Adult daughter chooses to be an atheist. I accept and respect her choice although I don't agree with it. My problem is that she is constantly bashing and denigrating all things and everyone Christian in long diatribes on social media. She is the first to speak out very loudly if anyone belittles others for bullying based on race, religion, sexual orientation, etc., etc., but continues her cyber attack on Christianity. When I pointed out the hypocrisy, I received a long public tongue-lashing on social media.
I am hurt and embarrassed.
Is it time to guit sending Christmas gifts and providing financial help when asked?
She is an adult and entitled to her opinions. I think it was wrong of her to bash you on social media… uncalled for.
You should not feel obligated to send gifts… you “owe” her nothing.
As for financial help… HE$$ no. Remind her that she is an adult and should be financially responsible without your help.
I am MORE than willing to help my daughter if she ever needs my help but the day she acts like she is entitled to my help or that I owe her will be the day it all stops.
Fortunately she has her dream job and there is no need for financial because she was raised learning how to be financially responsible.
How old is your daughter? Sounds like she has a lot of anger and hatred. Also, she needs to learn to use social media responsibly. It can be seen by anyone, including her employers and future employers – people are getting fired over stuff posted on social media.
If you love your daughter and want to send her a gift, do so. If you’re too hurt by her tongue-lashing to want to send her a gift, then don’t. Do what your heart tells you.
I wouldn’t give her a Christmas gift to her because, at it’s very core, Christmas is a Christian holiday. I don’t give Christmas gifts to my Jewish and Muslim friends either.
And if my adult child publicly bashed me, I would have a hard time supporting her financially. If she wants the benefits of being in a family, she needs to accept the responsibility of treating her family with respect.
Nobody should be belittled on social media. When you “pointed out the hypocrisy,” did you do it privately, or on her public page?
I don’t think her choice of atheism is something you should agree with or not agree with. It’s not your choice, your decision, your belief. So maybe if she felt more truly accepted by you (as opposed to “I accept her choice although I don’t agree with it”), she’d be less angry. But maybe she’s just a very unhappy person in other ways. It’s unclear why she chooses to bash Christian beliefs/practices only, but maybe there’s more to the story - maybe she feels pressured by her place of employment (do they not cover birth control, for example?) or some in the political realm (imposing beliefs on some of our laws, for example?).
If she’s an adult and responsible for her own life/decisions, then I think she can be responsible for her financial well-being. Hopefully you have raised her this way and your refusal to help won’t be perceived as retribution for her beliefs, though.
If she doesn’t celebrate Christmas, I see no reason to send her a gift, especially if she’ll be elsewhere for the holiday. If your family observes it more as a religious holiday (church, carols, Nativity scenes) and not as a historic or secular event (Santa, yule logs, trees), that’s fine. If you’re pretty secular about Christmas, then I’m not sure, since I haven’t heard your daughter’s speeches and I don’t know what she’s upset about - if she’s upset about holier-than-thou attitudes, then excluding her because she’s a non-believer will probably give her more ammunition.
I am Jewish so I don’t send Hanukkah gifts to my Christian family. I do send them Christmas gifts because that’s what they celebrate. I send birthday gifts even if it’s not my birthday, you know? If you feel you need or want to send her a little something, I’d send something with a “Happy New Year” card with absolutely no evergreen trees or poinsettias on it, and wrapping paper that’s purely secular (maybe something glittery with confetti since it’s hard to find something that says H.N.Y.). Otherwise, I’d send her just a birthday gift every year unless you know for sure that she celebrates a particular holiday.
Bottom line, I’d keep things distant and off social media, let things cool down, and calmly (very calmly) respond if she complains by saying, “I didn’t want to upset you by forcing Christmas on you, dear.” And I’d invite her to visit when there is absolutely no holiday of any sort going on, including Valentine’s Day and Halloween and everything else.
It seems to be a case where social media hurts more than helps.
If you don’t like what she writes - don’t read it - you can unfriend her.
I’d keep contact with her by talking directly to her over the phone or in person.
If you want to get her a gift - a small something is fine - even a bag of groceries would do.
As far as providing financial help - try taking religion out of the equation.
Do you want to help her?
Can you help her without damaging your own finances?
Is helping her enabling her to do any damaging behaviors to herself or others?
Religion may not be her thing - but if it’s yours then turning the other cheek and helping is part of it - not to the point of being a doormat but use your best judgement.
I honestly get part of her rant - religion is often shoved down your throat whether you are into it or not.
You can still be kind and a good person and not be religious.
But she doesn’t really seem all that nice - she tries to pick fights, has a lot of anger, a chip on her shoulder and seems to want to dare people to like her in spite of what ever she is spewing.
Disengage from that - don’t play her game.
In the mean time it’s a good thing Jesus loves her because everyone else thinks she’s a jerk.
First, why in the world would you point out her hypocrisy on social media? Why didn’t you pick up the phone and just call her? In any event, if she is posting stuff you don’t like on Facebook (or wherever), you know you don’t NEED to be friends with on those sites.
Second, so your plan is to “punish” your child for being outspoken in her beliefs. I’m not standing up for her at all - her behaviors seem very oppositional and over the top, but what does have have to do with gift giving? I’m guessing that when you gifted in the past, it wasn’t Christian only related gifts, or given the in spirit of Christianity only, but rather in the matter of tradition of your family. Why are you equating the two now? Just because it suits your needs?
Finally, certainly it may be time for your daughter to not need financial support any longer, and I personally am a firm believer of financial responsibility, but if you are only withholding support because of her outspoken beliefs, then you are only stooping to the same level in an extremely passive aggressive way. Either stop helping her because she is an adult, or because you can no longer afford it, but basing your help on you not liking her behaviors? Seems a little, well like a Dictatorship . . .
Perhaps family counseling should be sought to discuss your daughter’s irresponsible behavior on social media and your need to control her?
If she celebrates a secular version of Christmas, which many folks do, and will be joining your family for a holiday celebration then no, I would not deny her a gift. There are a lot of valid problems with how Christianity is being practiced/preached and I find a lot of the anger justified. What you’re proposing sounds petty…and not very Christian.
I wouldn’t be providing financial support to an adult child anyway unless there was a good reason for it.
It sounds like this is straining your relationship. As the more mature adult with a longer view than your child, I think the right thing to do is a) disengage from her on social media b) try to understand her concerns with some aspects of how Christianity has been hijacked by people who use it as a tool to advance their own narrow worldview (racism, sexism, intolerance of LGBTQ folks, etc.) and perhaps try to find middle ground where you agree c) have patience.
My siblings and I were all raised Catholic. One of my sisters and I have a lot of issues with the Church and are pretty vocal about it. She hasn’t considered herself Catholic for years. I still identify as Catholic and raise my kids that way but am pretty vocal about not agreeing with a lot of Church teachings. One of my parents finds this irritating, the other one is a die-hard Catholic and will defend any and everything the church does. We’re at a point where we agree to disagree and, like politics, we really don’t discuss it. It’s taken a long time to get there. My parents and older sister had many fights about this over the years. No one’s mind changed, but they’ve learned to just let it go. Hopefully you and your daughter can get there in time.
I’m not sure long diatribes on social media are bullying - do you mean on her Facebook?
I have ‘friends’ on Facebook who post things I don’t agree with. I just unfollow them or skip over those posts.
I don’t consider it bullying.
I wouldn’t (personally) have engaged on social media. People who feel strongly about these matters (enough to get into it on social media) kind of like discussions and feel passionately. Heated debates are their things.
If you’re sensitive - at all - then don’t get involved. Just respect she feels differently, and don’t comment. You engaged in it.
I find that is a whole lot of drama personally - why I don’t engage it in on social media.
Is it time to quit sending gifts? I’m not sure what that has to do with anything? You send gifts to show people you’re thinking of them, don’t you? You could instead spend time together and do an experience ‘gift’. I don’t know about the financial aid part. I would only do that if I felt comfortable and not taken advantage of. Every situation is different.
Good Lord if you don’t like your daughter’s opinions on social media then stop following her. As far as presents and money go that should be about what you WANT to give, not how much she deserves, or not.
Hm. I’m an athiest and I think having faith in a religion is nice and so is Christmas…yes there is bad in everything, but it is too bad your daughter cannot see the good in things and focus on that. Plus I’m bummed…she is giving athiests a bad name. Your daughter has one of those personalities where she is overly opinionated and too outspoken and rude to other people. Personally, I think you should hide her on FB so you don’t see her posts. That is what I do with the really opinionated people. Actually, I don’t hardly use FB anymore. I recommend going off of it! As for gifts - give her a gift if you want to. Tell her “Happy Festivus”. Or say since you are anti Christmas I am guessing you do not want Christmas gifts? Does she give you a gift? As for financial assistance…how old is she? Most adults stop getting financial assistance from their parents at about age 18-24.
Your daughter is an adult and needs to make her own decisions regarding her faith life (or decision not to have a faith life) and regarding her use of social media. It sounds like she’s making some unwise choices, but sometimes people need to learn things the hard way.
I think some people view that as a sign of strength and maturity … that they are courageous enough to state their beliefs. That’s unfortunate because people are usually more impressed by others who are able to balance being confident in their beliefs while also respecting those who disagree.
I have to say, I don’t think this has anything to do with Christmas. I am a practicing Catholic. I do understand the meaning of Christmas on multiple levels, and it is an important part of my faith life. But I also have friends who celebrate Christmas as more of a fun time of year to give presents to family and friends. I would never not wish them a Merry Christmas or not send them a card or gift just because they may not share my religious views on the holiday.
It sounds like this is so much more about your relationship with your daughter. I don’t have adult children, but my thought is, give her a present because you are her mother, you love her and you genuinely are wishing her a happy and peaceful holiday and a fabulous new year.
If you want to help her out financially, that’s fine. If you feel she doens’t appreciate it or isn’t being responsible, that’s ok, too. She’s an adult, and it’s probably time for her to stand on her own two feet. Then again, many of us need a little help from time to time, and it’s not always cut and dry whether you’d be helping her or encouraging irresponsible behavior.
But don’t not give her a present just because you don’t see eye to eye on religion. This is a Christian holiday, but Christianity is all about loving and accepting each other, even when we disagree. Don’t point out her hypocrisy. Model a life of non-judgement.
Tricia
Welcome to mamapedia and social media - where people can be “keyboard warriors” and not say the same thing to your face.
I would stop helping. She’s an adult. She can fend for herself. If she asks why you aren’t funding her anymore. You can tell her that you are not her personal ATM nor her door mat for rude behavior on social media.
I wouldn’t send her a gift for Christmas or her birthday. I would call her on her birthday to acknowledge her but otherwise? I’d be done.
I am Wiccan, I practice witchcraft and celebrate Yule, December 21. Yule practices are very much the same as Christmas: a tree - gifts - celebration of lights etc.
I was raised Catholic and my kids still are practicing Christians and celebrate Christmas. I respect their views and they respect mine, we exchange gifts.
There are something like 29 separate holidays celebrated around December 25th, Yule and Christmas only two, you also have Hanukah, Kwanza and others I don’t know. The funny thing is they all celebrate the same thing. Peace on Earth - the return of the light - gift giving etc… Do a little research and find a holiday that comes closest to your daughter’s beliefs and celebrate that one with her.
My best advice is don’t bash her or disrespect her beliefs, she is free to believe what she wants. Accept her for who she is, a gift is an exchange of love and we can never get enough love.
Do you love your daughter only when she accepts your beliefs. Christmas gifts are a way to show love.
Actually the belief that Jesus was born in a manger on this day can be a part of Christmas or not. Christmas as a holiday is based on pagan holidays. One of my aunts did not celebrate any holiday because they come from paganism.
I’m a Christian the views celebrating Christmas.a way to remember.Jesus but also to remind us to follow his commands. Jesus accepted and loved everyone. Do you remember when he defended the harlot? He said something like let he who is without sin cast the first stone. There are many verses telling us to love each other. He didn’t say love only those who believe the same way as us.
Of course you’re worried that your daughter will go to hell. Do you really think that judging her, critisizing her, not giving a gift and not continuing to help her financially will help her become a Christian.
If your family has not followed Christ’s precepts I understand her decision to be an atheist. Did your relationship with your daughter depend on how she acted? Seems you’re withdrawing your love because she’s an athiest. Were you and her father committed to being loving or on doing the “right” thing?
I understand why you choose to fight with her. I fought with my Dad because he was rigid in what he believed, not just with religion. I fought because I wanted to be heard. I wanted him to recognize that I was my own person with my own beliefs. With counseling, I learned that if I respected myself and my values I didn’t have to convince anyone I was right.
I also learned that it takes two to fight. I choose to not fight. I walk away from fights. Because I love Jesus and myself I will love the unlovable. I will take care of myself by accepting and respecting others.
Over 70 years, I learned that I cannot change anyone except me. I’ve spent a number of years being unhappy. One of my counselors asked me, would you rather be right or or happy. I made a conscious decision to be happy.
Re: financial assistance. My daughter is 38 and I give her money when she needs it. I don’t ask what she’s going to use the money for. When she was in her twenties I did want to know because she was young and learning. We talked about money management. I gave her money because she was learning a trade and had a baby.
I believe giving money is a choice based on my values. If she’d used it for drugs and nights on the town, I wouldn’t have given it to her. I love her and will help her in any way I can to help her succeed. At the time she was questioning Christiananity. I told her what I believe and why and listened to her. I questioned in my youth too and my Mother and I had similar conversations. At the time my daughter and I weren’t always getting alone. That’s why I paid her rent. We were both happier.
I agree help her financially if you want. If you base your decision on her not accepting your religion then I would wonder about Christianity. If I were her, I’d feel rejected and unloved.
Marda has so many good points. I will just say that the idea that you stop giving her Christmas presents or money because she has an opinion she voices that is different from yours tells me loads about you and the control you want to have over her.
Don’t argue with her over social media. She makes her own bed in front of others - let her lie in it. Unfollow her so that you don’t see what she writes. Then it’s not in front of your face. Unfollowing is not the same as unfriending. She will not know that you unfollowed her. Don’t bring up religion to her. All you’re doing is making her dig her heels in more.
As she gets older, maybe she’ll get wiser about limiting her public diatribes. But as long as you are lecturing her, she won’t. My mom has differing views from me and continued badgering me about going to an evangelical church over a Presbyterian church, SO much to the point that I told her I wouldn’t put a foot in one unless it’s for a funeral, because she wouldn’t leave me alone about my choice of church. That finally shut her up, sheesh!
I started rejecting religion when I was 14. My family is very Catholic. My cousins still make the sign of the cross when they pass a cemetery, church, hear an ambulance siren…
My mother never ever criticized me for it. She never would have considered not exchanging gifts over the holiday. I was very vocal and adamant about my beliefs and criticism of the Church. She listened and engaged in many conversations with me about it. She never felt threatened by my views
She didn’t criticize when we joined a UU congregation. She respected that we weren’t baptizing our kids and they were being taught about other religions. W celebrate the pagan holiday Yule in our home, but visit all the in-laws during the season to exchange gifts.
Someone here needs to grow up and act like an adult, and it’s not your daughter. Maybe she needs to learn some tact, but you seriously need to examine your priorities and why you feel so threatened by her beliefs.
i am utterly bored by anyone who feels the need to denigrate others’ beliefs loudly and aggressively. i don’t care if it’s atheists bashing christians or christians bashing pagans or klingons bashing jainists.
yawn.
so i unfollow or unfriend anyone on social media who does a bunch of this.
and while i’m very devout, i’m grateful that my kids (one unaffiliated, one agnostic) don’t feel the need to stomp and flail about religion on their social media.
but if they did, i wouldn’t read it. i’d continue to have a great relationship with them.
and while i’m not a christian, i do celebrate christmas as a purely social holiday. the winter solstice (and rural dionysia) is for me and my spiritual path, christmas is for food and lights and stockings and prezzies and music and family. although my husband is the only nominal christian here, we all enjoy it thoroughly.
the tongue-lashing you received sounds hurtful and nasty. but i suppose you did ask for it by calling her a hypocrite publicly, didn’t you?
so, now you get to pick.
do you want to punish your daughter, or have a relationship with her?
boom.
there’s your answer.
khairete
suz
Setting the atheism and social media (and your reactions to it) aside, giving Christmas gifts and offering financial assistance when asked are two different things. One is a seasonal expression of love and affection, and the other is related to whether or not you expect an adult to be able to support herself financially. You can do one and not the other, but, as others have said, your relationship will be damaged if you tie either one to her beliefs and behavior.
Well seeing as how Christmas is not a Christian holiday I don’t see why it matters. Also bc she doesn’t believe what you do that means you don’t share Christmas with her? I’m atheist as well and often comment on the ridiculous things I see
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Well seeing as how Christmas is not a Christian holiday I don’t see why it matters. Also bc she doesn’t believe what you do that means you don’t share Christmas with her? I’m atheist as well and often comment on the ridiculous things I see