Gifted Girl?

I think you should just do what you are doing. Wait till she is in school, if she is blowing through the school work and getting bored, then bring it up to the teacher. I was invited to a gifted program at about second grade, because that was when I started getting bored in class and getting into trouble. :)

Hi R.,

There are many factors that go into identifying a 'gifted' child and quite honestly most of them are NOT related to how high they can count or what their reading level is. Those factors will definitely indicate a smart kid. But a 'gifted' kid is one who has critical thinking skills. So, for example, you said your daughter knows the names of all 50 states. If she is gifted she wants to know why the states are different shapes and who decides that? She would want to know how long it takes to get from one state to the other and why the weather is different in Alaska than in Florida. It's about so much more than being able to recite information that they have been taught.
A gifted kid is also very focused on 'rules' because they have critical thinking skills above and beyond the normal kid - so most 'gifted' kids will lag behind their peers in either maturity or social development because they will get frustrated very easily with inconsistencies in schedule or rules - ie, if a child is favored by the teacher, if a kid cuts in line and doesn't get caught or if most days you read a story after lunch but today you have to run an errand so no story. The 'gifted' kid will many times be very frustrated by these behaviors way more so than a kid who is not gifted.

If her aunt is saying your daughter is gifted and she works with gifted kids, it's likely she has seen some of those critical thinking skills, rather than just what you listed off above. Most of what you listed are things that a kindergartner would be able to do. Do you homeschool her?

What you should do is what any parent should do with any kid - gifted or not..... just keep encouraging HER to go as far and as deep as she wants with learning. Encourage her to read. Encourage her to figure things out for you - we are having 6 people for dinner and this recipe only feeds 3 - how many extra do we need? etc etc etc

When you say 'pursue this whole gifted thing' what does that mean to you? Will you send her to different school? Will you treat her differently? What would it mean to you to have a gifted child? (in reality, it generally means more work.... for you and her both!!!!)

Good Luck and Have Fun!

Oh - one other thing (Updated). You want to think of 'giftedness' the same way you think of an IQ test. You can have a super high IQ and flunk out of school or you have an average IQ and be valedictorian. Giftedness is like IQ. It doesn't really have anything to do with performance, it's more just how they process the information.

Ah, the curse of the "gifted" child. I had a mother that loved to get me tested at every stage of my development. Always fretting over my talents and skills. I was highly praised and trotted out for my mother's friends and praised some more. I passed the appropriate tests and was shoved into the gate program. I was going to be forced to leave my current school to be cloistered in with other little special people such as myself. I pitched a fit. I'd had it. I ran out of classes, disobeyed orders and hid as often as I could get away with. You could say I was weak willed and broke under the pressure, I look back on it and see a small child put under the kinds of stress most adults would tend to avoid or get paid a CEO's salary to put up with. It affected me to such a degree that I began to abhor tests. I never sat down to take my SAT's because I didn't want to know where I ranked. I was sick of the competition.

Don't torture your child with high expectations because you'll just set her up for failure. If she feels she can't meet your expectations, or the expectations of everyone else who is watching her for greatness, she'll fall apart. She is what she is. You aren't going to stunt her by not pushing her into the roll of the "gifted child". You'll be doing her a favor. The following is an excerpt from an article about the issue:

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"When children are labelled as "gifted" we like to think the world will be their oyster when they grow up. Be very careful, warns British psychologist Joan Freeman. As she explains to Alison George, her 35 years of studying children with extraordinary abilities has revealed that the label has as many negatives as positives."

--You have followed one group of gifted children for the past 35 years. Did they all go on to lead brilliantly successful adult lives?--

No. Only a few rose to fame and fortune, and no matter how glittering their early prospects, they had to work extremely hard most of their lives to get there. There is a big difference between a gifted child and a gifted adult. A child is seen as gifted because they are ahead of their age peers, especially at school, while a "gifted" adult has to be seen to make a difference to the world.

--How did you define a "gifted" child?--

That’s the most difficult question. A gifted child is someone who is distinctly better at something than other children of the same age. Each one is something of a prodigy. While some can do anything brilliantly, whether it is sport, music or philosophy, others focus on a single area. The criteria for giftedness vary, not only with the culture, but with age. The people featured in my latest book, Gifted Lives, which investigates what happens when gifted children grow up, all had IQs above 160.

--Were all the children you studied gifted?--

No. My study was unique in that from the beginning I compared three groups: children labelled "gifted", children of identical ability but without a label, and average children.

--What were the parents’ reactions to having a very bright child?--

The healthy reaction is to be nurturing, while the unhealthy is to do with parental need for their child to be bright. If you label a child as gifted when they are not, as some parents do, the child has the most terrible burden. If you are incapable of fulfilling your parents’ dreams, you must fail over and over – you can’t win. There was one boy whose mother was convinced he was gifted. She went on and on about how school didn’t appreciate him. When I tested him, he had an average IQ. As a child he was very depressed, but he escaped and now runs a bar in Spain and is having a great time…

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http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20827811.300-prodig...

I've had many children her age that knew most of the things you listed. I agree with the previous poster. She's going to be a smarty, obviously likes to learn. But I don't see anything over the top. I've had my kids doing 100 piece puzzles at ages 5 and 6 years with no trouble. In fact, we have puzzle races where I have them start the same puzzle at the same time and race to see who finishes first.

However, she does sound a lot like one of my daycare boys that was just tested by a psychologist and he said he's gifted. I'd say it's a mixture of your hard work and her cooperation and desire.

Don't take this the wrong way: Your child is bright. She is not gifted.
I never allowed either of my children to be in the GT program. I would not have them pulled out of class to do extra work no matter how exciting it is -- it's not worth it to me. They are both bright - they are not gifted. Truly gifted children are few and far between.

My daughter is currently tutoring the GT math students... She was not in GT math. My daughter is currently taking Chemistry and Physics with the rest of the GT kids in high school - they don't have GT labeled classes there, just AP and Honors. She is just as bright, but didn't go to class with them in elementary and and middle school.
By the time they are in high school, it all evens out... There are kids that were GT in middle school when my son was that age who barely graduated from high school. My non-GT student was top 3 in his graduating class...

My advice? Let her be a kid. The academics will happen. Skip the testing... They all even out in the end. She is an only child. She has your undivided attention. I am sure you work with her on stuff and that's great. Ditto for the athletics. As for discovering her gift -- she'll find it for you -- you don't have to look for it. If she is interested in something, let her try. If she wants to quit something she's good at -- at the end of the season, let her. My daughter is a very beautiful dancer, but she quit at the end of 8th grade to do marching band. She is an amazing musician and she loves marching band. She is happy and really--- that's what it's all about, our kids' happiness - right?
LBC

It sounds like you are doing a great job preparing her for school.

Don't put pressure on you or her especially as far as " gifted". When she enters school, she will be tested along with all the children to get a feel for where she best fits . If indeed she blows through the regular testing, she will be tested by the gifted and talented ( blah labels) teacher and you will be notified.

Many children are at various degrees emotionally and mentally at this age and they typically even out accordingly.

I see so many parents freaking out if their child is not in the gifted program... Keep in mind that a good balance is best!!

She sounds very bright.. Since she misses the cut off for kindergarten.. Check into a pre k. Montessori school.. They teach each child at their own level. My kids loved montessori school.

Are you homeschooling her? I think a lot of what you are listing are things that a lot of kindergarteners know. That doesn't mean she is not smart but 50 pc puzzels mazes, letters and numbers are things that many children do. It sounds like your a great teacher for her and are really proud of her. I would send her to school when its time and they will let you know if she is super far above her age group. Then you need to worry about whether your pushing or holding her back. I think she sounds like a smart little girl but I would be careful about labeling her to early.

I've wondered the same about my kids. I wasn't able to pursue special programs or classes, and instead just read to them, taught them to read, gave them tons of books (which they devoured), took them places, and talked with them. They still have a love of learning, which I believe is the most important thing regardless of giftedness. If they are exceptionally gifted, they now have the tools and mental stability to do what they want with it. So I guess I'm saying don't worry about it. Just give her all the opportunities you can and make sure NOTHING quenches her curiosity and love of learning.

She sounds pretty bright. It probably doesn't matter if she's technically "gifted" at this age. Either way, you'll keep encouraging and supporting her interests, right?

Just something to think about if getting the label right is important to you...

Giftedness isn't about how MUCH children know but HOW they learn. For example... lots of kids read before kindergarten. An average child and be TAUGHT to read using phonics instruction or something like "Your Baby Can Read". On the other hand, a gifted child may (or may not) seem to suddenly be able to read around age 3 with NO real instruction.

I've heard it explained "Bright kids know a lot of answers. Gifted kids ask the hard questions."

My son sounds similar to your daughter, so I've had some of these same thoughts and feelings. He has ADHD (combined type) and is suspected gifted... pretty much exactly like me :-P His pediatrician, psychologist and I all agree that seeking a formal diagnosis as "gifted" isn't really important at this age. He'll be entering kindergarten in a month (turned 5 in January), so we'll think about testing him if it will open up more services for him.

His strengths are in similar areas to your daughter:
Spontaneously read at 3. Now reads EVERYTHING, and uses text to get information (I've never tested him on a leveled reader, he just read what he wants... I guess like a 3rd grader?).
He's a terrible speller. He can spell his first and last names and several names in his everyday life, but that's it. Handwriting is a struggle for him. Letters are all different sizes and he mixes upper and lowercase letters.
Understands addition and subtraction ideas as counting up and back, but he doesn't know the WORDs addition and subtraction. Multiplies using repeated addition but again doesn't know the WORD or symbols. Understands some fraction concepts (1/8 is half of 1/4... it takes 3 1/3s to make a whole).
He mixes up the digits of numbers if they are out of context (15 vs 51).
He is obsessed with large numbers. "9000 thousand is 9 million!"
Came home from play based pre-school one day telling time and tying shoes.
He cannot (for the life of him) remember the names or values of ANY coins!
He struggles to tell left from right.
Does jigsaw puzzles and the word/number puzzles in a puzzle book.

I'm not sure I know what you SHOULD do, but I can tell you what I WOULD do/ AM doing... Just keep parenting. Nurture her. Celebrate her. Don't compare her to other kids. Help her with the things she needs help with. Let her do what she can on her own. Keep her life rich and interesting. Respond to her needs regardless of how they are the same or different from "typical" kids her age.

Sorry so long.

HTH
T.

There's no reason to feel overwhelmed by the idea of teaching her or to be intimidated by her abilities. The best thing you can do is encourage learning by allowing her to explore things she is interested in as well as introducing her to new subjects, hobbies, and experiences so she can expand her knowledge and awareness of the world around her. Also, even though you aren't talking about home schooling her, you might consider investigating some of the teaching philosophies (particularly classical education models--the book The Well Trained Mind gives a great overview) to see if they can point you towards resources and methods to give you more courage in working with her. If she is gifted or even just very advanced, you may find as she gets older that you'll need to/want to be able to supplement her schoolwork with more challenging or interesting material to help her to meet her potential. There's a lot she won't be able to learn for the sake of learning in a school setting, and a lot of the love of learning comes from pursuing what one is interested in (and sadly, there are a lot of things of interest, especially to kids, that just aren't taught at school). By educating yourself on approaches to teaching her, you'll take a lot of the intimidation out of it.

Hi, I don't know about if she's gifted or not , I think in elementary you can ask for a test to place her in the right level, all those thing you said she knows are teach in first grade , this I know for fact because my DD finish first grade and she's 7 years old. you need to have her place in the right level because she can get bored and mistaken , in the other side how mature she is ? If she goes to regular elementary school and is placed with 8 years old will she be able to handle? You need to think in all this too.

I've known academically gifted children who turned out to be average.. or even less than successful. I've also known children who were late readers and poor in math to be, rather gifted in other conceptual and critical thinking skills. There is a vast array of giftedness.

Just try and keep her at a level she is okay with. She can go to a Montessori school in the meantime and may even test out of kindergarten. It just also depends on her social abilities.

Hi, I am a teacher who works in a gifted program and I have attended a gifted seminar that was very helpful. One thing I've learned is that there is not even one commonly decided upon definition of being "gifted". Some people prefer the term academically talented. Some people are gifted in music, art, etc. But, what often makes gifted kids stand out from just regular high achieving kids is their social and emotional characteristics. Many truly gifted students are very sensitive, have perfectionistic tendencies, are very active (almost hyper), talk a ton, and don't need a lot of rest. There's a website called "hoagies" with a lot of useful information. Hopefully once your child enters school, there will be testing and a program that will meet her needs. The other thing I've learned is that students who are academically gifted/talented NEED to be challenged to learn, or they risk becoming underachievers! It is so important. Just as we try to make sure the needs to special ed students are met, we need to do the same for gifted learners. Good luck!!!

I want to start out with a little FYI for you....Most parents of kids who are NOT in the Gifted programs HATE it!! So please do NOT base any of your decisions on what these people (including some of your posters here)will tell you. I personally believe some of these haters have tried unsuccessfully to get their children in GATE. Otherwise it would be positively ridiculous not to get your child the most rigourous and best academic program that you can if they would qualify. And that right there is why you want to test your child. If she does test in she will get a superior education than her peers. One that will much better suit her academic needs. And your school will be legally bound to you to make it happen. I am just now realizing how useful an IEP is to get what you need for your child. I encourage you to keep doing what you are doing because it is obviously working. When she gets to school you should open up the dialogue immediately with the district. My school encouraged me to wait to have my son tested (I know now it was b/c they didn't want to deal with a kindergartner in GATE) so I did. The result was him basically sitting in the back with a basket of books while the other kids learned how to read. HUGE waste. Had I tested him then the school would have been legally obligated to challenge him.

I have not read any other responses,
Please...do not feel the need to LABEL your child.
She does sound like she is definitely advanced and that is wonderful...but let her be a child, sure encourage her...support her ( Heck Be Proud of her )
but labels end up meaning pressure and expectations.
I really am not a fan of labels, maybe I have a chip on my shoulder because my youngest son already has several of them...
I am not trying to be mean or hateful or catty.
I am just cautioning you that it may not be that big a deal, you do not need a label to tell you your daughter is amazing, you are her mom, it is expected that you will feel that way = )
By all means though encourage her and support her, I just think that pushing or having unnecessary expectations can be damaging.

Gifted is such a relative term.
It really is.
I think you should be glad your daughter is so bright and encourage her to keep learning and honing her memory skills.
I was sent one day to take a test. As a child, I didn't understand any of it. I just wondered if I passed or failed. I didn't realize it was an IQ test.
It changed my whole life.
I was sent across town to a different school district that had a gifted program. It felt like a punishment to me at first. My school was in walking distance and that's where all my friends went. I was the only kid in my neighborhood who went somewhere else for school.
But, I flourished. We were exposed to so much more than other kids and it was tough work. I'm very thankful for the experience. I'm very thankful that there was such a program.
I often wonder, looking back, how many other kids could have benefitted just from the exposure to things I had the chance to be part of. Children are sponges.
I don't really like labels. I think all kids are gifted in one way or another.
There are people in this world who can't write their own names and have never had a piano lesson in their lives but they can play like a concert pianist anything that they hear one time.
There are blind people who can paint and draw images so real they are like a photograph and they've never seen anything. With their eyes.
There is a gift in them that comes from somewhere.
It's a gift, none the less.

One thing I know to be certain is that no matter how bright or smart you are, there will always be someone brighter and smarter. No matter how physically capable you are, there will always be someone faster and stronger.
And that's okay.
My parents never told me I went to special schools because I was smarter than anyone else and I'm glad they didn't. Some things came more easily to me. That's true. But not everything.
See how your daughter does when she starts school. I know many intelligent children who didn't do well with the socialization part at first.
My son's best friend was held back in kindergarten to participate in a K-1st grade class. His parents were furious. But, he was an only child and had never been in daycare. He wasn't used to being around other children in a structured setting. He didn't do well with that and it had nothing to do with his intelligence. He needed that extra year of getting into the swing of things and he was right on target after that.
Wait and see what happens.
If you can get your daughter into advanced programs and it's not too much pressure for her, do it.
Don't forget though......she's only 4 right now. Let her be a little kid above all else. Don't go worrying about Harvard applications just yet.

Best wishes.

I didnt read everything way too much. Just wanted to tell you i have a globally gifted child. Scored 9th stanine on GATES test which only 4% of children do.
We knew at the age of 1 that she was really smart. My dad called her a genius. She was my first child and i just thought it was because i worked with her a lot on everything.
When she got to kindergarten she didnt want to go, it was soooo boring for her. I didnt know anything about any gifted program. Her teacher had her tested and soon i got a call from the gifted director telling me how my kid is really really smart and can pretty much do anything she wanted in life, because she scored so high on everything.
When She was kindergarten she was placed in a gifted class once a week.
They just tested her again in 2nd grade and she is still just as smart. 9th stanine.
Now she will be getting gifted classes 5 days a week.
My daughter loves being in the gifted classes with kids at her level. I highly recommend you ask the teacher about it when you go to a conference. I didnt have to ask for my daughter to be tested they just did it, so they might do it.
I know parents that have asked for their kids to be tested and they are not gifted and the parents get mad and insist they are. The test are very lengthy and stressful for the kids so i wouldnt put your kid through it every year if you dont have to.

Please don't stress so much over labeling her, or conversely, not really wanting her to be labeled gifted (as you mention in your "so what happened" posting), or keeping such detailed lists of every color she can identify and every state she can name. She soon will realize you're quantifying everything she knows and does, and though you are definitely doing it with the very best of intentions, it puts pressure on her and on you too. You're stressing about this and are even intimidated by your own little girl.

Please try to put the term "gifted" out of your mind. Our school system changed to the term "academically advanced" a while back and I'm glad. A child can be gifted in academics, or in art, or music, or athletics, or in getting along with others and being a peacemaker and organizer. Thinking in terms of academic advancement rather than "giftedness" takes a lot of the mystery out of the whole "what do I do with my bright kid" worries. Instead of being mysteriously "gifted" beyond what their parents can understand, these kids -- yes, mine is one -- are academically advanced. That does not mean they already know everything; you asked, "Arent' gifted children supposed to just KNOW certain things as opposed to being taught?" No, not at all. They just soak up what they're taught, but they still only know what we expose them to. Academically advanced kids are those with learning POTENTIAL, not learning already fixed in their heads. The school system tries to challenge them more and stretch them more, but that does not mean they "just know certain things." No one can know what they haven't been exposed to. Your daughter's still only five; she knows a lot because she's been taught it and grasped it and has a good memory, not because she somehow knew it from birth.

You're doing fine. Keep on talking with her about everything. But do it because you like to, and because she enjoys it, not because you feel required to do it. If you are reading with her or just watching a movie with her, and word comes up that she may not know, ask her if she knows it and explain it if she doesn't. Take her to museums, not Because It's Good For Her Like Broccoli but because YOU find them fun and interesting; she'll pick up on that. Take her to the park and stop and watch the worms cross the pavement or watch the ants carrying leaves around. Read, read, read with her because the stories are good ones, not because you're ticking "first grade reading level," "second grade reading level" off a mental list. You're doing fine -- just take the worry out of it and enjoy her enjoyment in learning things.

She's about to begin K fairly soon, so find out how your school system handles "gifted and talented" kids or "academically advanced" kids. Most, or many, systems have some form of programs for them. Ours, for instance, tests kids in first and second grade, (the testing does not test what they know but their aptitude for learning) and at the end of second grade, parents of kids who qualify have the option to send their kids to schools where the classes, starting in third grade, are "Academically Advanced Program" classes. The kids learn the SAME curriculum as others in their grades; the material is presented in more interesting and deeper ways. Your system may or may not have some similar program.

Here's the important thing for your sanity and your daughter's too: Find out what the options will be in the future, then file that away and do not think about it until the time comes! Or you will be fixated on whether she'll "get into the program," like some parents here are. Instead, feed her enjoyment of learning and challenge her with trips to new places, books that interest her, library time, hands-on crafts, etc. Remember to exercise her body as well as her mind. Ensure she has plenty of play dates to be socially ready for school.

As she starts K and goes on from there, know what is going on at school and get to know her teachers without hovering or criticizing. They will be your guides to her abilities. But her abilities are only part of her whole self, and shouldn't be quantified and labeled and worried about too much, or she will soon be under pressure. I've seen it happen here in our area where there is a lot of academic pressure on kids. Follow her interest and enjoyments and you will be teaching her and she will reach her full potential whether or not she knows all 50 states or forgets them by the time she's in first grade.