Vaccinations - Saint Paul,MN

I have chosen not to vaccinate my 4 1/2 month old son, at least not for now. I am very nervous about autism and behavioral disorders. If you have already done the first two rounds of vaccination, you can still chose to not do the rest. The next round would be for different viruses than the first two, so it would make a difference. Every different virus can have an affect on your daughters immune system in a different way. Also if you do want to vaccinate, but limit the chance of a reaction, you can choose to do one vaccination at a time instead of 3 or 4 shots that each have 2-3 different vaccinations in it. If you would like some information about vaccinations from a different source then you MD go to the following website:

www.icpa4kids.org and search vaccination for articles relating to whether or not to vaccinate your child as well as their side effects

Also it is NOT required for your child to be vaccinated in order to go to day care or school. You just have to sign a waver that you chose not to vaccinate.

I just have to say is please do your research before you make your decision. So you know you made the right choice for you and your family. And be sure you are getting your information from a valid source and the news/media is not one of those.

Good luck!
K.

I don't know the ramifications of stopping at this point but it would certainly be reasonable to delay or eliminate ones she has not had. The first poster referred you to discussions on mothering.com forums and I think that is definitely a great resource. If you do decide to not continue her vacinnations or skip certain ones then it is worth connecting up with other people in the Midwest so that you can expose your child to the childhood diseases you do want her to get (so that she can develop natural immunity while young). You can also do that through mothering.com.

I did choose to vaccinate but we don't have any genetic predisposition to autism in our family and that would certainly have changed my opinion. We also travel out of the country frequently and I felt that not only increased our risks to certain diseases but also made it hard if he got sick while away from home. I think autism is a very complex issue and I think eventually there will be a connection found between genetics, chemicals and other environmental variables.

Hi K.,

I read through all of the comments. Here is my small add on. There is a terrific book that outlines a different schedule for vaccinations called

What your doctor may not tell you about children's vaccinations. by stephanie Cave, MD

ISBN 0-446-67707-8

I followed it because my family has a lot of autoimmune disorders. My daughter is now almost 2 and 1/2 has most of the CDC recommended vaccinations (not all because there are ones that can be opted out from).

The biggest issue that I ran into and also the one that causes most of the vaccination stress is with the MMR vaccination. These can be given individually rather than the MMR cocktail. Merk (manufacturing company) does make them individually. It is an issue of trying to get them administered individually. I eventually did after more than 1 and 1/2 years. I had to change clinics.

I am not sure if it correct to say where we finally did get support with this consumer choice so I won't say. If indicated that it is ok I will pass on the information.

C.

What timing you have. It's all over the news this morning. CNN had something and K102 FM had a doctor talking about vaccinations and autism. CNN's doctor said studies have shown no connection to autism and the drug thermisol. I think that's the name of the drug. K102 guest doctor said otherwise. And he also said, there is not one case of autism in Europe. Because they don't get the vaccinations that our kids do. I don't know. It's very nerve wrecking. My 10 year old has made it through all the shots without getting autism. My 2 year old is fine, and she has had DPT and measles shots. I just don't know what to think. I know people who claim their children got autism after their shots. I just don't know if the shots were really the cause. It's a tough decision. Good luck. It'll be interesting to hear what other people have to say.
Sorry- didn't help you much. L.

We do vax, however on our own schedule. The boys only recieve one vax per visit, so no sticking thier little legs twice each, and no 'chemical cocktail' either. One shot per visit, delay the MMR until after age 2. This works for us since I'm not pro-vax, and my husband IS pro-vax... this is our compromise. the boys recieve their vax's, but on MY schedule, one at a time when I feel the time is right.

I was questioning whether we should delay vaccinations with my son. After reading and researching, I decided to get the vaccinations. There is a reason that we don't have to worry about our kids dying from serious diseases...and I'm not willing to put my kids at risk from coming down with something that I can prevent. Yes, there are risks either way. However I felt that there were more risks associated with not vaccinating than there were with the vaccinations themselves. Good luck with your decision!

I have an almost 6 month old boy and I plan on continuing with the vaccinations. I have had difficulty deciding this as well but you have to believe it is better for them in the long run. I also feel that since I started my child in daycare (just last week) that since he is around other kids that he should be vaccinated and I would want all the other kids around him to have their shots as well. My daycare (in home) lady turns away kids that do not have shots and I believe that is best for all the kids. You never know what the schools will require in a few years as well.

I also believe that if you started it was for a good reason, go with your gut! Good luck with your decision.

I'd recommend asking your ped about it. I was very apprehensive about the whole thing, as well. My ped told me some brands of vaccine have safer ingredients than others (some still have mercury perservative in them). When the office only had one brand of vaccine and it was the less safe one, he recommended I wait until their office receive a new batch from a different company. He also said that he thought claims that vaccinations were linked to ADHD and autism were bogus because vaccinations have been given much longer than these diagnosese have been on the rise.
Okay, so the safer vaccines could be dangerous as well. But, when my doctor told me the effects of having some of the diseases that they vaccinate for and the percentage of children that die after contracting them, I decided it was worth the risk. Granted, everone vaccinates, so chances of getting these diseases is slim. I decided it just wasn't worth the risk. I am careful to remind my ped of my concerns every time we visit so he can check on the vaccines that they currently have in stock and are giving my son to be sure they are the safest verssions.
Also, some Moms said you have to vaccinate before school. Not so! You do need to vaccinate, or sign a waiver that says that you are choosing not to vaccinate your child. I think they just do it this way so people think they have to vaccinate. They can't force you to. For some, it's a religious issue.

I also am debating with my 4th child and his 2 year old shots. The other 3 made it through just fine but I just get nervous. One thing I wanted to mention also is a previous poster talked about research proving that vaccinations are safe. The research proved that thermerisol wasn't a cause of Autism but it doesn't say that the vaccine cocktails don't cause it. I, personally think it's crazy to think that it's ok to give little bodies these groups of shots all at the same time. It's like a big drug overdose and the only reason why they do them all at once is because they don't think you'll make it back in to get the rest if they spread it out. I'm going to spread out his 2 year old vaccines so that I can know that I at least tried to prevent it.
I can't believe how some people are attacking your decision because if their child ended up with Autism they would have a completely different opinion. You won't find an Autism Mom ripping you a new one for questioning it but I guess some people have to walk in the shoes to understand that.
Best Wishes,
J.

We started the vaccination process with our eldest (5 yr) but stopped after her 4 month. We have given her the full dose recommended of Tetnus(seperated from the others) but not on the CDC schedule. We have chosen not to vaccinate our other two since our first suffered enough. She had eczema flare-ups and allergy issues immediatly following the shots. There is so much info out there. I think it is great that Oprah has been featuring that there may be a connection with vaccines. There is not a law that says you have to vaccinate. My daughter goes to school and we sign a form for Conscientous Objection to Vaccinations. For our family there were too many "what-ifs".

Every child I know including my own have been vaccinated and the worst reaction was a 2 degree increase in body temp. Oh and my niece got the chicken Pox from her vaccine but it was a very mild case.

At first I wanted to not do the Chicken Pox one thinking they can just catch it like I did but because everyone is getting vaccinated the kids can't catch it at a young age and the older they are when they get it the more lethal it becomes. 2 of my cousins High school classmates died from Chicken Pox 5 years ago.

My official stance on vaccines is do them. I think people who are against vaccines in this country are just very selfish short sighted and lucky. They can refuse vaccinate their children because the rest of us do it for them. I wonder if they had to live in a third world country would they be so critical of vaccination? In fact would they take their anti-vaccination ideology so far as to deny an African mother vaccinations for her children?

As far as the supposed Autism link as a Social Worker I do not buy it. Autism is high because the criteria for diagnosis is so very broad. More children are being "labeled" autistic for a lot of reasons access to school services is one and because if a kid has any quirks at all they fall under the umbrella of Autism. I have seen through my work a lot of kids who would have been diagnosed as retarded (yes this was once an actual medical diagnosis) and now they are referred to as being Autistic. Look at it this way 149 kids out of 150 will never be labeled Autistic. Many people will live their whole lives and never personally intimately know someone with Autism or thanks to vaccines a child with Polio.

We've waited for the MMR with our other 2 until they were over 2 years and my Dr. didn't seem to have a problem with that. We are waited with our 3rd as well.

I debated about the chicken pox. I mean come on...We all had it and it was no big deal. When researching and talking with my Dr. she said one thing to me that set my mind. Most kids are getting vaccinated for chicken pox and therefore my kids wouldn't be exposed to it as much as we were. This means that if they did get it they would be older and it would be more difficult and more dangerous for them. I had read that and her words just solidified it for me.

Also as a side note. I believe that most preschools and schools require your children to be vaccinated. That's what I've been told. Not sure if that holds true for everywhere. So you'll need to take that into consideration.

Talk with your Dr. they may be very supportive, but they may not agree to treat you child if you decide not to vaccinate. So you'll have to look for a Dr. that agrees with your decision.

It's a tough choice that I think we've all struggled with. Good Luck.

I would do your research. Sometimes it's better to vaccinate than not to. Risks are there either way though. For daycare and school you must prove vaccinations before they admit. Not sure if you'll receive this on time but 9 at 9pm has a story on vaccinations. Maybe you can log onto their website and get information on Thursday.

I am curious as to what your reasoning is for not vaccinating. Is it really fair to your child when he/she becomes ill and it could have been prevented from something that made you uneasy? Wont you feel guilty then? Is your child not going to be going to school at any point in his or her life? Or daycare? He/she will not be accepted without any type of vaccination. They are not to harm your child, they are there to help your child. Dont you want whats best for your child? I guess I just dont get it.

I know that you've gotten a lot of responses but I just wanted to throw this out there.

If you're worried about the idea that they cause autism, you have more of a chance of your children being autistic because of genetics (your husbands family) than you ever would from vaccinations.

That is why my ECSE teacher sister-in-law doesn't want kids. She works with special needs children all day, has worked one on one with an extremely autistic boy for years and has 3 cousins, an aunt, and a grandma who are all autistic. She is afraid that any children she has will be as well and she knows how hard it is to parent them.

She does not however, have any reservations about vaccinations and thouroughly supports me in my decision for my children to get them.

Hello, Please don't stop your daughter's vaccinations! She could contact crippling or deadly diseases. If you are concerned just ask your pediatrician about getting the shots spread out. Good luck!

Dear K.,

I'm sorry to chime in, since I'm a pro-vaccinations. It is your decision,I respect that, but I would just like to put a couple points out there.
First- if your daughter has had no or little reaction to the vaccines she's had so far, it is VERY VERY likely to stay that way.
Second- science has advanced dramatically in the last forty years, we understand immunity better every day. The vaccines created today are safer because they are created with structural proteins of the viruses, so your body recognises the "non-self" proteins and creates anti-bodies to recognise and destroy them, but there is no way to get sick from them, they are not whole or opperational. Because they only use peices, it takes multiple exposures, i.e. all those vaccines, for the body to create enough anti-bodies that it will recognise and effectively fight the real virus. That's the difference between the one shot you got and the four or five your daughter will get.
Third- a lot of the diseases they vaccinate for, polio, measles, hepatitis, are still present in the U.S. and the rest of the world, but you don't hear about them and they aren't a problem because so many of us are vaccinated and immune.
Also a lot of these vaccines just weren't created or distributed fifty years ago, your parents didn't get or hear about so many vaccines because they didn't exist.

This is why the "my mother said I only got two or three, and I turned out just fine" arguement bothers me, they weren't around, or they weren't as safe, so only the people with a much higher risk of getting it anyhow got vaccines. You don't see this arguement when it comes to anti-biotics, or CAT scans, or vitamins. Just like not giving kids peanut butter before three, vaccines are about prevention of things that could be way worse.

I'm sorry this kind of turned into a rant, but it scares me as a future public health practitioner that so many children are going without vaccinations, not because they've had reactions, but because of the distrust of vaccines and preventative medicine. Yes, I'll be a vet, but do a little looking and you'll find out that when there is a major human outbreak, it will be veterinarians called in, not doctors because we are trained to handle populations, not just individuals. There is a lot more cross-over than the public (and doctors) give us credit for. This is my job, to understand why medicine functions as it does.

Hope this helps you make a decision, if you decide to discontinue at least you'll be informed.

I had the same thing done. She no longer gets any vaccinations. She had bad reactions to them, worse than just a temp. I didn't feel comfortable continuing and didn't appreciate the scare tactics our Dr. tried on us. We switched Dr.s and this one agrees with me and just had me sign a form saying I am informed and have thought this over. If you have any questions for me, just ask

Please, please finish the vaccinations! I feel it is unfair to put your child and other children at risk of contracting these deadly diseases. It is also somewhat selfish to rely on other parents to vaccinate their children to keep the risk of a mass outbreak down. I'm glad the schools require vaccinations. I do understand your fears being a mother of an infant myself, but the benefits outweigh the risks.

This is very personal and difficult decision to make. It is unfathomable to imagine harm coming to your baby either because you chose to not vaccinate and she became ill or, as in the rare cases, she had a reaction to the shot that created long term consequences. I think most people don't spend too much time debating or researching the pros and cons and simply follow their doctor's advice.

I did a great deal of reading, a lot of networking and plenty of soul-searching and found a doctor who supported choice in the matter. In the end I opted to wait about a year to start any vaccinations (my children were not in daycare) and then scheduled only certain shots. Interestingly, the medical community's stance on some of the vaccinations I avoided early on (the live-virus oral polio, the whole cell pertussis and Rotovirus) has done an about face. They no longer offer the oral polio, just the killed-cell injection, the Rotovirus vax was pulled early after many deaths and the pertussis, which was linked to numerous cases of seizures and brain damage, has been reconstructed as a "much safer" acelluar formula. I waited until my kids were school-age before doing the MMR. (Shots are NOT required for school admission - you have to sign a waiver that must be also signed by your doctor and notorized)

Finally, you might be interested to hear that a few years ago my kids both got Pertussis (Whooping Cough). I could never bring myself to give them that shot based on the damage it seemed capable of and my kids were too old to get the acellular when it came out. In the group of kids who were exposed to the unvaccinated carrier, 2 unvaccinated kids (mine) got it, one other unvaccinated kid did not get it and one more child, who was fully vaccinated did get it. It wasn't great, but certainly manageable. They felt perfectly normal but struggled with the nasty cough for months. But it is much more severe and dangerous for infants under age 1.

I found that the anti-vaccine movement can be as zealous as the pro-vaccine camp. You need learn as much about the pros and cons as you can and then make the choice you can comfortably live with, knowing what you know.

Most of the books I read are probably outdated by now but the ones I found helpful were:
Vaccines: Are They Really Safe and Effective? by Neil Z. Miller and Vaccinations - The Rest of the Story - A compendium of articles from Mothering Magazine. Another interesting, more recent book is Evidence of Harm by David Kirby which speaks to the mercury/Autism link. It will make you think twice when you read about the results of various studies. Lastly, there is a local group that meets monthly - Vaccine Awareness Minnesota - that is all about making informed choices. The founder, Chris Abel, is a wonderful resource for getting questions answered. (She totally calmed me down when I first realized that both my kids had Whooping Cough) - www.vaccineawarenessminnesota.org.

It really helps to know more about it.

Its such a hard decision!I chose not to vaccinate our son. I found this book helpful. It has a whole chapter on vaccinations, what they do, what symptoms they cause, and the odds of your child actually getting the virus. Very helpful. I also liked it because its the most current resourse I could find in book form. Even if you decide to vaccinate, you could make up a different schedule for the vaccines so your child doesn't get a million shots in the first year!

Natural Baby and Childcare: Practical Medical Advice and Holistic Wisdom for Raising Healthy Children by Lauren Feder (Paperback - Mar 17, 2006)

I know this is a HOT topic. We have decided to vaccinate my son as recommended. Basically, I could just not find any clear evidence that proves vaccinations really cause all the various things they are accused of. I am much more fearful of him contracting the illnesses they are trying to prevent. And with more people chosing not to vaccinate, the threat of that will be higher.

Also, I would not take chicken pox lightly either. There are many people out there that would argue that it is NOT completely harmless. And for the children who survive Chicken Pox as a child, they may later have to live with Shingles, that can develop as a result of the aerlier infection.

I would do some serious well balanced research if you are thinking of not completing her vaccinations. Do not get caught up in the ride just because...

Did you see Jenny McCarthy on Oprah? Just a guess. :)

We did a delayed schedule until my son's 1st birthday and now we are not getting any more. I too felt very uneasy about doing them at all, and regret that he has had any at all. We get weird looks when it comes up among people who've never done any research, but I find that the more people have read on the subject, the more familiar they are with delayed vaxing, if not outright refusal of any.

I think it *does* make a difference. You don't have to keep going just because you've started. Nor do you have to take "the schedule" and follow it to the letter. No doubt you've heard talk about the MMR as a big red flag, and that's one of the "later" shots.

My best advice is to get thee to MotheringDotCommune and start studying the vaccination forum there. Until I began researching there, I have to say, I was pretty clueless about immunity.

There is a wealth of knowledge in this conversation and its links, a sort of Immunity 101 thread:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions/showthread.php?t=406983

Anyway, I think this is a really really serious issue, and I applaud your questioning. I'm happy to answer any more specific questions...

And here is another thread here on mamasource on the topic:
http://www.mamasource.com/request/13224376567100080129

Good luck to you!

I know there are lots of folks who choose not to (try mothering.com for this perspective) but I think from a public health point of view it's important for everyone to do. Kids don't get these terrible diseases anymore for the most part, but when many choose not to vaccinate, it can be dangerous for the community (read a few examples of whooping cough breaking kids' ribs and so on). Except for the flu vaccine in some cases, the controversial preservative (thimerosal) is not used anymore in vaccines, and although some parents of autistic kids believe otherwise, there has not been shown to be a correlation between vaxing and autism. Just my soapbox...but I believe you have the right to make the decision you feel is best for your child.