Drug Testing Whehn Applying for Welfare

I think it is a great idea to drug test them. I don't think living with a drug addicted parent is good for the child. They shouldn't be denied welfare for testing positive but should be required to enter drug rehabilitation and become clean so they can better their life for them and their children.

Has anyone actually thought of how much additional money it is going to cost to drug test all these people on a regular and random basis? The welfare office is already overwhelmed with cases, so even if it is ordered, I promise it will never happen, or it will happen only in the beginning and people can do like they usually do for jobs and stop smoking for a month, pass the test, and then pick right back up. Also, drug tests will really only pick up on weed in most peoples systems as other drugs metabolize to quickly, so they would have to be high RIGHT THEN. There are just so many technicalities for them to do this effectively . . . .

I totally agree with testing anyone who applies for welfare. I think its an excellent idea. ( and about time ) .
I don't believe in enabling the addict. Smoking is an addiction and people worldwide kick it all the time. I'm an ex-smoker, I know about addiction and the grip it has over someone's life. I smoked a pack a day for 20 years.
I don't think anyone would appreciate paying for my cigarette habit. ( just using that as an addiction example )

I am writing as a child of a drug addicted mother, who got clean and was on welfare. I am now a successful adult with no history of drug use and have 2 kids of my own. I know what its like to live off the system and I know what its like to live with a drug addicted parent. I hope no one takes any ill intent from my response, I am very passionate about this as I grew up living this.

I agree 100% with Robbe. I believe that if a parent(s) is struggling to make ends meet and they need assistance to get back on their feet or to get by until the job market improves then I am all for helping, and they shouldn't have a problem getting tested, just like anyone working. However, I also see people everyday in my small town that are drinking and drugging their dollars away and not doing anything to try and better themselves for their children to have a better (safer/healthier/happier) life.

As to your point that these children will suffer more, maybe not. If the parent is doing drugs then they most likely aren't caring for the child in the first place and if that is the case the children should be given to someone who can care for them.

Does anyone out there honestly believes that Children of Drug addicted parents are better off without the parents being tested? Or are they better off having their parents being tested and hopefully cleaning up because of the testing. The parents that are not willing to test are more than likely already headed down a path of distruction that will take their children down with them.

If we are making the effort to support people with our tax dollars for doing nothing, the very least they can do is prove they aren't spending money (that they could be using for food for themselves and their kids) on drugs. Pretty simple.

I strongly believe in drug testing. You test positive...my money(in the form of taxes) is taken away from you and your child is taken into custody.

I don't think you should get an EBT card which makes the process easy. Go back to food stamps. I think you go pick up your food stamps in a loooooong line and use them only on specific items at the store.

I believe in a "will work for food" type program. You do some community service and you continue getting your food stamps and other assistance. I think a specific time frame should be placed on this assistance and that you have to reapply after that time expires and then have to stand in that loooooong line again to get it.

Just my opinion. I was raised for a long time by a single mom who had 4 kids in the home.(my dad up and walked out on her and she had to fight for minimal child support and was grateful when he paid a portion of it..he has slowly come back into our lives..wow..that is another issue) My mom worked a minimum wage job, didn't do drugs or drink a lick of alcohol and we didn't go on govt. assistance. Our church has a global food program to lend a hand to those that need help. The program is amazing and they kindly and gently ask you to "give back" so to speak by helping out at the facility or by doing someother form of service. She did this gladly for the duration. All four of us kids have gone on to be self sufficient, hardworking and tax paying citizens.

I may get slammed by other moms out in cyber space for my opionion and that I am not compassionate enough. I am sick of the vicious cycle that is continuing in our country and only at the expense of the 50% of the population that actually pays income taxes.

Our country cannot continue paying out all these special entitlement programs...we are going broke as a country..continually in the red. The government does not manage it's revenue from our taxes correctly so I am sick and tired of being asked to pay more into mismanaged programs.

My family pays taxes, half of my husband's bonuses gets taken away in taxes. He works his butt off and half is taken away!!! It just blows my mind ..and chaps my hide!! We pay 10% of our income in tithes to our church, pay ontop of that to help the needy within our church, and give to charities...and our school, and the Boy Scouts, and to most every little kid knocking on our door doing fundraisers. And, the govt. is asking to raise my taxes. Enough is enough!! Stop with all the handouts to people that suck this country dry and do not give back one red cent!! Start asking the other 50% do give a little back...just a little.

I'm with you. It's one of those things that sounds good on the surface, but only the surface.

Most agencies already have saftey protocols in place. WIC gives out "coupons" for specific food only. Foodstamps won't pay for the diapers or toilet paper or chardonnay in your basket (the card only allows for certain approved categories of items to be bought), housing the checks go directly to the agency or landlord, preschool subsidies go directly to the school, healthcare cards look and act just like regular insurance cards. VERY VERY FEW people actually receive any sort of "check" with a dollar amount attached to it.

So not only is an almost completely redundant (and expensive) system being implemented, using up funds that are desperately needed in areas that have severe NEED... but what exactly does the state plan to do when a test comes back positive? Just call CPS? Are the children to be removed until when? Until what goals are accomplished? Waiting lists for state treatment facilities are MONTHS and even years long. Once a bed is attained, what is to be done with the children? Or is it a simple "Denied. Next." system?

To ME this sounds like a PR campaign. Something to make people who AREN'T receiving state assistance "feel better", rather than actually helping at risk families and children. Spin rather than results.

There's also the stigma attached. Do you know the single largest group of people who receive WIC? It's not illegal immigrants. It's not addicts. It's not mom's with 10 kids and no income. It's military enlisted families. Second largest group? Single parents. There is a HUGE stigma associated with receiving state aid. It is EMBARRASSING. And the process itself is already pretty grueling and humiliating. I would suspect, that the process will not deter addicts all that much (it's pretty easy to scam a drug test), but it WILL deter those, who can't take one more indignity and would rather eat ramen and oatmeal all month, than use the safetynet their OWN taxes have paid for, are paying for, and will pay for.
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We tell battered wives to LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE. But these same women will be drawing on food stamps, wic, state healthcare for an average of 18-24 months. With one hand we say "There's SUPPORT! Use it! You deserve it!" and with the other hand we cover our mouths and whisper to the side saying ADDICTS are the ones who use these programs... TEST THEM ALL. I WORK for MY money.

We tell single or young moms to stay in school, or go back to school. Make better of yourself that minimum wage! But those same moms will be living off of scholarships and loans and grants that just barely cover the costs of living (typically putting you at 4x below the poverty line). They will be receiving WIC and healthcare for their children (college insurance isn't enough for children), and daycare subsidies. They're going to school to pay 5x, 10x, 20x the taxes for the next 50-60 YEARS that support these programs that they'll be using for 4 years. But then we turn around and say that people who use these programs make "poor decisions" (school, and self sufficiency, are apparently bad decisions).

We wear yellow ribbons saying "Support the Troops!", or "Hate the War, Not the Soldiers!". But their families? No. We won't make sure their children are fed.

It is such a TINY percentage of the population that abuses the system... and yet we're going to legislate PURELY for the minority. We'll punish everyone in class because Bobby didn't raise his hand. Public Shaming, after all, makes other people feel better.

I get what you are saying and sympathize with those that would be hurt by the the scenario you described; however, there are many hurt (unable to be helped) now because of an overused system. Working America is what supports the programs that the non-working benefit from. If working America looses their jobs due to their poor choices, their children suffer too AND money for those programs are lost...everyone suffers. It's caled being an adult.

I would hope that kids can still be helped but not the adults who continue to use drugs and make poor decisions. Sure, drug use is an addiction (one that they had a choice to start) so if they are willing to seek treatment and do what it takes to stop then they can receive the help they need. If not, they have to live with the consequences just like the rest of us. It's time people starting taking responsibility for their actions and not blaming/using everyone else.

As things currently are, there are hard working people out there that don't qualify for help and struggle every day to make ends meet. Then there are those who do nothing productive and seek welfare (and in some cases actually live better than the working people due to illegal or shady dealings). Sure, there are some people who are on welfare and are trying to better themselves, want to and are trying to work...that is why the drug testing is a good idea. Those people would continue to get the help they need while weeding out the ones that are taking advantage.

All I have to say about this is that my sister, a drug user and lazy bum, was getting welfare. They give welfare users in the state of PA a kind of "credit card" with their allotment for the month on the card. Guess what my sister was doing with her card....SELLING IT FOR CASH SO SHE COULD GET WHAT SHE WANTED INSTEAD, smokes, alchohol, and drugs. So her child was suffering because the state was providing and enabling her to continue in her reckless lifestyle. Thank God she no longer has the child (another sister adopted him) but do you think that when her son was no longer in her possession she told the state? NO, she kept getting the money until social service stepped in. It's people such as my sister who take full advantage of the state that cause these guidelines to be implemented. It makes me so mad that she has figured out how to "work" the system to her advantage. She actually got pregnant with her second child so that she could get free housing from the state because without her first child in her possession she was removed from the section 8 housing list. I can't wait until they implement this testing rule in PA, so that my little sister is forced to get her life back in order and stop living like a leech off the state.

EDIT: Child Find is geared for children birth through age 3. There are two separate sets of regulations guiding the processes with different criteria and requirements. You have no concept of how many children walk into Kindergarten with "well educated" pediatricians and "well-educated" parents who are so glaringly delayed it's unreal. Again, you are focusing on two connected, but NOT CONTINGENT systems. You are also intermingling the concepts of "welfare consumers", "drug addicts" and "bad parents". Those things don't always occur together.
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You are connecting two very separate things here.

Couple of points (I am a special ed administrator and a former school psychologist):
- Federal IDEIA requires that states provide special education supports and services to all classified students until they graduate or until the end of the school year during which they turn 21 (whichever happens first)
- Federal regulations also require every state and county to provide Early Intervention services (EI) and to have a detailed and wide-range Child Find process in place
- Child Find is NOT contingent on a pediatrician visit... many states and counties put ads in the paper, at grocery stores, daycare facilities, social services office, etc with numbers to call if a parent has concerns. Furthermore, they have free screenings at local malls and other community locations to Find children who need supports
- Well Child visits and vaccinations are free in most states
- If a child is not found via Child Find, they will be identified at Kindergarten registration/screening
- If a parent does not have a physical on record the school will bring in a physician to conduct one
**Child cannot register for school without a physical and a record of immunization!**

There are many "stop gaps" in place and candidly very few children are "missed"- in fact we tend to over-identify children and provide services "just in case".

This will not affect children who need services, but it may force their parents to get the help they NEED so that they can get the help they WANT.

Wow, I have to say thank you for showing me a point of view I never would have thought of!
However, I feel our system is GREATLY flawed. And unfortunately we are lacking resources we need to curb some of these problems! You shouldn't be using the system to supplement your drug problem. And if you test positive for drugs, lose your children. Harsh, but true.
I was a young single mom, my fiance died unexpectedly. I worked 60+ hours trying to make ends meet, and my son was sick all the time. Sever asthma, in the hospital etc. I was denied any and all help. I graduatedd high school, I was trying to go to college. And I got the door shut in my face, and so did my son. So I'm sorry, a drug user gets benefits and I don't? Not right. Of course it's not their childrens fault, but again these children should be removed from their homes. JMO!!!

I agree with you about 60%...i do think that there should be drug testing for welfare, foodstamps etc...my 3 children are on medicaid, and WIC and we get foodstamps. Here in Missouri they dont do the drug testing but I would not be offended by it if they decide to start. I do agree that in the end, as always, it is the children that suffer. I think that many would say, and i agree with this point of view as well, that someone with an addiction to drugs could very easily trade the ebt card, or parts of it, for cash or for drugs and in those cases the child will still be hungry. In my opinion, anyone who is on drugs should have their child taken away from them, period. I know that it is an addiction, but they are the ones who started taking the drugs and kept it going until it became an addiction, so i dont feel bad or sorry for the addict themselves, just their family and friends. if the parent fails the drug test, do the kids not get medicaid?? i havent done much research on this topic so i dont know, i think the kids should be approved for the medicaid regardless because they are innocent and shouldnt be punished for the parents...but i think that they should be removed from the home. I like this question, I am eager to read other responses!

Once again the government starts out with the right idea but doesn't finish. Yes i think drug testing should be done when applying for government assistance of any kind. I DONT think they should be denied help because of the addiction but merely "bribed"(i guess is the best word for it) by the offer for the money in exchange for rehab therapy attendance.

Dont even get me started on the war on drugs. Drug users belong in rehab not jails.

I would like them to be drug tested. If drug are more important to you than you kids then maybe you shouldn't have any. IF the money that the government is giving you is going to drugs instead of you kids then maybe you kids should be taken away from you. My mother spend about 20 years on welfare and never once put her kids first. So maybe I sound bitter but I would do almost anything for my kids. I think that drug addiction is excuse that lazy people use so they don't have to work hard.

I am a bit offended that so many moms seem to think that just because someone is on welfare that they may be drug addicts. I think it would be really interesting to see statistically how many moms/dads on welfare are drug addicts and how many of your neighbors are.
I don't know if I think it should be mandatory for welfare recipients to get drug tested. I was on welfare for a whopping 3 months and was not a drug user or alcoholic, or smoker! GASP! I just needed a hand for a couple of months right after I had my baby and then I was back to work.
I have worked for money all of my working life (except for those three months) and have only been tested for drugs twice before I got hired, and once after I had an at work accident. None of my other jobs tested me. Are people really believing that their real estate agent, doctor, nurse, taxi driver, teachers, gardeners ect. are being tested before they get hired?? THEY'RE NOT!! My SIL is a nurse, she has never been tested, my mother is a TA and she has never been tested, our good friends are gardeners and they have never been tested.
I think it's just a bunch of hoitie toitie people that believe that someone that is down on their luck MUST be doing drugs!! Come on. MOST people on welfare are just not making ends meet and it's offensive to think otherwise.
(Riley also makes a good point. Drug addicts could never figure out all the loops for applying for assistance, there are a ton, and they are confusing...even for someone sober!)
L.
I guess if we REALLY want to save the children then the government should be knocking on everyone's doors every couple of months and testing them for drug use. A lot of people are addicted to pain killers and other "legal" drugs that could also harm children. You want the government to take away people's kids because of addiction than you should test EVERYONE, not just the welfare recipients. How would THAT sit with everyone?

E.,
You're right. Completely.
Unfortunately, there are a lot of people who still believe in and perpetuate stereotypes (although they won't likely ever admit it).
There are those who refuse to believe that welfare, overall, is a hand UP, not a hand OUT.
I asked a question a while ago regarding moms who actually received assistance and what it meant to them. The responses were overwhelmingly to the effect: "I needed it to feed my kid(s)", "it got me through til I found employment, finished school", etc.
Still, you will have the contingent that feels people are getting what THEY have. And need to protect. Secretly, it's a self-righteous attitude. Sadly, the tides can turn for any O. of us at any time. Sometimes those that scream the loudest are bellying up to the welfare line via job loss, addiction, health crises, etc. They just can't entertain the thought that "There but for the grace of God, go I."
You'll not change many minds with your (sound) logic here for those people. But I'm glad to see another human being with a compassionate bone.
Some would rather sacrifice the health and lives of innocent children impacted by this drug testing (while screaming for LESS government to boot!) than look at the overall picture of "good" being achieved.
Addiction IS an illness. There are far too few treatment options for addicts when they ARE ready, let alone options for those who "may" be ready soon. If those suffering from addiction saw more examples of people they knew receiving treatment, then the just *might* seek it for themselves....but without health care coverage or other means of payment...not going to happen.
This is the richest country in the world and there are people hungry every night. There are school children failing tests because they can't answer the question "What meal do we have in the morning?" Because there is no breakfast-lunch-dinner reality in their homes.
So sad. Sadder still the group in our society that would turn a blind eye to hungry, sick, developmentally delayed children. That's quite a statement in itself.

Mom2KCK--nice theory--problem IS, the addicts haven't signed your "don't have kids" contract! Obviously, they are having kids! Look around.

I think that they should be drug tested to receive aid. If they test positive, they don't receive the aid, and they lose their kids until they are clean. Kids should not be in an environment with parents who are on drugs anyways......

Lynn M has said it much better than I ever could so I will just leave it at that.

Sounds good to me. If they can afford to buy illegal drugs (which I have heard are kinda pricey) then they can afford to buy food right?

Well hell, let's test gramma before we send her social security check. You know grannies been hittin the glaucoma medicine. Why don't you take a drug test when applying for a Fannie Mae or HUD home loan. Should a drug test be included when stimulous checks are sent out? Let's test your kids when they apply for a FAFSA grant, and well, since public school is financed through the government, why not test high schoolers before we allow them to enter a classroom. No more free lunch for all these druggies. I know....how about we test congress before sending them thier government check each month. The bitter judgement I see here is pathetic.

Hi E.! Funny, I had to edit this because I thought I was responding to Denise! Hahahaha! Sorry about that!
Most of your responders are not getting the fact that there is NOWHERE for those kids to go when they get taken away. Our foster system is so overloaded that kids are stuck in horrible situations. So, if we implemented drug testing, those parents would still have their kids and no way to feed them at all.

So, my dear E., I move that these posters with their panties in a wad over people who accept state help, should open their homes for children of addicts and put THEIR money where their bigs mouths are. Because, when it all boils down, they are still expecting the government to take care of it so they don't get their pretty little hands dirty.

People want to judge but they don't want to be a part of the solution.

I feel that drug addicts make that CHOICE to do drugs knowing it is addicting. I have family who I make no questions about where the blame lays. If you do drugs, you don't deserve the help of those who work. You also shouldn't have kids. Sorry, that's my take though. If you can't be a responsible person, you shouldn't have kids. Smoking, light drinking, etc are not reasons to not have work. Drug addiction is.

I used to shudder at the idea of not educating the children of illegal workers. Now I shudder at the thought of the entire nation crashing and burning because we were careless with money. We are a sinking ship thowing off cargo so as not to sink. Are there going to be casualties? You bet there are. We are heading into a sad sad state of affairs because we lived beyond our means, and borrowed money from foreigners and from future generations of Americans to do things in this generation that we couldn't afford. E. its a mess, and you are going to see way more heart breaking things happen before its over. I'm not suggesting you shouldn't be sad at the uninteded consequenses that you forsee. Yeck, I'm sad at the unintended consequenses of the entire welfare system!

I think drug testing is NEEDED for people on welfare, they should have done it a long time ago, and if parents are positive for drug use, then take the kid away. I also think if a mother who continues to live off welfare and keep having babies, should be required to have her tubes tied or no assistance.

As for Early Intervention, it's nationwide, every state has the program, it's free to parents from the age 0-3 if your child qualifies.

If a mother or father is addicted to anything and they put that addiction before their child, they don't have the right to be a parent in my book. I've seen children suffer more because their crack-addicted parent is focus on her/himself, and the child doesn't eat, isn't bathed cared for, the parent isn't even at home for days... If they want to get high, they don't deserve free assistance and they don't deserve to have their innocent child/children!

Yes, yes, and yes!!

It's about accountability. We deserve to know that our tax dollars are being spent to help people who need it, not people who make a career out of milking the system.

It's also about truly helping others who need it. If someone is suffering from an addiction, they DESERVE help, not to be stuck in it indefinitely, having children who will be disabled by their choices. This would provide a way to get help for those people and their families.

It frustrates me when people just assume that the parties and states who enact this kind of legislature are doing it to harm others or be elitist. If the goal is altruism, that is best shown by getting people the help they need, providing the means to find employment and earn the dignity that comes from supporting your family. Doesn't everyone deserve this?

Lynn M says it perfectly!!!!!

While in theory, I think it's a fantastic idea, but I wholeheartedly agree with you that only the child will suffer.

Rachel D you said it all!

You are right there, but if they can buy drugs on our tax payers money then they can buy food for their children. If you can't afford them, then why are you having them, so that you can get more money??? Yes you are right, not all ppl on welfare are on drugs but the majority of them are. Why should my tax dollars go to them for free to buy drugs? It sickens me to see ppl out there with their $150 Nike Sneakers, tattoos, dripping in gold and their kids are filthly and clothes are worn and tattered. They are not in it for the kids they are in it for themselves. I have seen it in my own family. They are on welfare, the kids are on welfare. When they turn 18 they say to themselves "why should I work? Mom and Dad didn't and look what they have" Also why do ppl on welfare get free childcare? They don't work so why does this child have to go to daycare. Meanwhile ppl that work are struggling to pay for childcare which is very expensive so that they can continue to work.
My other biggest complaint is the Hasidic woman. NY state does not recognize a jewish marriage therefor they do not consider them married. They are all on welfare. Meanwhile their husbands own diamond stores in the diamond district in NYC. Or they own construction companies. They are more then capable of providing for their families.
I have no problem with someone being on welfare provided that they truely NEED it. This economy is killing everyone and there are ppl out there that are truely hurting and can't make ends meat. Some are working 2 or 3 jobs just to get by. BUT they are working. What about ppl out there working that can't afford medical insurence, what happens to those kids? So when they go for assistance they are told "sorry you make too much" or "sorry there are no funds available" These ppl are more then capable of getting a job they just choose not too. And why should they, they get a free check every month, free food, free rent, free electric.
I am sorry if I sound cold but this subject really bothers me. I am out there busting my hump to provide for my family and MY hard earned money is being given away to other ppl who are too lazy to work. My grandmother worked all her life and put into the system and when she retired she got food stamps only. Every month they would cut her amount. She was taking money from her electric to buy food cause she didn't have enough. Now does that seem fair? Someone who worked all her life can't survive cause the system if being sucked dry? Instead of cutting Medicare they should start thinking about cutting some things in Medicaid.
I saw a woman go into the emergency room cause her thumb hurt. The nurse told her that this is not a clinic. With medicaid they have to pay a co payment for a dr's office visit but emergency room is free. So instead of going to the dr they are going to the emergency room so that they don't have to pay. So instead of going to the dr and paying $100 visit with a $10 copay they go to the emergency room and WE pay $1000 for the visit so that they don't have to pay the $10. That $10 is a pack of smokes for them.

Ok I am going to end this now cause I am getting very aggrevated. As for the children, yes I see your point to a point. But these ppl are just abusing the system and I think the drug testing is the perfect way to start.

I think it is a great idea. I am not sure why you feel it will effect the children especially if they are in the system due special needs. I think you are missing what this is all about. I know so many people that are recieving welfare and they drink and use drugs and don't work or have never tried to work have child after child with no intention of working, they get a break or free internet and cell phones while my husband that has worked in a factory for the biggest part of his life, has lost a lot of hearing from the factory noise, has aches and paines at 56 that most people don't have until they are 90 has to work his rear off to pay the bills and take care of things. I am not trying to mean in any way but come on these people need to get a job and get out of the system. I have had health issues caused from neighbors that had about 6 kids, the Mom has never worked each of the kids had cell phones, they were on section 8. they bought big screen TV's and they had internet the kids went constantly to the store down the street and each bought bags of chips and bottles of pop all day long. She is married and the Man isn't suppose to be there he works 7 days a week and hid in the house, broke out our window the kids destroyed our property which we have worked very hard to have it took months for us to get them out but they are living someplace else off of our hard earned tax money. Does this seem fair to you? People that need help and are doing everything right can't get it due to people like them. I know not everyone on welfare are bad I am not saying that but they need to take a closer look and those that are capable of working should be and learn to pay their own way. SO I SAY a BIG YES to drug testing. My husband had to be for his job why shouldn't they since we are paying their way? Added: I have a friend that works in another state giving out food stamps. She has over 800 clients she has to service each month she told me there is so much paper work to report someone that is abusing the system that they just turn their head so they can get the job done. I do understand that a lot of people sterotype but if they are abusing the system and using their money to trade for drugs then they need to be held accountable. I too like one of the other Moms was a single parent (after a divorce) for several years because I had a job and house and a car to drive I couldn't get any help at ALL if it hadn't been for my family we wouldn't have had food at times. My kids didn't have designer clothes and I didn't drive a fancy car but I take pride in knowing that I did make it with out assistance.