Daughter Hates School

Does she have difficulty doing the work? Does she have a hard time focusing? Do you belong to any home schooling groups where she can interact with kids her own age?

She may be ADD or have a learning disability (which has nothing to do with intelligence), and schooling is just a big frustrating mess. She may be beyond what you are trying to teach her and is bored out of her mind. Or she may need more socializing because that is where she gets her energy.

Or it might be a combination of any or all of these.

I would try to nail down exactly why she hates school. Treat the disease, not the symptom, as it were.

Have you considered "unschooling" . . . with one major caveat: no TV, no computer, no Ipad, no Kindle - i.e., no screens until a certain point in the afternoon or evening?

In other words, she'd be doing self-directed learning via the library, cooking, home-making, creative writing (with a real pencil and paper) for her "school."

I homeschool and when my son first started we did a loose form of unschooling (though I still had a tutor) to help him shake the extreme negatives lingering from traditional school.

He's in high school now and we have to stick with a more traditional homeschooling program because he wants to study computer science in college (so needs lots of math and science). But he is doing great!

Good luck - I hope you can work this out for all of you!

ETA: Think about a tutor too, even if she/he is just a college kid.

The majority of people on Mamapedia are not homeschoolers, so... this would be the last place I'd come for advice on that. What you'll most likely get here is criticism and "put them back in school."

There are online support groups in your area. Search Yahoo groups for Ventura County Homeschool support groups. Post your questions there.

The Libertarian Homeschooler on FB - is great
https://www.facebook.com/TheLibertarianHomeschooler

You might want to check out TJED
http://www.tjed.org/

The Learning Success Institute is based in Ventura. They have workshops. Highly recommended. The 2 women who run that place wrote a book that is THE BOMB: DISCOVERING YOUR CHILD'S LEARNING STYLE. You should do their online learning style assessment and that will help you figure out how to best reach your individual learners.
http://learningsuccessinstitute.com/

http://www.amazon.com/Discover-Your-Childs-Learning-Style...

It sounds to me like you are doing what most newbies do: do school at home. And it usually takes parents 1 year or so to realize "this isn't working for anybody!" and change it up a bit.

Your situation is not unique. You are not the only one! Find real support. Online, there must be tons of it.

I'll be interested to hear how homeschoolers of multiple kids this age answer your question. I am not a homeschooler but know several .

I wonder if your oldest child really is at the stage where she needs either to go to a regular school or go to homeschooler classes and activities with other homeschooled kids her own age? Are you part of a homeschooling cooperative? Around here there are cooperatives and these homeschooled kids go to activites at museums and other places, have classes at each others' homes and other locations, have drama clubs, etc. because the parents work cooperatively to provide all this. It does require a lot of driving their kids to and from things, as well as committing to teach and lead certain things themselves. Can you do that, with your younger kids in the mix?

Are you using a specific curriculum for her at home? Is it possible she's bored with it and needs a more challenging homeschool curriculum or one that is more engaging for her?

Do her lessons have to be fit in around the other kids' needs and schedule or do you and she stick to set schooling times? She could be distracted and frazzled if her lessons are being moved around at times in order to accommodate the other kids. That may not be the case in your schedule, I"m just asking.

I would also think farther ahead to when you have four kids all in homeschooling simultaneously with very different educational stages and needs. A very organized and established homeschooling co-op with a good and well-tested curriculum could be an excellent answer but you'll have to do a lot of research and be ready to drive your kids to various places and activities and classes, and play a role yourself in the co-op. That can work, but you need to sit down now and think about whether that is right for you and your kids in a few years' time--picture the future and how homeschooling four at once is going to work and what you need to do to make it work, or whether your oldest might need to be taught by someone other than mom. The resistance you're getting could be as basic as "familiarity breeds contempt" and she might have a personality that will respond better to teaching from an adult who is not mom or dad. That could be at a school or could be through a homeschooling co-op where she gets out much more and has classes with other kids her own age. (You only mention having her sit and focus so I'm assuming she is working just at home right now.)

Hi there,

First, if it were me, I'd be sure to make sure there is nothing holding your daughter back inasmuch as any vision issues, etc.

Here's a question to consider: are you willing to follow through on your asking her if she wants to go to public school? I would keep that as an option, not as a punishment, but because she isn't letting you do your job, which is teaching she and her sister.

My guess is that this has become a habit each morning to whine and gripe. You will need to figure out how to not buy into the habit or the arguing. This might mean that you give her a chair to sit in, out of the way, until she's ready to come to the table and do her work. Maybe even hand her a note which reads: "You are welcome to sit here until you are ready to do your school without complaining. You may not play, you may not call out or interrupt us. Everyone else is wanting to learn. Come back when you are ready to learn too." Sometimes, holding back a favorite toy or activity until the work is completed is another option. For instance, our son only gets his Legos after his chores and homework are done each day. The Legos get put away each night before bedtime on school nights.

Another idea would be to curb her vocal complaining by giving her a book to write her complaints in. Enough self-indulgence and whining ("If you have a complaint, write it in your book; if you want to share it and find a solution to a problem, I'll be happy to look at it with you when schoolwork is done. If you just want to gripe and not show it to me, that's fine too. But you need to keep the negative attitude to yourself.") Sometimes, offering a reasonable outlet without being the sounding board ourselves neutralizes the back-and-forth arguments which rise from a situation like this one.

You might consider working on a behavior plan with her. Write: "When it's time for a task I don't want to do but must do, I can:" and then have her make a list of options for taking care of her feelings AND getting the job done. Have her show you the options and then make another list which features her ideas that you do like and approve of. Maybe she needs to run to the end of the street to 'get her mad out'. Maybe she needs to write in her complaining book for five minutes. Give her some authority over herself in helping her change her attitude.

Of course, there are the 'tough consequences' which sometimes come in handy. If she's wasting your time not doing the work, complaining, whining, make her trade you time. "We spent five minutes listening to you gripe, which means that you now may spend five minutes helping me clean the pantry" or whatever other task needs doing. When my son gets too self-indulgent and is using up my time with stalling, I have him 'pay' that time back to me. It might be less storytime that evening, it might be that he has to come and help me with housework. The point is less that they are doing something completely helpful, and more that we are inconveniencing them. A bit of conversation about the Golden Rule ("Oh, yes, I know you don't want to put silverware away right now, just like I didn't want to sit and listen to you complain for five minutes before your math got started. I guess if we treat others like we want to be treated, it works a lot better for both of us,huh?")

I wouldn't ask her to smile through it, I would ask, however, to be treated as she would like you to treat her. It might be funny for a day to go all Mrs Piggle-Wiggle on her and start emulating HER behavior-- just for a day, to show her how incredibly unpleasant it is. Stall on making breakfast, whine, complain that you HAVE to teach, "gawwwd! This is SO HARD and SO Boring! Why do you have to learn stuff anyway?" I'd employ this only if you want a playful parenting technique... don't 'go there' after she's already started stalling.

You might also throw out a carrot to her-- when she can do a whole week of school without complaining in the morning, there could be a small family reward, like going to a matinee on Saturday or taking her one of one for a cocoa outing and to the library to check out books, just the two of you. Good luck!

It sounds like she has you right where she wants you. 100% attention on her and she's getting attention for bad behavior. Take her to school and drop her off. Don't discuss if she's going or not. Take her kicking and screaming and fighting for her life. Then drive away. She'll see that her job is to go to school to learn and not sit at home taking everyone else's time because that's exactly what she's doing and getting.

This has one end. That is she needs time away from you with a different teacher where the whining and crying and saying "I don't want to" won't work. She won't do it because she knows it won't gain her anything.

At home you're not the teacher, you're mom no matter what. So she treats you like mom and not a teacher. She needs an authority figure to teach her so she needs a formal classroom.

I know there are many pros to homeschooling, but at this point I really think she needs to go back to school.

She needs to routine, the consistency and the structure. She needs consequences for not doing her work and not following the rules. Sometimes kids need that from someone other than Mom. I really think this would be good for her.

"I can't coddle the eight year old and spoon feed her the lessons all day long. I truly wish I could."

I don't think you really meant to say it like that. I think you know that that approach would actually be really, really bad for her. You don't want to teach her that the world revolves around her and that she can have everything her way. She needs to realize that she needs to follow the rules just like everyone else.

Is it possible you feel a little guilty that you can home school her and make her happy and make her behave all at the same time? (Welcome to Motherhood, right?) Because I struggle with that all the time, and I only have 2 kids and they go to public school!

If you really want to continue homeschool her, I hope you get some ideas. I think I would send her to a school and see if that makes a difference. I really think the structure would do her a world of good.

I know nothing about homeschooling but a friend of mine does this with her kids. Her youngest is BORED out of his mind. She decided to (sorry, not sure of the exact way to say this) incorporate MORE time devoted to it because he needed the stimulation. It involved (I think) 3 days a week with homeschoolers in a structured classroom where he does worksheets at home on Tuesday and Thursday. It has helped him a lot. Just something to think about.

did you let her de-school? it's a process that can take a few months sometimes.
if you did, i'd follow dana's advice and let the charter school go. some kids do great with lots of guidelines and boundaries, others flourish with unschooling.
i was philosophically an unschooler, but when the rubber met the road, my kids preferred structure. so we compromised.
i think if you approach it in a different way it can totally change the feel. yes, it's our job to help our kids figure out how to deal with stuff they don't want to do. but we don't want their LIVES to feel like burdens.
if this were my daughter, i'd take a deep breath and step back. i'd let her do whatever she wants (obviously with family chores and participation still in place) and not put any 'school' requirements on her whatsoever.
very few kids actually eschew learning. and doing 'nothing but play' will in most cases begin to pall after a few weeks. (or months. which will make you nut up. i know.)
but she needs to explore what 'doing nothing' feels like.
with my kids, anxiety over being perceived by their homeschooling friends as 'stupid' took care of it without my having to bite the bullet and insist. on separate occasions they both came to me and said 'geez, i don't like saxon math but i'm getting scared about not learning more. let's go look at other curriculi.'
she's your oldest, so you don't yet have a platform of experience from which you can really let go and trust your kid. and true to tell, it DOESN'T always work out.
but it usually does.
do you think you can squinch your eyes tight, and let her free range for a few months, and just focus on your littler ones? it's an experiment for sure. but i have watched it play out over and over again, over decades. it usually results in a kid who bursts through the miasma of 'i hate school' and discovers (along with her HS parent) just what her learning style is, and how to make the magic happen.
good luck!
khairete
S.

I did not homeschool. So I don't know a lot of the "how it works" things. I think thought that maybe if it is possible to switch up your a day a little then do that. You don't say is dad in the picture? does he go to work in the daytime? if so can you do the school work after school when he gets home? then he could deal with baby and preschool stuff while you do the homeschool stuff with the older kids. Is it a matter of have to do so many hours in a week? or day? can you do 2 long days and then nothing the others? do you stick to a we do school from 9-3 every day at home? and during that time is it sit here while I do the baby, wait sissy needs a bottle, someone is at the door etc? or are you actually able to spend the time teaching them? I give a lot of credit to parents who can do this. I did a preschool curriculum with my daycare kids. but they were pretty much all on the same age level. so not babies at the same time as teaching a 10 year old.

your last paragraph is a problem. Not all kids like school and its ok to have a bad attitude so long as she gets the work done. And you might have to say suck it up Suzy. you have to do this and we are not moving on til its done. and then the biggie is you have to stick to it. the paragraph where you say she goes 2 times a week for enrichment and does great there sort of suggests that she might do better in a regular school atmosphere. not sure. I hope it works out.

Perhaps you could consider a more student directed, almost unschooling approach. It sounds like when home schooling is simply sitting at home doing worksheets at a table that it has all the cons of public school but none of the pros (socialization, interaction with teachers specifically trained in each area, art, music, gym).

If you picked a science unit and learned about it by going to your local museum, making observations on that information, going on nature walks to learn more about what you are studying and then doing experiments to demonstrate concepts it couldn't fail to be more fun.

English - learning by reading books, visiting your local library and interacting with the librarian, visiting your museum or history center (or looking together online) to learn more about the author. I am sure there are lots of other creative ideas.

You and she need to get out of the house every day as part of her schooling. And really there is an educational aspect to most of everyday life. LOTS of math can be learned at the supermarket. She can help make a list of what you need. She can read recipes and calculate what ingredients you will need and how much. She can learn money and to calculate change. There is very little second grade math that is not also real world math when you think about it.

Second graders should NOT be forced to sit and focus for long periods. The public schools in many areas are finally figuring this out. My son's second grade (public school, good district) class rarely sits for more than 1/2 hour at a time. They are constantly getting up, forming groups to work in, moving from one class to another (music, art, gym, Spanish). They have figured out that many many kids learn best visually or kinetically, not by sitting and listening to a single adult drone on.

Nervy Girl and Rocio D had some good ideas.

Having done "home" (virtual online at home) school with my kids one year (2 years ago) I can relate to some of what you are talking about. A lot of what you describe sounds like it comes from the habits in your relationship with your daughter. I had similar issues with my son for a time. Our relationship just doesn't work well with me being his teacher. Our personalities don't fit in those roles very well.
It's like having the worst teacher ever (style wise) FOREVER...
My kids are back in public school now. I'm not suggesting that is what you need to do, but you DO need to make some changes in the dynamics of your relationship with your daughter. If you can't do that, then you can't effectively teach her, and she can't effectively learn from you. It doesn't mean you are bad or wrong, just that the current status quo doesn't work.

And I get that that is what you are here asking... I just want to be clear about the fact that it is YOU that have to take the lead in changing the dynamic. Nervy Girl gave you some good suggestions to try towards that end.

You may think that it doesn't apply here, but I'd also recommend you read 1-2-3 Magic, as a lot of what creates these kinds of dynamics with our kids are when WE over-explain our position to try to change our kids' minds. We can't "convince" them to do better. We have to create a scenario where THEY benefit from making different/better choices rather than keep pushing us.

Good luck.

I am sorry you are having a difficult time with your kids.
I home school 2 kids (14 and 8 yo). I have been doing this for the past 7 years, I am sure that there are many people out there who have more experience than myself, but I have learned a few things that might help you, and share my point of view in home educating:
Being a teacher (certified or not)and a mom all day long implies discipline from the start. It doesn't have to be harsh or boring, just firm and consistent as with any other parenting issue.
I suggest you to sit down with your kids and talk firmly. You will need to remind them that school is not a choice, it is part of life, it is important and whether they like it or not, they are going to school here or there. Tell them that they do not have to be perfect, but they have to be their best. Select a room (by the kitchen, family room, etc) exclusively for studying, ask them for help in organizing everything: let them participate and get involved. Set a schedule with those subjects you will teach, and take a couple of breaks so the kids drink water, have a snack, go to the bathroom or run outside,etc. Keep the schedule on the wall (fridge,etc) where everyone can see it and be informed what come next; you also can include in there field trips (visit to a museum, playground, park, pool, mall, etc) ,which they will earn by being obedient and having a good attitude during class. Keep it fun, smile and laugh with them; nicely make corrections when they make mistakes, encourage them and praise them when they are doing great and studying/working hard (the last one is especially important). I mean, start over, plan ahead, and review what you are teaching.
To make things more interesting and encourage them to behave, take your kids to the library (once or twice/week)and do your school there for a couple of hours, you may want to do this often, it is a perfect place to teach them gradually to behave, be quiet, and focus. After that, have lunch together somewhere else (fast food restaurant, picnic at the park, etc) Take all the advantages of home schooling, and teach them that is fun and interesting to learn and know so many things! Join HS groups, there are many; visit places, enroll your kids in sports or activities they may enjoy, etc. The lack or success of freedom or socialization depends only on how you as a parent manage things for your kiddos, no more no less.
Every time they refuse to do school, do not use the concept of sending them to public school, it is not OK and not fair to those good kids who attend PS, and whose parents chose that option, instead take a big breath
and switch to something new immediately. Tell them calmly and firmly: "Sue and Mary, will stop here, go and have a snack, will resume class later". Do not say anything else and and stop there until you feel calmer. It will also allow your children to take a breather and enjoy the break yourself.
Home schooling is not easy and it is not for everyone. It is a wonderful journey and great option, but not without prickles..." No effort that we make to attain something beautiful is ever lost.” Be strong, discipline and plan ahead yourself. Take one or two days off whenever necessary, but do not overdue, choose a time that best accommodates your kids and yourself, and since your kids are little yet, do not try to teach them lots of subjects, start with the basic subjects, and with the passing of time add some others essentials and interesting like languages, gardening, finances, etc, If it is easier for you, find a good curriculum (pm me if you need hep with this) many give you course plans, and lots of guidelines.
Last but not least, consider that your children will absolutely benefit from being home schooled in a flexible and rich environment, but the informality of homeschooling many times works against if you do not set clear rules, a nice routine, and real expectations.
Good luck!

Is there a compromise that can be achieved through the charter? i.e. is there anyway that she could homeschool with the parent of another 8 year old (presumably same curriculum), and still attend the 2x a week enrichment. You might have to pay the other parent some small fee, but it might prove cheaper and more efficient than either private school, or home schooling by you.

Best,
F. B.

It sounds like you gave great thought to how to educate your child. You rejected the public school for good reasons. You picked a good homeschool program. But it's still not working and sounds like the struggle with her is creating obstacles to meeting your others kids' needs.

I know that some families homeschool and even unschool successfully, but when a child is resistant to all forms of education, there might be learning difficulties or emotional issues that need to be investigated and addressed first.

A friend is a fellow teacher, but her 11 year old son has such severe anxiety about academic performance that they thought he was a suicide risk. He is medicated now and has really improved, but he is still very resistant to trying to learn because of fear of failure.

Have you done lap books?

I have a difficult 8yr old daughter too. What has worked for me is having someone else talk to her about her attitude and place as a child. Last year her 1st grade teacher took her out to lunch and had a long talk with her about respect and what a parents & childs roll is in life. The teacher was the pastors wife at the private school she attended. So her discussion was very bible based. My daughter changed for the good and it lasted for several months. There is a fantastic article that I came across at gotquestions.org look under rebellious child.

You have so much going on but with her personality you really need to be consistent with her. I hope you look at the website I provided, there is a lot of great insight on how to handle a strong willed child.

Blessings

How about a typed assignment sheet each day that she can check off when she completes a task? Also, does she get time off to play?
Maybe having "school hours" would make it less awful for her.

My honest opinion is your 8 year-old sounds...just like mine! :)

Hates going to school. But would NEVER do any work at home. So that would be struggle for me, too. No way. I send him to school and he learns. We also have a baby, toddler and 2 preschoolers.

If you are fighting all the time, I would send the children to the regular (free) school. You are a caring mom. Your children will do fine academically. They sound like they need to get out, and you need a breather.
I don't even have mine home in summer. They'd just sit around and forget anything they learned! So camps it is.

Wow. I don't know.
Personally? I'd move to a better district.
What you're describing is why I LAUGH at my son when he says he'd like to be homeschooled. No WAY would he be any different that your daughter.
And that sounds like UNfreedom to me.

Tutor?