Too Much Talking

Show up on their doorstep, w/ a book to read, a pencil and notebook. And then don't leave until you get a date or followup email address, name and phone number. Bring a book so you have something to do in case you start getting the run around...or, as is usually the case, the person you need to talk to really is busy.

Hi C.,

Really try to demand a conference with the teacher, that way you can find out details on his classroom behavior. This way you can compare and contrast his behavior at home to his behavior at school. Before you assume that it is any kind of disorder.

I'm a teacher and I am shocked that, by your accounts, she is blowing you off.

Call her. Tell her you want to set up a time to meet in private to discuss some concerns you have regarding your child. Don't ask for a meeting...TELL her you want a meeting within two weeks. You don't have to be forceful, but just make sure you are assertive. A sample script might go something like this:

"Hello Mrs. Smith. This is Mrs. C. and my son Joey is in your class. We need to set a time to meet in person to discuss some issues Joey is having in class. Which of these times/dates (give a few options) works best for you?" If none of those times/dates work, then ask her "I feel it is important that we sit down and meet. When are you available, and I can make arrangements to come in and meet with you." Try NOT to let her get out of meeting with out; that's ridiculous.

If you get nowhere with her, then go to the principal. Let the principal know about this conversation and really impress upon him or her that "I am really concerned about my son and am trying my hardest to learn more about how I can help him to be a better student. I want my son to succeed and I'm willing to be a team player, but I feel like I'm running into a brick wall because, so far, his teacher and I have been unable to meet despite my frequent contact with her. How can you help my son and I? I really do not want him to fall farther and farther behind, so I'd like to be more proactive."

Good luck to you. I am very surprised she is blowing you off like this - it isn't acceptable.

If the teacher isn't responding, go right to the Principal. Keep tabs on this very closely. 1st grade is a big year to figure out where kids are. Don't be scared of labels, let everyone in that school help him, but never medicate a child for anything that a school suggests as a problem like ADD. You are his best advocate, so keep on them at school. It can be a difficult process, but knowing answers is better than a "wait and see". Good luck and let me know if you need help.

My first grade son talks to himself, out loud, all the time. Usually, he's bored. I see it all the time at home. We've also seen him do it on the soccer field during games - he's talking to himself and watching the clouds go by. He is otherwise a smart kid who has plenty of friends.

We've had conversations with him, letting him know that it looks a little strange to us. We've asked him to start "talking in his head". We've also been places like the grocery store, mall, etc. and asked him to look around to see if anyone else is talking out loud to themselves (and we cross our fingers no adult is!).

I volunteer at my son's school and I will say, when a 1st grader isn't engaged in something - they are talking to themselves. I wouldn't get bent out of shape about it -- unless there are some other issues paired with it.

I'm guessing that all the people observing your son means that they do think something is going on. I'm sure they are getting all their evaluations in order and then they are going to be calling you for a meeting. I do think your son's teacher has been extremely rude. The least she could do is say "I can't say anything until everyone has evaluated him" or "I can't say anything but let's schedule a meeting in two weeks". I do know that some school districts are very hesitant to start writing up an IEP for kids when the money to provide services just isn't there. Anyway, at this point, when you pick up your son from school I would walk in and talk with his teacher. Don't fight - just start out with "Not sure if you've been getting my e-mails..."

Good luck.

Hi C.,
All the other mamas have given you good advice. I have a 20 yr old who is just now growing into himself and it has been a long haul. Things I wish I had done:

* Start your DETAILED paper trail immediately. Note each time the teacher blows off a request for a conference. Note everything the observers say and do, and every time you ask for consultation and don't get a response. Do the same when they are cooperative. Time, date on everything; also copies of all written communication.

* Have you looked/tested for subtle problems, such as auditory processing disorder as mentioned by another mom? The talking suggests this. Has his hearing been tested? perhaps damage from ear infections?

* Seek out other means of addressing his difficulty. I cannot recommend too highly the work of Donalee Markus, a tremendously gifted and empathetic brain specialist who works extensively with children like your son, where you're not sure what isn't firing, but something is wrong. She is in Highland Park -- www.designsforstrongminds.com -- not cheap but she WILL find a way to help your son.

* Hold off on entering the universe of diagnosis and medication until every other possibility is exhausted. I know meds can be miraculous, but am very troubled by the rush to medicate. My son simply refused Ritalin, said it allowed him to concentrate better but he did not feel right while on it, so I let him quit. My niece, however, loves it -- possibly because she has lost a lot of weight.

* Realize that we now have a full generation of boys ill-served by schools, especially public schools. IEPs are fine but routinely ignored by overtaxed, exhausted and exasperated teachers. Your son -- and btw you yourself, as his advocate -- already are in danger of being labeled as difficult, troublesome, etc. -- in first grade, for heaven's sake! He is very young, already behind his peers, possibly not ready for first grade. Is there an ungraded Montessori or other alt school nearby? Could you consider drastically changing your paradigm to homeschool him for a year or two, while intensively addressing whatever isn't working, and get him up to grade level across the board? I have often wished I had done so with both my sons -- the brainiac now in grad school and the equally smart troubled one now doing better. They both would have been better off had I homeschooled or kept them in Montessori, at least through grade school. But the flip side is that they live in the world as it is, and now, at 24 and 20, they are doing fine.

* Reach out to other moms who have had this experience. Just the talking will help. You have a long way to go with your darling but you will make it and he will be so much better for all your work.

Good luck!!!!! You are not alone and you BOTH will be fine!!!!!

Mama S.

Argh. I'm very frustrated for you that you are getting no response from the teacher. You may want to read up a little bit on IDEA just in case, so you don't get blindsided by anything (www.wrightslaw.com is a good place to start.)

My oldest son had the problem of calling out in class, but not talking to himself. In his case (he has ADHD) I think it was a way to keep himself engaged because his attention wandered so easily away from the classroom. But I know of a child who is very bright, has the issue of repeating information out loud in class and asking a lot of questions. It turns out that he has some issues with processing information and it helps him to repeat it in order to understand and remember it. Isn't it interesting how our brains compensate on their own for stuff? So the talking out loud thing may end up being a clue to what is going on with your son - maybe he is compensating in one way or another.

I hate to always recommend the same thing, but we found working with a private OT to be very valuable in helping our son and understanding some of the quirks he had in class (does your son sit upside down in his chair, for example? Mine did - sensory-seeking behavior!)

I also just started getting emails from this guy who did a presentation locally last week. I didn't see the presentation, but I'm interested in hearing him speak next time he's in town: http://www.celebratecalm.com/ The last email I got from them was titled: Anxiety, Fears, Sensory Needs & Homework. (I don't know anything about his program, but he certainly knows kids like mine!!)

Your real issue is with the professionals at school not communicating with you at this point. If he is being evaluated, you have a right to be informed about this. Have your husband with you when you talk to them next time. Do you have a friend who is a lawyer? if they still continue to stonewall you both, you should consider getting one.

Your son's vision and fine motor issues caught my eye. I agree with Jen C...maybe you should have him evaluated by an Occupational Therapist. My son's both have sensory issues (a symptom of their autism, but doesn't always have to be) and my oldest was suspected of having ADHD before he was diagnosed with autism. OT definitely helps. One of the therapists I interviewed described sensory disorders as being at a New Year's Party, at midnight, with a migraine. If you haven't done so already, request in writing an evaluation into the problems you are seeing. The school must respond within a certain amount of time by law. Getting an OT eval at school would be helpful, but don't overlook a private OT eval as the school only needs to address issues that affect him academically. Ironically behavior issues resulting from sensory disfunction do not fall under this category. Good luck!

It is disgraceful that you have been blown off! Get on the phone early today and start with the principal since you have already tried the teacher more than once. Do not get off the phone until you have your meeting(s) set up. You are doing the right thing by being proactive, and the school is supposed to be there to do what they can as well. Do not let them blow you off today and do not take no for an answer.

Dear C.,

Hi. I read this post and a couple of things came to mind. Have you or the school ever considered that your son is an auditory learner? Especially given some of his vision issues. I ask this because I am an almost purely auditory learner. I did great in school when teachers taught lessons and I could hear it. I have to say that I didn't really realize just how auditory a learner I was until Graduate school(I actually test as an almost exclusive auditory learner 65/68, which is really really unusual). I used to find myself reading things 2 or 3 times and then on the 4th time reading out loud very quietly to myself and it was only then that it would start to stick. I had to learn to read very actively... for me this meant that my books looked like a kids had come through with a highlighter attack. It was the only way I could make it stick. So I was thinking maybe your son is reading out loud to himself, when he is supposed to be reading quietly. This way he is actually getting the material.

I used to tutor kids and we always assessed what kind of learner the kids was ie., visual, auditory, or kinestic (sp) and then there are the global learners, who need the big picture then the details vs those who like details first then getting to the big picture. knowing All of these things about how your child learns can make a huge difference. Don't jump straight to adhd.

I hope some of this helps.

D.

Your son is a little b-o-y. I am a reading teacher who has seen it all and let me tell you if he is talking to himselve or others in first grade he is absolutely NORMAL! or his version of normal. Little boys are not quiet attentive little sponges. They like stimulation, conversation, and action. And if you ask me that is how it should be. That being said he shouldn't disturb the whole class. You need to teach him to monitor the volume and type of things he says. If the teacher is ignoring requests then it is time to see the principal. Is she the one complaining that he is too loud? If not maybe your worried about a problem that is not really all that bad. Do not under any circumstnces let them talk you into drugging your child! First grade is a big transitional year and it is still eary. Get him help in the reading, work with him at home if possible, there are lots of good comprehension web site like starfall.com and RIF.com also the Jump start computer and v-tec tv games are very helpful. Even Nintendo ds has some learning games. He will learn when it is appropriate to talk before he graduates. Focus on the real issues and get the support you need to make his education productive.
Best of Luck any question feel free to e-mail
Peggy

Have you signed anything giving permission for them to test him? They can observe but not do formal testing without your permission. Although in this case I think they should so whatever is necessary to get him the help he needs.
I have a 17 1/2 year old with HFA, I've been through a LOT of IEP meetings!!
M. H.

i am a special ed. and reg. ed. teacher and there is a lot involved in an evaluation. many team members have to first observe, then test and then do a write up. possibly they will get him in resource and are preparing for an i.e.p. without all the information it is useless for the classrm. teacher to meet with you without the necessary information all the team members have been gathering. in the meantime, after school one day soon, ask the tch. what is going on with all the obsevations. i know as a reg. ed. tch and a sp. ed. tch., sometimes the psych. sets up the conference. i think everyone is doing the work-up on your son just a little slow for you, but it sounds like it is moving forward. good luck!

I think that is awful that the school is blowing you off and making you feel that they have some kind of "plan in progress to evaluate your son" but you are not privy to this information... juuuust yet!"

First off, your son is in first grade and so many parents of boys that I know, have had the same thing said to them, that the teacher "suspected their son was ADHD in first of second grade" because.... They were fidgety, busy or unfocused, rather than just being young. Not saying he couldn't be...just saying the likelihood of him being immature and a social butterfly and liking the attention, could be more of the culprit. I am questioning your line about "I gave all the evaluations... ".. have you had him evaluated in the past????

Also, both of my children were slow readers and did not have very good writing skills in first grade and it is really hard to compare your child with others because some children are way more advanced in first grade than others. Both of my children are very good students, now. Back then, they just learned at a slower pace. I have a teen and a tween and, yes, I still get that occasional "check mark" in the box that says "my child is talking too much in class!"That usually is curbed by the next quarter.

Talk to your son. Let him know that you are aware this is going on and these are the rules and he needs to abide by them otherwise a consequence will take place.

The concern that I have in the classroom is that they probably have some kind of basic "discipline strategy" in place for the children and if your child hasn't mentioned that he had "something taken away"... or "has a step' or "got on a red light" then,, how could he be THAT ill-behaved in class!! You are your child's best advocate. I cannot imagine not getting a meeting with a teacher regarding my child if someone felt that they had "behavioral issues". If you can't get action from the teacher.... take it up the ladder and call the Principal. Be nice, but direct...saying something like, "I'm concerned with some behavioral issues that my son has been having in class and I would like to meet with you and the teacher to discuss this situation as I want this to be a positive year for all. Would either (give two times/days) work?"

Good luck to you.

I feel sad every time I hear of yet another child who is being penalized for being himself or herself, just because they don't fit the cookie-cutter mold that makes it easier for a teacher to control her class.

Your son sounds to me like a very bright child who just needs a learning environment that is more sensitive to the individual gifts of the individual child--an environment that is not so focused on making children conform to the lowest common denominator.

Have you considered home-schooling?

That being said, here are some practical suggestions for evaluating your child yourself...

http://drphil.com/articles/page/diet_audit/

http://www.theaddanswer.com/theaddanswer.htm

http://drphil.com/articles/article/150/

http://drphil.com/articles/article/152

Best wishes,
J.

talking too much in school is completely normal and common in 1st grade. Not saying that it doesn't have to be stopped, lol, just that it's normal.

And since you aren't at school, you can not solve this issue any more then telling your son the rules have to be followed.

Come up with a reward for him to get if he gets a good report for the day. Give him ideas on what he should do instead of talking. Ask if he can chew gum in class as that will help him focus and keep him from talking usually. But ultimately you can't take care of this, it's up to him and his teacher and you have to let them work it out.

Hi C..
I agree with MR. I am also a teacher, and her blowing you off is NOT acceptable. Start documenting the times and dates you have reached out to her and if you still get no response, then go to the principal. Good luck!
S.

Sounds like the school is dropping the ball majorly here in communicating with you. If you've tried repeatedly to set up a meeting with the teacher, then this is what I would do next:

1)Call the principal and set up a meeting with them AND the teacher. Explain that the teacher has not set anything up with you and be sure you can back up how many times you've contacted her about it. Also ask that the Special Ed coordinator or whoever has been observing your child sit in on the meeting.

It is very possible they will suggest you get your son tested. I think that schools are sometimes overeager to say 'ADHD' or something similar, because they can buttonhole the kid and not have to deal with him as an idividual. What are your feelings? Do you think that is your son's issue? Or, as you mentioned, is he just acting out from fear of being left behind? or is he just a fidgety first grade boy?? Does he get recess and enough exercise during the school day? All these things are valid concerns and the staff at the school should treat them as such.

The next step depends on how satisfied you are with the outcome of the meeting. If you feel like all 3 people from the school can answer your questions specifically and if they are willing to work together AND with you and come up with a comprehensive plan for your son, then give it a try.

If they just try to put you off or don't really give you answers or come up with a plan or they don't follow through with a plan,or if you are in ANY way dissatisfied with the school's response, then talk to someone who specializes in IEPs.

Having a knowledgeable person in your corner who is advocating for your child can be critical until you yourself get more educated about how to approach this. I can recommend Marilee Waters at Waters and Assc. www.waters-associates.net She is really great and talking to her about your options would be a good place to start. Good luck- remember YOU are the advocate for your son! Don't let yourself feel bullied by the school system!