son wasn't in his class, B latched onto Child C. Your son, A, seems to do well in larger groups but seems to feel an obligation to hang out with B when C is absent.

What concerns me here are two things: the boys were crying over the ending of playdates, and I'm not clear from your post whether you stopped the playing entirely because of the dependence you saw developing. I wonder if it was necessary to end them entirely, or if it would have worked to help your child branch out while not entirely abandoning B. The other problem is that you had sleepless nights over this, and I wonder if some of that intensity rubbed off on or influenced the children. We all do the best we can for our kids, and of course we intervene if something is really damaging, but this whole things sounds far more tearful

If, by 2nd grade, Child B is still crying a lot, it's time for the parents and the school to work together to give him some social skills. It's also important to help your own son develop coping skills in managing his social relationships, to encourage him to speak up, etc. He can invite B to play with the whole group, but it's okay to tell him he may be encouraging B's crying by giving in to it. While I understand why you moved your child to another class, and why Child C's parents are doing the same, that's not a workable long-term strategy within the school. Even so, your child feels the need to go help out B if C is absent, so separate classes aren't foolproof.

I think it's too soon to label a child as having a pathological personality or friendship, when in fact they may just be young and still learning to navigate these things.

You are overthinking this. Your son is only 7. Relax and let him play with his friends as he chooses.

You say "Of course, Eddie's parents have requested that their son separate from Leo in 2nd grade." I honestly feel after reading this that you are bad-mouthing this child to other parents so that they bolster your opinion against this child. If you are doing this, it's wrong of you. Are all the parents you gossip about this to supposed to tell the school they don't want their kids in the same class as Leo?

Re-read Margie's comments. You can NOT like how his parents parent him, but you shouldn't be taking it out on this child in hopes that other parents won't let their kids play with him.

Your son is a sweet boy who cares about other people. He should be commended for his caring nature, wanting to play with Leo because has has no one else when his bestie is out sick.

The guidance counselor is who you should be talking to - not the other parents. And then you take a step back. The school isn't supposed to talk about children to people other than their parents. You can talk about what happened, and then let it go.

Suz t. is correct. Your judgment of others is blinding you to your own realities. Not being able to sleep because your son has empathy toward others? Really? Uh. Oookay...exaggerate much? Sorry, but you sound paranoid, considering how harmless this all is. I'd be glad to know my child is so considerate of others and their feelings. Perhaps Leo is lonely, maybe he is an only child and his parents aren't around much, so he is seeing Adam as the only source of attention and friendship in his life They are only 7, and kids at that age are still unsure about how to control emotions, and can become clingy. Leo might also have some sort of disorder (like autism spectrum) that makes him even more needy and sensitive than other kids, he might also be very shy and introverted and struggles with friendships in large groups.

Margie G. is someone else whose comment I agree with. I think it is sad that you want to take away his only source of friendship from him. Instead, you should be encouraging your son to keep playing with Leo and include Eddie and other friends too, so Leo can make some additional friends. I'd be very hurt and depressed if a parent told my best friend he can no longer be my friend, no matter what excuse they give me. Put yourself in this kid's shoes -- his closest friend is being pulled away from him by no other reason but paranoid parents.

I would completely support your decision to separate the kids if he had shown violent tendencies, teased your son, spoke to him about drugs or other subjects that you feel are a bad influence, but two kids being sad about being separated? Harmless. And then we wonder why bullying and school violence is so rampant, because we exclude and teach kids to do that as well when we find ourselves outside of our comfort zone. We should be teaching our kids to be kind and inclusive to each other, and how to include several friends and get them all to play nice, not to ostracize others who behave differently than we'd like.

I thinks it's too soon to worry about what dynamic "may" happen in September. That's a long ways away, and a millions things could change between now and then. Kids grow and change themselves. Maybe Leo will find a new bestie. Maybe he will be close with your son again, but start to branch out as well. Your son sounds like he is doing great. I would relax and let him play with whomever he wants. Don't try to keep him away from Leo as long as he is treating him nicely and they enjoy playing together. You should keep in mind that at 10, 12, or 15, Leo could be a great friend and absolutely nothing like his "little boy" self. Or he could still prefer hanging with smaller groups or with one friend at a time, but also be a great friend who handles his personality and preferences with a lot more maturity. It's not a bad thing to have some friends who are into the bigger group and some that aren't so much. As long as your son doesn't feel pressured to "not play with anyone else" I would not worry. If that does happen, you can coach him into being more inclusive at school and encourage him to invite other friends over to your house and out to do things outside of school.

I suggest you talk with the school counselor. If she hasn't noticed this, she will observe, talk with teachers, possibly talk with the boys. She also has knowledge and experience that may help both you and your son.

When my daughter was in 3rd or 4th grade, the school counselor told me she would like my daughter join the couselor's Friendship Group because my daughter was outgoing and made friends easily. The counselor formed the group to help kids with social skills. Something like this might help both boys.

Why can't Eddie and Adam be in the same class and away from Leo?
Your son should play with lots of different friends - it's a matter of not caving in when Leo demands to be exclusive.
Get your son involved in after school activities - he'll make more friends outside of school and have less time for Leo.
Maybe Leo will mature a bit and out grow needing one friend only all the time - just make sure your kid is busy and not available a lot of the time.
It would be good for Leo to have some of his own activities too.

Additional:
While most of the time letting friendships develop naturally is all good and well - being sucked into a smothering friendship isn't good for your child.
It's true you can't control the other kid - but it's fine to steer YOUR child away from situations that's harmful to your own child.
The kids are a little older now.
Soon play dates will be off the table.
It's not your job - or your son's job - to fix this other kid.
I don't think you've badmouthed anything about this friend - simply another boy has had the same issue with this boy as you have and they are seeking the same remedy.

Leave it to Leo's parents to raise Leo.
If he needs counseling - it's up to them to get it done.
If your kid is having trouble with a clingy vine friend then it's perfectly fine to limit how much time they spend together.

I would not label it pathological. I think this is harder on you than your son.

Interesting, it appears to me that Leo has emotional issues and is negative influence on your son and others. 7 year old boys crying at the end of play dates is a red flag, absurd really. Leo could have issues going on at home but using the other boys as an outlet to express this. Go with your instinct. This is not normal.

P.,

Welcome to mamapedia.

Your son is SEVEN years old, not seventeen. please take a step back and stop over analyzing it. This is NO WHERE NEAR pathological!

Your son is showing compassion for Leo when his friend is not available. Your son, can and should be encouraged to have Leo JOIN the other group of friends and bring Leo into the fold.

Why would you have sleepless nights over this?

Do you know how to create boundaries? If so, saying no to daily playdates is fine. Get your son involved in sports, that's a good thing - builds team and group cohesion.

I wouldn't worry too much about it. Just encourage your son to have lots of friends. Invite over other kids for playdates or encourage his friendship with other friends. Don't carpool anymore or encourage your son having too much one on one time with this other little boy. Your son sounds like a nice kid and it's great he can be friends with everyone. Honestly, this is pretty normal and I see this in many kids this age. They cling to their one best friend. I'm glad neither of my kids were like this.