Are My exH and His Girlfriend Out of Line?

Are your kids seeing a therapist? That's the first thing I would do is make sure they have that support in place because it sounds like what they have to deal with is a lot. Ideally, you should talk to your ex about that your child heard them together during the camping trip, and although they like his gf, the PDA that they talk to you about is making them uncomfortable and they are asking you a lot of questions regarding the two of them that you cannot answer. Ideally, you can do this in a calm, "hey I just wanted to let you know, so you are able to start a conversation with the kids on this topic yourself" that will give him pause and he can at least think about these things and be reminded his actions do have impact on the children. But since you have panic attacks in his presence, this will be difficult. I think you need to get some help for yourself on that first because you will have to co-parent together for years, and in the kids' best interest, you should be able to communicate with your ex

I think a lot depends on what's in your divorce decree and visitation arrangements. Was there any clause in there about introducing new partners and sharing a bed/having someone sleep over? It should be the same for both parents, whatever you agreed upon.

I do think it's inappropriate for them to make out all the time if your ex hasn't explained to them who she is to him. Actually, I think it's inappropriate anyway for adults to engage in private behaviors with children watching, especially since your divorce is so recent and the kids aren't even used to the parents being separate entities yet. I'm a stepmother and I never would have done this. But he's really playing with the kids' emotions because he's introduced a woman who is joining in on parental things (school night and staying over) but who may not be around for a long time - that tempts the kids to get attached to her and then maybe have her disappear if they break up.

Re the camping trip: are you saying the 2 adults were sharing a bed and the kids were sleeping separately, or are you saying all were in one bed? Either way, if it's a camper or a tent, there should be no hanky panky. But no way should your son/daughter be in one bed together anyway, nor should either child be in the same bed as the adult of the opposite sex - not at this age. They aren't 2 years old, you know? So I think it's okay to say to your ex, "You know, Jimmy woke up and saw you doing some adult things with your gf, and he was very uncomfortable about that. What is your plan regarding intimate behaviors when the kids are in the same room?"

I think it's inappropriate for her to be at school night. She has no role in their education. Sporting events or musical performances are something else, but I still think it's too soon for the kids to see him as part of a couple only, and not as custodial Dad. The question is, what can you do about it? You have to start with your lawyer to go over what's in your agreement. But the way to handle it without being the "b**** ex-wife" is to point out that the rules apply to both of you, and that you are not bringing anyone else into their lives right now, and you are keeping your adult private life very private right now. (Your ex doesn't have to know whether or not you are seeing someone - just that the kids haven't met anyone.)

Where I think you need some professional help is in dealing with panic attacks when you see your ex. I don't know the background - was he abusive? Did he put you through emotional hell? You are going to have to see him at children's events, and you absolutely cannot function if you are in the middle of an attack. There are various therapies that can help with this very real and paralyzing condition and I hope you will speak to an appropriate professional. Start with your doctor and go from there.

Your ex seems to be throwing himself into this new relationship.
Of course it's too fast.
It seems like he doesn't want to spend alone time with the kids and I guess I wouldn't be surprised if this turns into 'his time with the kids' becoming the girlfriends time with the kids.
Girlfriend is not replacing you so much as she's replacing him as far as kids time goes.
How much of a grudge match is your divorce?
If he's truly not interested, why does he want custody at all? - probably no child support payments if it's a 50/50 split.
And keeping them away from you %50 of the time might be a kind of a spite thing too.
He's just recruited a nanny with bed-warmer options for him.

No, it's not stable for the kids.
Of course anything you say to him will mean he's successfully pushed your buttons.
It might be better for you to discuss the issue with your lawyer and see if the custody/visitation can be modified due to the kids having nightmares or maybe some counseling with everyone to achieve some better co-parenting can be ordered.

In the meantime assure your kids that no matter who else in in their dads life - YOU will always be in your kids life.
There's always some major adjustment for everyone after a divorce - it takes time for everyone to get comfortable with it.

Was this not contemplated in your agreement? Did you not have to take a parenting class to get divorced that covered this? Some pretty standard provisions are that neither parent has overnight guests who are romantic partners until they have been dating for a significant period of time (like 6 months) and that the other parent is told of the relationship before the children are told, so that the other parent is blindsided and has a chance to get used to the idea for a hot minute before the kids know.

I'm going to guess that your agreement didn't include this? Whatever the case, the horse is already out of the barn.

If you and your ex are civil, I would have a sit down with him and explain your concerns - that this is too much, too soon for the kids; that they should have time alone with him without his girlfriend; that PDAs are uncomfortable for the kids; that any vacation arrangements need to include appropriate sleeping arrangements for everyone, and that does not include kids in bed with a horny couple; that she needn't be at every event, etc.. Ask him to put himself in your shoes and imagine that this is what they kids had to deal with at your house. Their relationship is on fast-forward and stats show that it's likely to not last, so now the kids have to get to know and bond with this woman at warp speed and chances are, she'll be the first of many. He needs to put his kids first and cool it on his dating life when he has the kids - with 50/50 custody, he has plenty of time to grow this relationship in private.

If you can't speak civilly, then perhaps a joint session with a mediator or counselor is in order. Assume that this is an innocent blunder and that he's just clueless about navigating the rules of engagement for new relationships, but IMO, this is the kind of thing that is important to handle well for the sake of the kids. He needs to understand that this is too much for them, too soon, and learn healthy ways to introduce a new relationship to his kids.

FWIW it sounds like your entire separation and divorce were very fast. In my state, you can't get divorced that quickly and both parents have to take a class that talks about this kind of thing. My ex moved out two years ago and we still haven't filed an agreement yet. Once we file, it will be several more months before it's considered final. You and the kids haven't had any time to adjust, and now this? Too fast.

His relationship does not concern you unless she is being abusive towards the kids, and it sounds like she is not. If they ask you tell them that you don't know about your Ex's relationships and that they need to ask him. That is it.

Clearly this is an important relationship and they are more serious then you realized, but there is nothing you can do about that, or should do. Be glad she is taking and interest in your kids and clearly supports him being a father.

Was he an absent kind of dad? Some guys do find a new girlfriend very quickly and one of the reasons is they like having someone who will be good with the kids. As you say, she seems to be better than him with the kids.

A friend of mine went through this and thought - ok well at least they are probably better cared for while at dad's than they would be otherwise.

As for the smoochy stuff - yuk. I hear you. I think being in a camper with a new girlfriend of dad's is odd to begin with - especially if all in same bed (?) I guess maybe that's how it was set up.

It really depends on how well you and your ex communicate. I think I'd feel ok to bring that one up - just to say your son had concerns about what he saw and maybe just be sensitive to the fact that kids are still adjusting to the divorce. I think that you would sound like a concerned parent rather than as you say, the b**** ex-wife.

As for the school night thing - we have seen this too, where the new girlfriend comes along and everyone wonders what she is doing there, as not her kids .... again, maybe your husband feels better having her there than going alone. It is weird, I agree. Maybe girlfriend is trying to show she cares about the kids and is ok with taking on that role ... who knows, but yes, inappropriate place and time to make that statement.

Unfortunately - I think sucky husbands tend to make sucky exes and you can probably expect some nonsense - the important thing is to just handle it well with the kids - as you seem to be doing. Your ex will likely call you out as being unreasonable ... if you can get some provisions, as others have mentioned, for custody etc. then that would be worth following up on. Good luck!

I imagine the girlfriend wants to be at exhibit nights, etc. with her boyfriend, even if it's an event for his kids, because she is now a part of his life, and the kids are his, so they are a big part of his life. Eventually yes, any boyfriend or girlfriend will be accompanying their new significant other and their kids for certain occasions, to show support to their significant other and the kids. I do think the transition from "friend" to "girlfriend" all taking place in 4 months may be too fast and confusing for the kids, especially if he never clarified that things have moved on from the friendship level and they are now dating. It can cause confusion for the kids, who may be thinking that making out with friends is appropriate and normal. I think he should have said "Guys, remember Christa? I hope you liked her, because I have asked her to become my girlfriend and she accepted."

I do find the bed sharing thing to be extremely odd, I would not do that, even if the man is my boyfriend for a long time, and making out while in bed and the kids are squeezed between us? No, just, no. Kids and adults should have their separate beds after a certain age. They are both entitled to their own space and privacy. I guess if I were to introduce my daughter to a boyfriend, which may eventually happen, I'd wait a while to see if the guy is boyfriend material and may stick around for the long run. Then yes, I would introduce him as a friend, so she has some time to warm up to him. The friend would join us for dinner etc., he would not be sleeping over or walking around the house in his underwear though, nor would there be fondling, foreplay, etc. For him to sleep over around my kid, I'd want to wait quite a while.

There is no reason why the girlfriend could not just sleep over when the kids are in your custody, and whenever it's his turn, then he ought to tell the girlfriend that they cannot sleep together that weekend when he has the kids, but she is welcome to come to dinner and a movie with them. They can sleep together on the weekend and weekdays when the kids are at your place. She isn't going to die if she sleeps alone 1-2 nights a week, or doesn't have sex on those days. I'm sure she managed sleeping alone just fine until your ex came into her life.

I'd be understanding and willing to accept such an arrangement for some time if I were dating a divorced man with kids. I would not pressure him to introduce me as his girlfriend and shove the fact we sleep together down their throats. Kids can become attached to a new girlfriend, or on the other hand, may also become resentful of someone entering their lives so quickly without getting a chance to warm up to her or voice their opinion. Making out with dad like that may make them think she is a floozy. Unfortunately, it's too late to establish that boundary at this point. Going to a therapist with the kids and clarifying any questions or confusion they have at this point would not be a bad idea.

Yes, you need to get over it. It's not your business and you need to sit where you can't see them. When the kids ask you questions tell them that you and their dad aren't together anymore and that they'll have to ask him.

As for the physical contact while the kids are in sight, there is a little smooching and there's the stuff that's private.

I'd ask the kids a little bit what they saw and then perhaps send the ex a note or something that tells him that doing XXXX and XXXXX and XXXXX in front of the kids is not appropriate and that you would like for them to please limit that sort of contact to each other to behind closed doors. There's a line but all sorts of families go camping and parents kiss, and snuggle, and sleep intertwined. They don't get on top of each other and put their hands where they can't be seen. There's a difference.

If they weren't heavy making out then you shouldn't say anything at all.