School Meeting Advice

Updated on January 20, 2008
L.S. asks from Springfield, VA
21 answers

My tenth grader just got diagnosed with non-hyperactive ADHD from a really reliable group of doctors. She also tests "gifted." She isn't seeing any difference on 18 mg concerta. At school, she's an A's and zeros kind of girl -- she'll spend long hours and finish a project and leave it in the printer (or the kitchen table or her locker) and she puts off the easy, little homework until too late, etc -- there's always a story.

She's a nice kid - not obnoxiously rebellious at all -- but her teachers perceive her as rebellious and unmotivated because she doesn't work to conform (or to not conform -- she just doesn't see why anyone would work to conform...) and she mostly gets her zeros on the work they give to separate the motivated from the not -- the notebook that has to be in the right order or the five minute detail-oriented worksheet. She has four teachers that brag that they never take late work. The psycho-educational evaluation suggested we meet with the school to put in place a 504 or a IEP. I think that it's likely that such a request will be denied because her A's and 0's often end up being C's (she is motivated enough to pick up dropped balls when she can) and she's mostly in advanced classes because she came out of the gifted center. When I asked her teachers whether we could come up with an alternative to zeros or a way to make up zeros, they gave her "one last chance." I don't think the ADD is going to go away after that one chance.

Has anyone successfully met with FCPS and gotten an excellent supportive plan in place? Any suggestions for ADD supports? I'd like her to turn most of her stuff in electronically I think, but that's not really practical for notebooks. I think she sometimes doesn't notice when it's time to turn things in. I'd really like her math teacher to keep a graphing calculator for her -- she's lost six of them so far. I think that whatever I ask for should be inexpensive for the system and easy for overwhelmed teachers. Any suggestions?

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M.B.

answers from Washington DC on

I am a school teacher, though I have not taught here in VA. I know that as a classroom teacher it is always helpful to know about specific challenges that a student is having, so I highly recommend talking frankly--and often--with teachers and administrators. A teacher can't always cater to everything, but many are willing to make a concerted effort. IEP's and 504's can be a good approach to getting everyone on board. Educators should definitely be familiar with ADD and ADHD, and that symptoms vary between students, with girls commonly exhibiting symptoms like what you describe. Best of luck, and whatever you do, don't give up!

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D.F.

answers from Washington DC on

Hi, L.-

I have an 18 year old son who sounds almost exactly like your daughter: refused to do the easy homework, wouldn't conform; hated busy work or rules on how things should look and be turned it. Teachers perceived him as lazy and disengaged (which he was to some extent). We had IEP plan in place which actually did help to some degree, but it depends on the school, the special ed person assigned and on the teachers. What helped me most? Giving up my expectations and control. Letting Go. David graduated from high school last year. He took one class last semester at MC, but has decided he really wants to work full time. We'll see. I think the rigid environment of school doesn't work for some kids -- especially the really bright ones with ADHD. Don't get discouraged. I've talked to lots of parents with similar kids, and they all seem to turn out just fine -- they just take a bit longer to get their acts together!

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K.A.

answers from Washington DC on

I am a high school special education teacher in FCPS. Your daughter sounds like many students that I've had in my classes. I think a 504 sounds exactly like what your daughter might need. I don't think you'd need to go as far as an IEP at this point. You could call her guidance couselor and request a meeting. You will need to bring proof of her ADD diagnosis in order to put the 504 into place. The 504 is a legal document which could give her accommodations in classes (for example - keeping a calculator in math class or extended time for long assignments, the ability to turn in work late albeit for partial credit, etc). If you would like to speak more, please feel free to message me! (Or email me at [email protected]____.com). ~ K.

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T.C.

answers from Washington DC on

I have an 11 year old daughter, same story as yours (also gifted; also non-hyperactive ADD). She was diagnosed in second grade. We hit middle school this year and it's been an education. Teachers these days are so frazzled, with so many responsibilities, that negotiating with them over ADD accommodations can be really hard. A good many harbor opinions about ADD that have nothing to do with the facts, and they're not interested in continuing education. (This seems to be less true with younger teachers.) You're going to run into teachers who consider ADD a code word for "lazy parenting" or "lazy kid." The ignorance can really drive up your blood pressure, especially when it comes from people who should know better.

It's a standard ADD accommodation (required by the Americans with Disabilities Act) to allow kids with a diagnosis of ADD to turn in their homework late, provided that they did the homework when it was assigned. Doing homework and forgetting to turn it in is classic ADD behavior. I had to explain this concept FOUR times to one of my daughter's teachers, and forward her a copy of my daughter's 504 plan, before she would budge on this issue.

Ideally, you would get a coach or a therapist--a professional who knows ADD and who knows your daughter--to go to the 504 meeting with you, to be an advocate. If you can't do that, read up on this issue (the classic book is "Driven to Distraction," by Dr. Edward Hallowell. Also, go to the CHADD website, which offers a slew of advice and tips. Public schools will give your daughter what she's entitled to, but you have to MAKE them. Believe me, they are not going to volunteer.

You have to walk a thin line between being your daughter's advocate, to get her what she's entitled to, and being her enabler--allowing her to get by without learning the organizational skills she's going to need every day of her life. It's a really hard line to draw. But there is help out there. Please message me offline if you want to talk more.

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C.C.

answers from Washington DC on

I have also dealt with this with two of my children. One managed to get through high school, although she was a "lazy student". She is now 28, and has started, for the second or third time, college. Thank God, this time she has finally managed to be successful. I believe this is because she has finally found something that she can feel good about and is very interested in. She is also doing this online. On the other hand, My now 18 year old son, who was diagnosed ADD in second grade, (although we had concerns as early as Kinder), just got his GED. The school system was pretty helpful when he was in elementary school, and semi-so in middle school, but high school just fell apart. The high school tried to help us, but I don't think anyone, us included, knew just what to do. When he developed sleep problems, things just went from bad to worse. We finally enrolled him in online high school courses to keep the truant office off our backs, until we could find a solution on our own. He just wanted to take his GED test and be done, but that wasn't an option from the county, (even though you can graduate at 17) so we waited until he turned 18 and he took the test. By the way, he was also in the gifted program, and is an extremely intelligent young man. The regular classroom setting is not the best place for all children to function (I am in education by the way). You may find that college will be a better experience, because some children do better when they
don't feel they have to conform (my son is always angry about this). He feels people should be accepted for who they are, and as they are. I think this is common for people with ADHD/ADD. I also have a friend, who, under similar circumstances, is always at the school, working on her sons IEP, meeting with staff, and making sure his IEP is in place and that teachers and staff are following the plan carefully. She is also very regimented with her son, and his routine at school, and home. He seems to do very well with this, whereas my son did not. We looked to others who are ADD as examples of success (i.e. Robin Williams, Steven Speilberg, Albert Einstein, etc.). I always told my son that his brain was just wired a little differently, and the medication was a tool to help him. He is not on medication now, as he feels he can function without it. When he starts classes, this may change. I wish you both all the best! They do grow into reasonable adults.

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C.A.

answers from Dover on

Hi Lauris,
Boy does your story sound familiar! I have three children. Ages 24, 21 & 10. My 24 year old is ADD (diagnosis for person without the hyperactivity.) Since you have taken your child to the doctor and she has been diagnosed by a physcian, she is entitled to a 504 plan. It's the law, under the American with Disabilities Act ! There is a non-profit organization that helps parents if they have a hard time with the school system or teachers. In Delaware its called The Parent Information Center (PIC). They help parents of children with disabilities to be advocates and fight for their educational rights. PIC has offices in all counties of Delaware. I have been down the road and back with meds and my son....its rough. Luckily your daughter is willing to take her meds. It is just finding the right one that helps her. Feel free anytime to contact me. I'd be glad to elaborate more or just be a listening ear. Best wishes.

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B.W.

answers from Washington DC on

I am a pediatric occupational therapist, so I have a little bit of info for you. I don't know about the school districts here because we moved here about 8 months ago. Because of the ADHD (w/o hyperactivity) she should qualify for a 504 plan. These are great plans for kids with her symptoms. They typically include adaptations or exceptions for assignments, papers and tests to help her succed despite her difficulties. Depending on the school will depend on how much they will be able to help. Definatly voice your concerns and what you think might help her do well (assingments on computer, ect). They always like to hear suggestions from parents on how the can best help you child because you know your child best. They will do whatever they feel is a reasonable request. Hope this helps.

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M.W.

answers from Washington DC on

Laura, your daughter's school is required by federal law to provide her with a Free Appropriate Education (FAPE) if she has a recognized disability. ADD is recognized as a disability through 2 laws, IDEA and ADA. Both have different requirements, but the end result is the same, the school has to stop treating her as a discipline problem and change how they treat her.

Disabled students many times are gifted, and many times parents and even trained educators equate disability with stupidity. It is not the case, and your daughter definitely is entitled as a RIGHT to an IEP. That school sounds like it doesn't care about educating all the students, only about educating those that fit into their pre-conceived ideas about what students ought to be. Me, I like the "fancy" ones too, they are sometimes the people who do great things in their lives because they are not stuck in the rut that we are, they can bring a new fresh outlook to the world. But, many teachers want the cookie cutter kids, so they actually think up tasks to separate the ones they like from those that they don't, and either get them out of their classes, or fail them out of school once they get into high school.

There is an outstanding web site devoted to special education advocacy, http://www.wrightslaw.com. They have a long list of articles on their site just about ADD, in this area http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/add.index.htm . Pete Wright, who is dyslexic and very ADHD, is the attorney who started this site, and his law practice is devoted to special education issues. He has argued a landmark case before the US Supreme Court on special education rights, and won. But because he grew up with teachers who told his parents that he was a bad student, he knows the problem from personal experience. His wife, who runs the site, is a social worker. Together, they have this mission that all children will be educated as the law requires. They also have great tips on how to work WITH the school to achieve your goals. Please visit that site, and learn about your daughter's rights and how to advocate for her. You only have one shot at her education. I can't say that enough, once she is out of school, it is too late to help her.

Don't worry about the school's budget, that's their worries. Your focus needs to be on your daughter getting what she needs to succeed in school. Let the Board of Education worry about funds, that's what they get the big bucks for.

I know about this because my grown son has several learning disabilities, yet he is successful in life. I spent many years advocating for him, but in the end it was well worth it.

If you have any questions or want more information from me, please feel free to contact me at any time at [email protected]____.com .

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P.D.

answers from Washington DC on

Hi, my son was diagnosed with ADHD (inattentive type, not hyperactive) by a private psychologist in Oakton who only does psychoeducational testing. This, I feel, is the key. Get the testing done privately, that way, the public school system cannot put their own 'spin' on the results. I've had friends who are teachers in the public school system commend the private testing for this very reason. In many cases, as with my older daughter (who in 4th grade was tested by the same psychologist and concluded she was 'borderline ADD' along with high anxiety and a low verbal processing rate), the panel I met with after calling child study, suggested I NOT have her re-tested for high school, since they may recommend no accomodations as she does get B's----she's simply "too smart " to require this. In other words, she would probably have gotten denied. I am now (she is a Sophomore getting her re-tested PRIVATELY as she will hopefully get accomodations for the SAT's coming up next year. I did the Child Study request simply to save some money....I will never go that route again. With my son, he was tested at the end of last year, and the doctor who did the testing (same one in Oakton) came to the school and met with me, my husband, the principal and all his teachers and basically said "this is what needs to be done to help this child succeed". I should mention, he is a fifth grader in a private
school, but I have had much success with this. He is also on Vyvanse (an Adderrall based drug that is new this summer in it's method of absorption) and he is having huge successes in school. His teachers cannot believe the difference, and he is the one that brings the pill bottle to me in the morning to open and give him his dose. The FIRST DAY he was on it he got in the car after school and was so happy he had tears in his eyes and said to me "all the kids said I got smart" and " I love that medicine...school is finally fun for me" I hope this helps you and others. I am convinced my older daughter has it, she seems to struggle way too hard to get B's and C's and I know she's way above average intellegence because of how she tested in 4th grade. Hope this was helpful,

PD

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M.M.

answers from Washington DC on

My son is in the first grade and he has an IEP. He has a form of ADD, but not enough of the conditions to diagnose him as having it. I am so thankful for the school for putting him on the IEP as they have made arrangements and adjustments for him. For example, he can lose attention while being instructed and lose his focus. His school has an assistant who sits in the classroom to help him when needed and to re-focus him. Plus they also take him out of the class to give him speech therapy and to aid in his concentration skills. I'm not sure what a 504 is, but with an IEP they may make exceptions to the "norm". So those 0's may not be 0's anymore. Hope this helps!

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R.D.

answers from Norfolk on

My daughter has ADD- no hyperactivity. She is a 10th grader with a lot of "forgetfulness" She is currently on Concerta 27 mg. Do you have a psychiatrist? We got much better results when she was placed on Effexor for coexisting depression. Her grades are better, but still has trouble with test anxiety.
Yhis is her first year on a 504 plan and her teachers are very receptive- e-mail contact with me, additional time for graded assignments, including tests. If you decide to set up a school meeting to request the 504, you may want to have her tested by an educational specialist. In our case, the educational testing carried a lot of weight. I was able to ask for exactly what I wanted and have it in writing for all of her teachers. They just want guidelines

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D.O.

answers from Washington DC on

Hello L. S.
Your daughter sounds just like me in the tenth grade-gifted, with good intention, excelling in some areas and failing in others, distracted and appearing rebellious, etc.) By the time I turned 20 it was crystal clear that I had (and still was) suffering from depression. I am no expert, but consider for a moment the possibility that her ADD or other diagnosis is an effect and not the root cause of her behavior. My parents never suffered from out-of-the-ordinary depression and never associated my "distraction and apparent rebelliousness" as symptoms of deep emotional pain that was completely unexplainable to me.
I hid this debilitating distress extremely well; Having always been "such a good girl" their expectations of me were high and the few times I tried to reach out they chalked it up to teen angst and felt disappointed in me that I couldn't control myself. Don't misunderstand- they weren't mean they just had no idea the horrible feelings I grappled with inside and I didn't have the vocabulary to convey what I felt.
This may be completely off the track but it is worth a simple heart-to-heart if it saves your child from isolation, fear, and worst of all a possible suicide attempt as was the case with me. Thank you for listening!
Best blessings to you and your daughter.
D.

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C.C.

answers from Washington DC on

I have a 4rd grade son with non-hyper ADHD. He tested as "gifted" and is in a GT Center. I do not have a plan in place for my son, because we have not needed to yet. I have been very fortunate to have really supportive teachers in FCPS. We meet to make a plan for him and and check in often, they are really helpful. I found that with my son he was actually bored at the non-GT center school and he needed to be stimulated more. He also takes Concerta, but 36 mg. He loves his school now and the Concerta helps so much, but he really could do with a higher dose. Have you considered a higher dose of Concerta? Have you considered getting her into more stimulating classes? I find that I must keep an eye on my son and check on what he is doing and what work needs to be done. If not, he will miss something. I have his teacher helping him do the same at school. I understand that high school is a whole different ballgame, but if you have teachers that care, they will help. If they can't or won't, then you have to get a plan in place.

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K.H.

answers from Norfolk on

L.,
My son has had ADHD since the second grade. He went through many of the things your daughter has - A's or zeros - no in-between. His principal first denied us access to an IEP or 504, saying he didn't qualify. I did some research and found that any child with ADD orADHD is entitled, by federal law, to a 504 and IEP. I recommend going the 504 route because the IEP teams seem to be generally only interested in placing these kids in some sort of special ed class. They tried to "diagnose" my son with some sort of mental retardation, despite the fact that 90% of the team had never laid eyes on him and that he tested very high on the intelligence charts.
The best thing about a 504 is that YOU write it. When you meet with your daughter's teachers and principal, it's up to you to tell them what sort of concessions she needs. For example, my son is allowed to take oral tests rather that written because he obsesses about neat handwriting. He is also allowed to type his papers rather than write them.
The 504 and IEP committees can be very intimidating. There are usually teachers, guidance counselors, school psychologists, etc. attending. I was usually outnumbered 10 to one. Don't let them get to you! Your daughter is entitled to the 504 and they have no right to push you or her around. You are the best judge of what your child needs and they have to listen to you.
Good luck!

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T.K.

answers from Washington DC on

Hi L.,

All of the responses to you are good and accurate. CHADD is an excellent resource. Your daughter is entitled to a 504 plan (or IEP). Time to get tough and stand up for your daughter! I have a son who has ADD, not ADHD, and it was an uphill battle all the way.

Schools don't like to have to make accommodations. They prefer their cookie cutter mold for everyone. That being said, they will make the accommodations, just don't expect them to initiate anything. In our district you have to ask the school counselor for an EMT (Educational Management Team) meeting, giving him/her a copy of the evaluation. That gets the ball rolling.

Don't be surprised to get there and find yourself surrounded by 10 or more people (hence the term team) many of whom are going to try to keep you from what need for your daughter. Better to go as a united front, have her father there too. Take copies of everything with you. Be prepared to ask for all that you think your daughter needs to be successful in school. (You might not get everything, but it is a start.) With the schools, you need to be assertive and tough, maybe even a bit of a bit*@. Don't back down. They hope that you will.

Keep an ongoing notebook of all papers, notes, forms, and anything relative to this. Plans generally need to be updated annually. It will help you to keep everything organized and accessible as the years go by.

If I sound a bit jaded, I am. I hope you don't meet as much resistance as we did! If you don't get what you need for her, consider a private school, one that can deal with kids with different learning styles.

Keep in mind that people with ADD are generally very bright and extremely creative. They just need help with structure and maneuvering through tedious day-to-day stuff. It can even be a very positive thing for her in the long run.

Best of luck to you and your family.

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S.P.

answers from Richmond on

Wow! This sounds like you were writing about me. I'm 28 now and was diagnosed with ADD in college at the age of 25. I have, however, suffered from ADD for a long time.I too was in Advanced courses in high school. AP classes to be exact. I was a good student for the most part. I would wait til the end to finish things or take extra long. Sometimes I would skip projects and work altogether. Shame on her teachers for considering her to be a "rebel". I am amazed to see how many teachers and schools try to place kids in this one size fits all learning mold. This is simply unfair and out of touch with the children of today. Too many things are around to distract kids and parents for the matter. I WAS on the ADD medication and I'm going to be perfectly HONEST with you about them. Have you seen a difference with her concentration and school work since she has been on her meds?
I obviously don't know you or your daughter so I am just going on assumption here. I also know by personal experience, but more than likely the medication is doing nothing but getting her all hopped up. I was on Ritalin and Adderall (not the same time). It just made me "speedy." I knew that I had to get off of them. They simply did not live up to the hype. I have found natural alternatives that seem to help me a bit better. Exercise is crutial and a correct diet. Have you ever heard of the Feingold diet? People swear by it. I have experimented with it recently for my daughter (who shows the same characteristics as me, just hyperactive due mostly to being bored.) By just eliminating unnatural preservatives and colored foods, she has been calm and pleasant.
Another thing about school is she could be bored. ADD minds go a mile a minute, things change like the wind. Shame on the teachers who are so inflexable. I understand the whole teaching of responsibility, but seriously, bragging about it.
I would recommend her getting an IEP. It could help her out in the future as far as extra time on exams and quizes or having her teacher or professor adjusting and accomadating their time to fit to your child's needs. Her ADD will not go away, no matter how many different medications the doc. puts her on. Instead of fighting it, you need to find ways to work with it. I hope that helps, I'm sorry if it doesn't. I'm an adult and it still is a major factor in how I view the world. Example I graduated from college with a Graphic design degree. I worked in the field a year, almost two. Guess what! I'm taking Biology classes so I can become a research scientist. The research aspect of my life makes things interesting. I'm always on a quest so to speak. Good luck with your daughter. Trust me you have some interesting times ahead! PS..... turning her things in Electronically, brilliant idea!
peace to you!

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A.C.

answers from Washington DC on

I am a former FCPS teacher. You can have a 504 plan created for your daughter based on her medical condition. She does not need to qualify with grades. It can state some of your concerns and requests for alternative assignments. Good luck. You are her best advocate!

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D.A.

answers from Washington DC on

L.,

My son is now 22, he was diagnosed with ADHD in 1st grade and Bipolor as a teenager. it can be very difficult to navigate the school system to get the proper guidance. 1st.. Make sure your in a School district that recognizes. ADHD has a disability. Most do but there are a few around the country who do not. Second, if you have a diagnosis from professionals and IEP cannot be denied. You have appeal rights as well. Make sure your school district provides you all the correct literature relating to that. If they don't go to your state school board and get it and report them for not giving it to you. Just because she gets C doesn't mean she is not entitled. Often ADHD kids have problem with organization and homework and require special assistance to get it done. You need to become your child's advocate and push for the necessary exceptions in the IEP and demand what your child is entitled to by law. Don't back down when they tell them your not entitled; it is usually cause they don't want to pay for the special needs. I went through years of fighting and finally got my son the proper IED, when he was ADHD. it makes a huge difference with the right things going on at school.

I wish you well.

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A.H.

answers from Norfolk on

My daughter is gifted- she is 5- and she struggles with her emotions because her mind is ALWAYS going. As a result her teacher wanter her to be tested because they thought something was wrong with her. Luckily she has been going to the guidance counselor and she realized that Elizabeth is like a little adult academically- she did a little research about emotions and giftedness and found this article- www.sengifted.org-articles_parenting/Probst_WhenYourChild... This article discusses how many gifted children get mislabled due to being very emotional. A 504 would help with keeping her organized- also the teachers will HAVE TO follow the plan. This would prevent them from giving her 0 on her work. Good Luck!

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A.H.

answers from Washington DC on

Hi L.,

I work at a tutoring company and most of the kids we tutor are ADD or AD/HD. For help with your child, I would first go the the CHADD web site (Children and Adults with ADD). There are excellent articles, explanations, and resources for you.

Then I would check in with the school counselor or learning specialist, who help with these kids all the time. The counselor might have great advice as to how to prepare for the school meeting.

Since her testing recommended an IEP, the teachers are obligated to do one. As you know, the plan should ensure that your child get specific learning accommodations (such as being able to email her work in, or audiotape the class instruction).

That said, there are a number of ways you and she can figure out how to get organized at home. Systems and routines seem to help. Special bins for notebooks. Colorful post-it notes on the front door to remind her to check her backpack.

Also see our web site, PositiveLearningExperiences.com. We have lots of print outs, web sites, and suggestions that could really help!

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M.T.

answers from Washington DC on

Ok I have only done this 4 times so far and have my last one who is in the 10th grade and I had one that is mentally retarded she is 28 years old now. I know your daughter doesnt want to conform to rules and such but here are some little things I did. School is their employer and the report card is how well they are doing at this job like a job preformace report. I think you need to tell her that. You arent going to be around forever so she needs to learn responsibilty and get her work done it has nothing to do with conforming its life!!! I am sure we would like to do whatever we all wanted but hey there are rules we have to follow!

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