Update on Arguing 5 Year Old - Falling Asleep After School, Growth Spurt?

Good for you, mom! Counting to three consistantly is awesome and will pay off in spades! I bet they are playing harder now that it's warm outside.

I think she is tuckered out! My kids as teenages sometimes fall asleep on the couch when they get home from shcool.

My son is 6 and doesn't spurt, it just seems like he is always growing and always hungry LOL.

Maybe bring a snack with you when you pick her up - get a bit of food in her and see if that helps.

When I would pick up our daughter for school, I tried to have a bottle of water and a snack ready for her. She was starving tired and releasing all of the stress of the day.

We would come home and I would let her decompress..

Funny thing is my husband and I are the same after work.. We just need some time alone.. Do not ask us questions of expect us to jump into the next activity.. We need a snack and quiet time.

Well, she's clearly tired. So, regardless the reason (yes, it could be a growth spurt), she's getting some needed rest.

My kids are definitely more hungry before a growth spurt, and more tired during one.

ETA: Oh! And great work on the consistency. She's learning that you aren't going to give in just because she whines. Don't let her tiredness be an excuse though. Keep pushing her to behave correctly. :-)

Growth spurt? End of the school year exhaustion? You will probably find that this phase passes soon.

Oh gosh, you know what?
After school, after a LONG day at school for kids and being on task ALL day and ALL the time... a kid gets tired/fussy/overtired/hungry... and all at the SAME time. Which is, after school. And then, like an overfilled balloon... they deflate or have to, and the way they "deflate" is letting all their yah-yahs out, IN the car ride home.
My kids are 6 and 10, and they do this too. Being at school ALL day long, is hard work. They behave at school and there is no room for error. There is no room for, mistakes. There is no room for inattentiveness etc. It is school. And after they come home, they NEED TO have a snack (because the last time they ate or had lunch was hours ago) hence their blood sugar levels are low and this means, irritability and less tolerance for things. AND they are tired. They are in other words, at their limit.
It is very common.

With my kids, I let them deflate. I know they are EXTRA verbal and emotional in the car ride home. And they are irked or fussy etc. Not everyday, but often. They are, out of school and tired and hungry. Too. They are good kids. They do behave in school, ALL day. Concentrating on everything. All day.
At home, after school, I let them, deflate. Unwind. Relax. Zone out if they have to. Have a hearty snack etc. And then, their moods, re-balance themselves and their equilibrium.
Then, it is homework time. After that.

After school, is a hard time for kids.
They have, PENT up yah-yahs, to get out. So to speak.
They are young. They don't "vent" like adults.

And also, yes, when they are going through ANY growth spurts or developmental/cognitive/emotion or motor skill changes, it is h*** o* them. On their whole, being. And yes, like my son... they SLEEP a lot more and NEED it. I know... my kids cues and when they are hitting developmental changes. No matter what ages they are.

Kids NEED to have, a good hearty snack or another meal, after school. Remember, kids eat lunch early at school. Then by the time they get out of school... it is hours later. Their tummies are empty. And their brains. Hence, physiologically... they may get low blood sugar. Even for me, when that happens, I get GRUMPY and short tempered and irritable. It is time, for a snack. Not just a piece of apple. But a HEARTY snack or mini-meal. And believe me, young kids even if having this mini-meal or snack after school, they STILL can eat dinner. Kids need it. It affects... their moods and ability... to manage their fluctuations in emotions, especially when overtired, from school.

I don't punish my kids... for after school deflating.
Because, I know, it is from their LONG day at school, and they are good kids. But every over filled balloon, needs a way to deflate, or it will burst.

My late Dad used to say: "Kids need a place to vent and be themselves. That place is at home, and with at least one parent that they can vent to. If a child does not have this, nor is allowed to vent or express their hardships, then where and with whom, will they do it, with???"
My Dad, was the place and person, I was able to just let my hair down, with. With, him.
No kid... can be spot on... ALL day, 24/7. It is not rational to expect them to. Sure, normal behavior is expected. But as a Mom with my kids... I KNOW, the difference between my kids needing or having difficulties, versus them just being a "brat."
And I then gauge my reactions and/or punishments to them, according to that.
Because, everyday is different, and the needs of the child. Looking "through" their moods and spoutings, and knowing, if they just are pent-up or not. Just like in adults.

Also in my city, there are still various cold bugs going around too.
So additionally, watch for sickness.

Also, if either of my kids are especially grumpy or fussy.... I will ASK them, what is bothering them. Before, just jumping the gun and punishing or scolding them for every emotion they have.
I tell them, to tell me... what is bothering them. And after talking with me and realizing they can tell me... that in itself, makes them feel better.
I always encourage my kids, to explain, their emotions TO me.
Before I just assume they are being "bratty."
Often, there is a reason.
And something is bothering them. And they need to, re-group.

It is so stinking hot where I live. Is it where you live? Perhaps the heat is taking a lot out of her. Does she play hard at recess?

So it appears she is cranky and argumentative because she is tired. So I would STOP punishing her for that. Maybe try to reconnect (hug, have her tell you the best/worst part of her day) when you get in the car and then if she needs to nap, she needs to nap. My son definitely still has days when he is exhausted after school and he is 7. She may be spending more of her recess and gym time running around now that the weather is good. It also sounds like the heat may be wiping her out. I don't think cracking down on discipline helps nearly as much as setting her up for success will. Adults who are hungry and tired are cranky. We don't punish them - we encourage them to get enough sleep and stop skipping lunch.

DVM:

GREAT JOB!!! Consistency counts!! YOU GO MAMA!!!

Well, if she's napping - she's tired. It could be a growth spurt or it could be the weather - if it got hot really fast and she's out playing at recess - she might be over tired....

Does she get a lot of protein during the day? My boys - especially my 10 year old - is going through a spurt - he can't seem to sleep - and once he gets to sleep he doesn't want to wake up (however, this is also do his enlarged adenoids - which causes him to wake up the middle of the night - urgh - vicious cycle!!) and eats like a horse - his "idea" of a snack after school? Mac & Cheese, bag of chips and a drink. Maybe even something else!!! Then he eats big time at dinner.

My 13 year old? Not yet. Expecting it in the next few weeks as he gets out in the sun more.

Does this nap interfere with her sleeping at night?
Has she changed in any other way - like eating - or being "mean"?

If she is coming down with something - it's taking a while to "brew". It could be so many things...but mostly at age 5? it's pushing boundaries and limits...finding their "way" and seeing what they can and cannot get away with. Personally? I think it's the age and seeing what she can get away with. Keep up the good work mama!!!

She's tired! It's the end of the school year, spring fever, could be coming down with something, could be a growth spurt, she could also just be so active the last few weeks of school with all the excitement and stuff that she's mentally worn down.

Good points made so far. Yes, it is extremely common for kids (especially the youngest of them) to get in trouble in the car on the way home. It's a long day for them and they have been "on" all day and they need to get their anxiety/frustration etc out. They feel stress, too. They need to have this release in a safe place. That means with you! Lovely, right?

Also, it could be stress related in a more direct way. She is finishing up kindergarten, and I'd bet the teachers have been "warning" them about how much more will be expected of them next year. Maybe even testing them to see how much they learned this year or for readiness levels for first grade. Kids can get stressed out by this stuff, too... not just the older teen set who has a grasp on how important some of the tests are to them... but the little kids, well, they don't really have a clue how important (or not) the tests are... but I'm sure they hear a lot of general "it's important to do your best and do well" stuff from their teachers.

What I found, especially as my kids have gotten older, is that when I pick them up, I have a snack ready to hand to them the second their seatbelt is buckled. And something cold to drink (water). And then I am quiet. They can talk or not. I do not pepper them with questions. Now, I have 2 kids, so things can be a little different. What they do is get irritated with each other over any and every little thing. Right down to "you slammed your door" "no, I didn't"... or "there is one of your hairs on the seat!" (daughter has long hair)... Anything to let them express some "justified" irritation.

So I tell them just to be quiet and no talking for a few minutes. After a few minutes of just the radio, and munching noises (lol), one of them will mention something from school (something a teacher said/did, a friend's comment, a friend was absent, sometimes it's even stuff like so & so's parents are getting divorced). Before I know it, they are usually trying to talk over one another with stories/comments. And all is well.
They just need a few minutes with NO expectations placed upon them.

I wonder what would happen if when you picked up your daughter, you handed her a snack with some protein in it (a small package of peanut butter crackers for example), a bottle of cold water, and then told her the new after-school routine you are trying out says that there is no talking for a few minutes first... only music on the radio... at least until she's had a snack.
And then see how it goes.

I would still count her at home (just not in the car right after school). And if you count her at home the same as you recited you count her in the car, then I would start the actual counting sooner in the process. It sounds as if you let yourself get irritated before you ever start.

As a side note, I was in the grocery store earlier this evening and noticed a family turning up the next aisle over. The little kid was running out ahead and I heard the mom start counting him. Now, I don't know if she was using the 1-2-3 Magic method, or just the old parental Oooooooooooonnnnnnnnnneeeee. Twwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwoooooooooooooooooo....

But I did notice something I thought was interesting. The lingering "ooooooooooooooooonnnnnnnneeeee" almost implies/signals that there will by necessity be a two. And the Twwwwwwwwwwwwwwoooooooooo does the same thing... it almost sounds like a dare!

With 1-2-3 Magic, you don't do it that way. You tell them how the counting works in the very beginning, and that's it. After that, when you are doing the actual counting it is matter of fact and rather than just saying numbers long and slow, you Tell them they have reached something: "That's one." You say nothing else unless the behavior continues, at which point you simply say, "That's two." There is no lingering Ooooooooooonnnnnnnnnneees or Twwwwwwwwwwwooooooooos. And it isn't snuck into the "conversation" in that low tone parents tend to use when they drag it out like that... like they can be convinced to stop counting somehow. It isn't an ongoing thing. The count has already happened. It's ALREADY "one". The time to stop is now... not sometime before I run out of breath and finish the word ooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeee.

Does that make any sense? It was just an interesting observation I had watching a parent/child that I didn't know, and actually hearing what those dragged out ones and twos sound like from an objective standpoint.

The "that's one" is just so much more effective, in my experience.

IDK
But my son the same way this month.He been coming home straving and cranky n his eating habit have not changed as per the teacher, Am just sending extra snack like fruit, they are having recess outside now so i was thinking there just coming home tired n hungry from burrning more calories .

I guess?
when he just started school he wouold eat n we would go to the park, and he still wasnt as crankyor hungry as he come home now.
BUt then again its been a year almost so the growing requires more food

She has nothing better to do when you put her in there so she sleeps. Great escape!

not sure .. but my kindergarten son is the same way.. grumpy tired cross irritable.. either in the car on the way home or on the playground if we stay and play after school.

they are hungry tired and have been trying to be good all day at school.. I try to be patient with him. and once I get him out of the grumpys.. he is nice the rest of the evening.. 7 hours of school is a lot for 5 year olds.

day care may be all day also.. but it is not structured and the kids have tons of free time.. kindergarten has been a rough year.

Let her sleep. She probably is having a growth spurt. Also, remember that when we are under stress, sometimes the stress can wear us out.

School will be out soon and her days will change. Be very diligent after school is out in regards to the arguing and whining. Show her a lot of attention when she is behaving well.

One thing you might consider after she starts school in the fall is to have her ride the school bus home, if at all possible. When she walks in the door, have a snack ready for her. Tell her to wash her hands, sit down and eat. Leave her alone while she eats and tell her to take a little break in her room for a few minutes, and then you two can have some time together. For a child who needs to wind down, a little food in her stomach and a few minutes of decompressing in her room can make a world of difference.