Seeking Help with Fequent Peer (4 Year Old Daughter)

I am a 65 yr old women who has this problem all my life.
My Mother used to get so upset with me and tell me I was to lazy to get up at night to g to the bathroom.
I had bladder repair surgery after my last children, (36) years ago. It helped only a little and even that did'nt last long.
I still have to go frequently and often with no advance warning. If I can't get to a rest room I have no control.
I wear Pose all the time.
I don't have an answer. But I would like to say Please be patient with your daughter and don't be negative with her. It truly may not be her fault.
God Bless

2 moms found this helpful

My son is a frequent one - it has gotten better as the potty training thing became old, but boy this kiddo can pee like a racehorse! It is frustrating to be sure, but it is better than messes. It often means leaving my full cart in an aisle to run him to the bathroom or getting up several times - but at least she's getting up!

If there's no UTI wait it out just a bit more - she may just have to learn control over time. Some people have smaller bladders than others.

A suggestion is to NOT make a fuss about it. From what I have read trying to change a child's bathroom habits can create potty problems long-term. If you refuse to pull over she may pee herself just to get your attention. You could try incentive. Like if she makes it through an entire trip without making you pull over make a big deal over that and give her a sticker or something like that while making it extremely clear why she is getting it. This spurred my kiddos into not having messes in their pants and helped return some semblance of sanity to my home.

I feel your pain - kids do some of the funkiest things ever! I have a potty obsessed one, a neat freak (even water on his shirt means it needs changed!), and a slowpoke at EVERYTHING (even eating ice cream!!!). You sound as busy as me and I truly wish you the best and hope things work out!

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Hi Cheyenne,

I would get a 2nd and 3rd opinion. This is your daughter and you are wanting answers. Getting medical treatment is the way to go....get her checked out. I would do the same. Also, I've said this many times.....maybe there's a possibility that she may have a small bladder(if that's possible). My friend feels that their bladder is small...and my friend goes to the bathroom VERY often. I personally feel that a small bladder could be the result of your daughters urinary experiences. Anything is possible.

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I would wonder if she is never fully emptying her bladder when she does go, or if she is constipated. If she is cutting off finishing each time, she will need to go again soon. Or even if she poops everyday, she may be constipated. This can cause frequent urination.

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I echo everyone who is suggestion a second option. I am not a doctor but it sounds to me like you’ve described a child who is definitely having an issue with a need to urinate and not a behavioral issue. I know there can be a variety of reasons, but I thought I would mention food allergies. I can’t tolerate even small amounts of citric foods or juices without the need to constantly urinate. It's terrible. Our daughter is the same. Our son, is not. You may want to take a look at food allergies too (of course ruling out other medical causes). My issues came on overnight. I did see a urologist, which helped me rule out other medical issues. And, with the elimination of certain foods and juices, I have no symptoms today. Good luck!!!!

1 mom found this helpful

I would look at her intake for fluids. Does she have much to drink after dinner time? Limiting that is very important, as I'm sure you already know. If it's behavioral, work on praising her when she makes it an hour without going. It could be a sign of insecurity, for many reasons. We've recently found out that the flare ups of negative behavior with our 7 and soon to be 5 yr old, is due to not getting enough daddy time, causing insecurities with them both. They were not staying in bed, acting out, like out of control, and more. Look at your home relationships, stresses in the house that you might not think that she may be noticing. They can pick up on the smallest stresses and in result, act out in different ways.

That being said, if it were my child going that often (more than 2 x's per hour, frequently), I most certainly would look at having her tested for juvenile diabetes. I would do this asap, and start calling family members to find out about any familial history of diabetes, to be able to share with the physician, too.

Just in case, I would limit her sweets, and be sure to offer a protein with each snack or meal, until you know for sure. Yogurt, cheese, peanut butter and more all count as proteins. If she happens to be diabetic, this will help control her sugar/insulin spikes, until you know for sure. Most likely, this is not the case... however, to be safe, I would treat it as if it might be, just to be safe, if it were my child.

My 4 yr old had many bouts with frequent urination, but it was not as often as you've stated. She went about every hour and yes, sometimes more, but I think it had more to do with the amount of fluids she was drinking and the size of her bladder, than anything. She'll be five next week and can make it much longer now. :)

Another thought, to avoid the pulling over on the side of the road... maybe a behavioral distraction, is maybe tell her that she can wear a pull up in the car, just in case mommy can't safely pull off of the road. I worry about thinking of you and her on the side of a road and someone coming up and crashing into you, it is not a safe place to be. Don't tell her in a "punishing way", just tell her that daddy said that it's not safe for mommy to pull over, so to be sure that she doesn't have an accident, she can wear a pull up in the car. Maybe offer her a small reward, if she can make it to the next stop (store or whatever), like a small lolly pop or sticker or something to encourage her in a positive way. :)

I didn't mean to write a short book here! lol Hope something here might help. Good luck!

1 mom found this helpful

I have a daughter with food sensitivities, I took her to a naturopath and had her tested, she was sensitive to Dairy products, corn and soy (which now I've found are in everything). My daughter is almost 7 and still frequently wets the bed, I asked the naturopath about it and she said it could have something to do with the food she is eating. The reason is that those foods cause inflamation and can cause the urithra to be swollen. Just my opinion, I hope this is helpful. Worth a shot... T.

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I would get a second opinion! I can't imagine it being behavioral - you can control that area but to a point... you can get her checked for diabetes....hopefully your doctor already checked for that. Even for some reason it could be behavioral.. the question is why. I would want to know if there is some underlying reason.
We need to more of the situation: How much does she urinate?, Any changes in your home/stressors? Daycare? Knew person in her life?
Hope you get answers.

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My son has this same problem, we actually just starting seeing a psychologist regarding some other behavior problems and they are working on this issue as well. Here is what they are having us do:

1) For one day (or half a day) measure how much she is actually going each time she uses the toilet. We used an old measuring cup, but you could probably ask the local hospital for one of those toilet things. Our son was only going a few Tbsp at a time...which is NOT normal for this age. After discovering that he wasn't going as much as he should we moved to step 2:
2) Each time he goes to the toilet he has to hold it in and count. For every 5 seconds he can hold it before going he gets an M&M. This is to help build the strength and control required for allowing the bladder time to fill completely before needing to go to the restroom again. As those muscles get stronger, supposedly he will not go as often because he won't feel the sense of urgency due to lack of control.

From what we were told...much like they need to learn how to use the toilet...they also have to learn how to hold it so they aren't on the toilet all the time. Some kids pick it up as they get potty trained, others need specific instruction for this part of the training.

If it helps any though...I am right there with you...we have tried everything, seen every doctor, had every test. If this doesn't work they are going to test his bladder capacity and check for any "tubing" problems...but those tests are rough...so we are trying this first. Best of luck...I know you need it (cuz I sure do).

PS: This could very well be a behavioral issue according to our therapist...but according to our therapist...training for holding helps fix the commands in the brain and gets them on a more normal path to pottying. We have had every test from MRI (for tethered cord) to blood work for diabetes and other issues. Hang in there...you'll find what works for her eventually...she may just need some more practice holding it in though to strengthen those muscles.

1 mom found this helpful

This happened to my son at that age..he was diagnosed with diabetes several weeks later. (After almost going into a diabetic coma). The wetting may be high blood sugar. There is an easy test for it, and if there is a problem best to get started treating it right away. I would suggest you monitor what she drinks for a couple of days. Ask questions..does your head hurt? Sometimes its just a distraction problem. You might try a few extra minutes at a time..during the day at home for awhile. But, I would definitely get that checked out as we thought our son was a chronic bedwetter, and were prepared to deal with it, but it turned out to be he was diabetic and his body was simply getting rid of the sugars he didn't need. So, definitely get it checked out. Could be as simple as she just doesn't understand the "mechanics" and so doesn't know how to hold it in.

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unfortunately, specialized doctors will only look at the area they are specialized in and often ignore or take for granted systems they are attached to. So, she seems to have a urinary problem, doctors will look at her urinary systems and if all is well, then there must be no problem- they change the norm- the reality is that the urinary systems are attached to and dependent on other parts of the body. Excessive urination could be the body's way of detoxing- there are several reasons her body may need to detox. One is food allergies or more likely intolerances- my daughter had similar problems with frequent and urgent needs to urinate- she also had a heavy bedwetting problem- tests showed no problems with her urinary systems and at 13 the problems persisted- we dicovered she had a gluten intolerance as well as an intolerance to corn - when we took her off of the offending foods the problems stopped- now after almost 3 years of a gluten and corn free diet we never see a problem unless she eats something contaminated with wheat or corn.
Dairy is another major offender when it comes to intolerances that will contribute to this problem.
If it is not a food issue, it could be an environmental toxin that is causing her body to detox.
I would suggest having her tested for food allergies and more specifically intolerances. When speaking to a doctor you need to specifically ask for intolerance testing and insist on it if you are told you don't need it.

Another thing you can try is an elimination diet- this might take more time to find the offender but it can be very helpful in figuring out what her body cannot digest / process.

1 mom found this helpful

This is A BIG diabetic symptom. This should not be ignored no matter what. The other problem might be that she is not voiding properly.

I would find another doctor who is more concerned about her health.

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You might want to look into a homeopathic supplement that aids over-active bladders (for children, of course).

My daughter had frequent urination due to ureteral reflux and it took a long time for her bladder muscles to mature. Has your doctor discussed this with you?

Blessings to you,
J.

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I have studied Acupuncture and Chinese Medicine...and there is an imbalance that can happen in the body where the body is unable to hold urine...its hard to explain how or why from the Chinese Medical perspective...however if that was happening to my child, I would have them treated with acupuncture (there are easy painless methods for children). This also helps bed wetting (I have a few friends who can attest to how much acupuncture has helped their child develop more control over their bowels). This is one of many options out there for you to seek out. It may not be due to a behavioral issue however, she could potentially develop some issues from this sort of problem (embarrassment, feeling of failing, etc.). If money is an issue, definitely check out the Oriental College of Chinese Medicine here in Portland. You can take her to the student clinic where the students are very closely supervised by highly trained Acupuncturists and it only costs around $25!

Good luck!

1 mom found this helpful

Frequent urination is a big sign of diabetes, but more likely, she just has a small bladder and drinks a lot.

Limit soda if she is getting any and avoid drinks after dinner. Try playing a game when she needs to go potty (at home) to see how long she can hold it. This will help her gain control and will exercise the muscles used to hold it. I went through a phase as a young teen where I really had to go every hour... you could almost set a clock by me. It didn't last, and there was nothing wrong. Most of it is in your mind. The more you think about it, the more you have to go.

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Is this something new? Meaning did she have bladder control and now doesn't? If it isn't new then I would think she has never learned control and to hold it so she is acting like an infant. If it is new then I would look into diabetes, UTI, pinched urinary tube, small bladder. If no diabetes then get referred to a urologist who will be more familiar with possible reasons for her symptoms. Is this only at night? If so then I would think it is a delay tactic of going to bed. I know diabetics get up more at night to pee but not a million trips before bed, my husband has diabetes.
Hopefully you are not getting so stressed that it is affecting how you talk to her about it like yelling for something she can't control. I have ben guilty of that when totally stressed out but I try to limit it.
Good luck and good job on using pull ups to keep the laundry down, one less thing in the chaos. Another thought, did this start after the baby came? Maybe she did a little reverting back on you for attention.

1 mom found this helpful

Hello Cheyenne,

Diabetes runs in my family and I have always been told that drinking alot of water and peeing alot is something I have to keep a watch for in my kids. Just a thought.

K

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hi Cheyenne,
I noticed that no one mentioned a condition my son had .I began complaining to his pediatritian about having to go all the time day and night it was interupting our lives .The Dr discovered he had teathered cord syndrome where the end of the spinal cord frayes out and tickles the bladder all the time it can actually be kind of common ,(who knew) it did require a small surgery procedure, but he has not had the peeing problem ever since !
just wanted to share ,cause you never know ...
D. .

1 mom found this helpful

If it's behavioral, then you could modify it with a reward system. But you're taking her to the bathroom with all these frequent urges, so she's got your undivided attention. So, let's build some bladder capacity. She might have a very small bladder. They advertise a medication for women who have frequent needs, maybe she has something similar to that. When she needs to go, see if she can wait 3 minutes longer. Get her an egg timer and see if she can wait longer than the sand in the timer to go to the bathroom. Everytime she does, she earns a sticker. By 4 yrs of age, she should be able to go to the bathroom unaided, so this should work well. At night, decrease the amount of liquids she consumes after 6:30 pm. This will decrease the amount of fluids she has in her system. During the night, wake her up at least once to empty her bladder. While she may not have a UTI, frequent urination is one of the warning signs for diabetes. Has your doctor checked her for that? Is she thirsty a lot? If all else fails, I would take her to a pediatric urologist. Call Children's Medical Center and I'm sure they have one there you can take her to.
Best of luck!!

1 mom found this helpful

If you want to change this behavior down to a normal level of pee-ing, the best way to do it, is to ignore it. Sounds really easy and yet it is hard to do.

Show her where the pull-ups are and how to put them on, where to put the dirty ones. Tell her ahead of time that it is now her responsibility to take care of it because she is smart and strong. Make it a positive thing for her to do. She is a big girl and can do many things now.

You need to let her freak out and not respond to it. Let her handle it. It will be hardest to do at night. If she freaks out when you are reading a story, just stop, don't move, let her handle it. This is going to be hard for you to not move and take care of her.

Remember this is something she can do now. You can give her a reward if she handles it without freaking out if you want, but don't freak out your self!

This is a step along the way to making her self reliant and strong.

Good luck! W.

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You should have her blood sugar checked. A sign of childhood diabetes is frequent urination.

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Hi-

When my daughter was 4 I thought she had a uti-she began peeing so many times during the day and night, completely out of character. I took her to the doctors, they checked her out, traumatized her with a catheter, told us it was not a uti and sent us one our way. I had some weird mom hunch and thought pinworms and that is what it was-gross but easy to deal with. It may be that your daughter has some other thing going on and peeing a lot seems to alleviate whatever it is. Hopefully it is not something serious-

R.

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Hey Sweetie...knew who this was right away...have you tried Cranberry/Blueberry juice and Pomegranate/Blueberry juice. They really taste good and helped a day-care child who had the same problem. Make sure it says "100% juice" on the bottle. Also www.webmd.com/excessiveuniaryproblems has about 2,000,000 sites on it...
Let me know if I can help...

Love You All...

Grandma

1 mom found this helpful

You need to have her seen by a pediatric urologist. That isn't not normal & it is not a behavior thing.

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Hi Cheyenne,
I would definitely get a second opinion just for your own peace of mind! I just had an experience with our regular doctor where I had to fight for a second opinion because I was RIGHT and he was wrong. The ped's are not experts in anything - they just check and dole out referrals and antibiotics.

As for behavioral, it's extremely likely. I have two sons that are about the same age difference of your kids. The 4 yo refused to poop in the toilet! He would go get baby brother's diaper, put it on and demand that I change him. It became a battle. There is definitely competition and attention issues when they are this far apart. The only way I got thru it was to have regular "special time" with the oldest and stop the battle and let it be. He came around eventually!

Good luck!

1 mom found this helpful

Hi,
Has your doctor given you any information on frequent urination or behavorial info? If not, you can email me and I'll send you what my doctor gave me. My almost 4 year old went through this after she had an UTI. Months later, she was still constantly going potty...worse at night where she was going every 5 mins. After I got the info from her Dr., I just read her the material and kept convincing her that she needed to hold her pee and that it was really bad for her to go so often. It finally worked...
____@____.com

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this is a sign of more than just urinary tract health. does she have any flulike symptoms in addition to this? has she been sick at all in the last few weeks? did this problem just start recently? is she chronically, insatiably thirsty? i would HIGHLY recommend checking her blood sugar and having her tested for juvenile diabetes, or taken to an endocrinologist to check for any other issues. it may just be bad luck and a tiny bladder, but if she is having any other issues besides frequent peeing, there's definitely a need for additional checking.

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There are all kinds of things that could cause frequent urination. Diabetes being one of them, but small bladder size being another. I am an adult with the same issue as your daughter. I go 12-15 times a day and celebrate when I can make it through the night without having to get up. As a kid I was tested over and over for Diabetes with all negative tests. The doctors couldn't find anything wrong with me. To this day no one really knows why I go so often and yes... it is very irritating. The not knowing and the having to go all. the. time. Get 2nd and 3rd opinions for your daughter so you know. Even if it is just a small bladder issue it pays to know.

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Have they tested her for type 1 diabetes? Execessive urination (along with thrist) is one of the first signs. My sister became a diabetic at the age of 2 and I still remember how she peed through diapers all the time. I don't want to scare you but please have them check just to be sure it isn't diabetes. Let me know how it goes.

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