Hello

T.,
First let me say that I am sorry you are going through this. I think one of the things that we all agree on is that we never want our children to hurt. I went through a divorce a few years back and know how much I worried about my children. Although I don't know how to address you directly on how to get him to stop bad mouthing you, I can tell you that you are doing the right thing in not saying anything about him. There are many many studies that show that as the children grow, they realize the truth anyway. Lean on your strength and faith and instead of focusing your energies on how to stop him, try to focus your energies on building the trust between you and your boys. They are young and you are their mommy. They will love you regardless. Foster your relationship(s) with them both individually and as a family. Let them know that nobody loves them like you do and they can ALWAYS talk to mom. You are in a rough time and you will need time to be with your friends and just to be alone, but I caution you to not let that need take away from them right now.
You will be fine. I am living proof....

WOW!! I am soo sorry you have to go through this, I am a former preschool teacher and I have seen this at least once every year! The first thing I advise is-If you love your husband and he loves you, then EVERYTHING can be worked out in time. Counseling is a must with you, your husband, and your children (they will need an unbias professional). I agree with all the others opinions as well, first you are doing right by your children by not dragging their father through the mud. Second, try to get your family in a strong family oriented church, GOD does help. Third, your husbands addiction is simply that, it has nothing to do with the way he feels about you. Men are very visual. Don't let that bother you.(for now unless it takes money or support from your family) However, I would have told you not to marry him in the beginning unless he stopped because all Porn does is invite satan into a marriage, but that is too late. So now you have the for better or worse vow! I understand it takes two, so if he is not willing to seek counseling, than start with a seperation. BUT you must still find counseling for you and the kids, for sanity sake. If you want to talk one on one I would love to offer you support. Good Luck N.

You are wise to think carefully about your childrens mental health. It can be devasting to young children to get caught up in "adult" problems. Parents are not perfect and we all have things we would like to forget ever happened. Children are also very smart and if they see that mommy is the one that is taking care of them and more nurtering, that will stay with them. There are however transparenting classes (lectures actually) at Pensacola Junior College that are mandated in some cases by the court, I believe, for people divorcing or seperating with children. You might check into that if you can convince your husband that it is in the best interest of the children. Good luck.....C.

You sound as though you have your stuff together and really want whats best for your childrn and youself so my question to you is "WHY ARE YOU STILL THERE?'
I'm a mom of 4 grown children and raised them all on my own as their dad was with his OTHER FAMILY,as he would say.He also was a negative person,so I know where your at.I put up with it for 14 yrs then I got smart and moved on with my children.They all have turned out wonderful and also learned from mistakes their dad made with them so they do not repeat the same with their children...also I have 7 grandchildren and all are doing great...Good luck,S.

I have been there and done that and my kids were 4 and 6, now 8 and 10; and if I had to go do it again--I would have found God and a church that we liked sooner and I would not have given up. Our marriage was bad and we went to counseling and I ended up going alone, but now that it has been almost 5 years, I would not have gotten divorced. I see what it has done to my kids, and I have dated and I have even become remarried and going into it the second time is not any easier--you have his ex, your ex, possibly his kids and your kids--so you have more stress and more problems. And now that we are divorced we are the best of friends and we still try to parent the kids together--however I swear if I had found a church that we could throw ourselves into and get on the right track we would still be together. I am not a bible pusher, but I have seen the changes in my life and family and I see the mistakes I have made--try to teach your children to be loving and see what it was that got you to fall in love in the first place-
Good luck!

I'm so sorry you have to deal with this. Your children definitely don't deserve to be put in the middle of an adult issue. Unfortunately, you can't control how other people act. Even when you know it's not in the best interest of the children. It's sad that he can't get past his own anger to be able to spend time with his own children without demeaning you. You may be feeling the effects of it right now, but just know that he is digging his own hole, not yours. They will see him more clearly the older they get. And it won't be an easy road getting there. Time doesn't necessarily heal all wounds, but it does allow a different perspective to come in after a while. That's all that you can hope for.
You are doing the right thing by not talking bad about their dad to them. Keep showing them love and acceptance. And remember that everything is temporary. The only thing that never changes is knowing that things are going to change.

No matter what you end up doing, counseling is a must. If he wont go with you, go by yourself. You will learn how to work out your own feelings, and in turn, you will be better prepared for the road ahead. It's not going to be easy, so you need to help yourself. Addictions are not just something you canstop, he needs counseling as well. whether or not he sees that is another story. I wish you the best of luck...

I think you should try to talk to hubby first of all and get him to see that fighting you and trying to make you look like the bad guy will only make the kids see him as the bad guy in the end. Especially if you take the high ground and never say anything bad about him to the kids. Always keep an even tone of voice when talking to him and about him to the children. Try as hard as you can to keep your temper no matter what he says or does. This will show him and the children that you can control yourself even when he obviously can't, as shown by his immature behavior. (If anything, it will also get under his skin more that he can't phase you with his actions :) I have had a lot of experience with people who try to upset me. I have found that when I respond this way, they will either get so mad at me that they stop bothering with me totally, or realize that they can't get to me, just give up and get over their problem with me.

Above all, make sure your kids know that you both love them and try your hardest to keep your temper around them at least. If you need to blow off steam or vent about how he is acting, make sure they are not around and never hear about it.

Good Luck.

Hi T.,
My heart is aching for you. I applaud your desire and actions to protect your children from the ravages of a not"happy" marriage.
I don't know if you are a Christian or not, but the Christian ideal is that the husband's role is all about protection, purity, and presentation - presenting his wife holy and without blemish. The wife is subject to all of that. Oh, what wonder if our marriages reflected that in the way they are supposed to. Yet, it is still our our pattern. One hard part is that one mate cannot make that happen for both. A marriage relationship is a two way street. How wonderful it would seem initially if only one could fix it, then the one who is trying could bring it to pass. I don't know if you have tried counselling, but it can help. An excellent counselor is Dr. Charles Bell at First Baptist Church of Orlando. He will work with couples together and/or separately. He is gentle in helping to guide toward resolution. They take insurance and the cost is not exhorbitant. You seem very transparent and willing to lay yourself bare under proper circumstances to get to a place of working out things. You also have shown great care in keeping your little ones safe from the emotional upheaval that can carry unknown consequences for a very long time. Again I applaud you.

T.,
How terribly sad for your family that this is happening. You are doing the right thing by not talking bad about your husband to the kids. I don;t think his "talk" alone will be enough to turn your kids away. Hurt them and confuse them, yes, but turn them against you...probably not. If you are being a mature, loving, and dedicated mom, they will see this and it will contraduct Dad's assesmant of you. Sure, right now they are so young, anyone could convince them of anything, but as they grow and mature, they will see the truth. If they can look back on all the years and see that you ALWAYS treated Dad with respect and NEVER spoke badly of him, then they will have no reason to believe him. They will wonder how come Dad was so mean to such a loving, kind person. Your only real defense is your own adittude.
As far as wanting to protect them from the hurt of divorce, I will say that the hurt of an unhappy home is MUCH worse. I know this form my owm childhood. As much as I loved my dad, I was glad when they divorced because I was scared to death everytime they fought. I stil got to see my dad and he was still around so it was much better in my mind. And I was only nine.
Having said that, I will say that if their is any way to work out your problems, DO IT!! I don't think people should stay in an unhappy marriage, but I think you should do all you can to make it a happy one. If you have done things in the past to cause hurt (as indicated in your request), then earn his forgivness. Don't thik that just because you've apologized and stopped doing it that he is supposed to forgive you. Sure in a perfect world, we would all be able to forgive and forget. But in a perfect world, we wouldn't need the forgness in the first place! We are human and we have a hard time forgiving. If this is the case with your husband, then you have the responsibility to make him trust and forgive. Whatever that takes. It's on you.
If you want your marriage to work then you will have to sacrifice. Don't think of it as 50/50. Think of it as giving ALL to him. Be willing to give 100% and get nithing back. The idea is that he will change when he sees the change in you. I know many people don't like this kind of thinking and it may seem outdated, but if your marriage is worth keeping, do what it takes. If you are not going to make it a happy one, then get out of it. The kids are suffering in this unhappiness, for sure!
Pronography will surely cause poblems and counceling is in order, but be careful. Therapist are human and you may find one who thinks there is othing wrong with it.
I pray you have the wisdom to do the right thing. ~C.

I went through a divorce after an almost 11 year marriage as well. My daughter was only two at the time so at the time when it was ugly, she did not understand what her father may have been saying to her completely. She is now 5 and I have remarried. Her father has continued to say things about me and my new husband (and even MY family who lives next to my EX) to or around her. I know because she asks questions about what something means or does Daddy, Grandma (fill in the blank) like you or like her step-father. They seem to think that because of her age, she is not picking up on things they are saying around her so I have had to be blunt with them and tell them to keep quiet about anything to do with me or my new husband especially when my daughter is around. My daughter loves me (very much a mommy's girl) and it hurts her to hear things about me especially from other people she loves. I wish I had more encouraging advice, it has gotten better over the last few years but it is still there. The best thing you can do is keep the high road, not to talk about their father in front of them, keep your opinions quiet and know that one day when they are older they WILL respect you for that and see their father in his true light. Tell your sons that you love them and that if their father says anything hurtful about you or that makes them feel uncomfortable that they can talk to you about it openly and that you won't get angry with them. If they have an impartial adult friend or family member see if they will talk to them openly if your sons don't want to talk to you about it because they think they might hurt your feelings. Until the negativity ceases, even if it is non-verbal tension, they will pick up on it. It's hard but the best thing is just to be nice to their father when he is around and your children will see that. As they get older if they ask questions about the divorce and the things their father might continue to say, be honest with them about it and tell them that no matter what you may have done, you have always loved them.

T., reading your message takes me back to when I was an intern working in the children's psychiatric unit at Balboa Naval hospital. We did a family group for seperating, divorcing and divorced families to help them deel with some of the issues that you mentioned. Truth is I don't like to give advice and generaly shy away from giving genral answeres to questions like yours. However, I will share with the thought in mind that you can take it or leave it. The biggest misconception with parents seperated or divorced is that they feel it is the right thing to do because when they are together all they do is fight. True as that may be, when you seperate the need to communicate increases subsantially. Even if you think you can stop talking to your husband you will have to speak regarding the children, i.e., scheduling visits and such. You must know how hard it is to actually feel heard and understood by your husband. As you described in your question the communication is already broken between the two of you and now between you and the kids and the kids and their father. This will not improve with seperation unless everyone works at it, which does not seem likely. As I see it you will have to go outside yourself to find a source of resolve and strenght to not allow yourself to be rattled by your husbands efforts to upset you. You will have to let everything go on a continuous basis and reinforce to your children that despite what thier father says you are thier mother and you love them and you are going to do the best you can to be their best mom. It will probably take an act of God to be so forgiving of your husband and let go of all the things that have upset you and continue to upset you. I am sorry for your struggle and I wish for you some peace.

D.

Dear T.,

I wanted to tell you that a pornography addiction and all that it entails is so much more common than anyone would want to admit. I've seen it tear apart lives and I've seen it overcome! If your husband has admitted this to you for the first time, then now is the time to act! It sounds like a great time to suggest counseling to him, you can go as a couple or separately. His reasons for lashing out at you and using the kids the way he does is most likely part of the whole addiction and him isolating himself, the shame, your unhappiness, the arguing...all part of a vicious cycle. I can recommend a very gentle, very skilled therapist if you'd like. May this all come to strengthen you, not tear you apart. God Bless. ~Suzanne

T.,
I can't say that I've been through your situation with my husband, nor with my parents, but I can say this - when my parents actually argued, they did so behind closed doors, and did not raise their voices, so that we wouldn't be involved in it, and wouldn't get worried about things that we didn't need to. I look back now, and realize what a positive affect that had on my childhood.

After 11 years of marriage, I hope that you and your husband can call some sort of truce - try and reason with him - if there is ever a moment when you two can talk civily to each other, make an agreement to keep the kids out of it, and agree not to drag each other through the mud to your kids, no matter how ugly the divorce gets. If he loves your kids, he should see your reasoning and agree to it.

Kudos to you for being the strong one and not emotionally damaging your children by pitting them against their father. They shouldn't have to chose. Good luck, I wish you the best.

STAYING TO GETHER FOR THE KIDS IS BULL. DAD HAVE A NEW FRIEND?

EXPLAIN IN KIDS TERMS.( wHEN YOU ARE MAD AT SOME ONE DD YOU SAY MEAN THINKS TO HURT THEM, EVEN IF IT'S NOT TRUE?) THAT IS WHAT DADDY IS DOING. NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS, NONE OF IT IS YOUR FAULT AND MOMMY LOVES YOU VERY MUCH AND ALWAYS WILL.)

Always be honest no matter how hard it may seem. Kids ask and observe everything as you well know. They key is breaking your responses down to their level. You do not have to take being degraded by no man. If he is unapproachable to discuss this than I suggest you continue to be a positive role model for the kids and nip any behavior that appears to be disrespectful to women or your authority but of course you do this with love. Find a male role model for them to emulate after(Grand Dad, Uncle, etc.) but not so obvious to cause more trouble with your spouse. Keep your chin up Mom, it's rough but you can conquer this.

K., FL

I am sorry to hear about your situation. However, I am from a family where my parents divorced when I was young. It was the best thing that could have ever happened. We didn't have to see or hear the fighting and such... Children are resilient and they bounce back from most things, in my opinion. If you keep it real and explain to them that even though mommy and daddy aren't in love, you both still love the children. Your six year old will take it harder than the 3 year old, again this is just my opinion. As far as having one not bash the other... I had a parent that I will not mention that did the same thing. The other parent would explain that they were just still upset and people say things they may not always mean when they are upset. Hopefully your husband will realize that saying negative things about the mother of his children may eventually turn the children against him in the long run. I don't wish that on him.

I feel for you and your family. I can totally relate. I wish I could be more help, but I was young when I went through it. The above is some of what I remember being said to me and it seemed to help. Life has a way of working out. Just take it one day at a time. Good luck and god bless!

Oh, T., I feel for you, and am very sorry that your husband cannot see the unneeded stress and turmoil he is putting his children through because of his anger directed towards you.

Assuming you have pulled him aside and talked to him about the negative effects of putting the children in the middle of adult disputes, and your efforts have been unsuccessful....I would suggest having a private chat with someone close to him that he trusts and respects (close friend or family member), and asking them to talk with him. Make sure he knows that it is okay to be upset with you and to discuss his concerns with you (out of earshot of the children), but it is never okay to do so when the children are around, and never okay to say negative things about each other. You are their mother, and one of, if not the biggest part, of the children. If they hear negative things about you, it reflects upon them, and children do not need this added blow to their self esteem. Their parents should be their rocks and their soft places.

In the meantime, maybe you can have a good heart-to-heart talk with your children and say things along the lines of..."I know that you have seen and heard some grown-up arguments and disagreements between your father and I. These are just that: grown up arguments and disagreements. I am very sorry that you have been made aware of this because it must make you feel very uncomfortable and uneasy. The most important thing for you to always know is that your mommy and daddy love both of you very, very much, and will always be there for you and always protect and take care of you. Grown ups are not perfect, we make mistakes too, and I will try to shield and protect you from grown up problems, and please know that you can always talk to me if you have any questions or concerns, and I will always be honest with you."

I will say a prayer for you and your family. Oh! I so feel for you!

Wow, good luck in this trying time. Have you tried counseling? Family counseling would be best but even if your husband won't go you should go for yourself and the kids. And taking the kids with you won't hurt either. Now is also the time to strengthen the bonds with their extended family, on both sides if you can. If you are divorcing or separating, you can't protect your kids from the reality; they'll be living it soon enough and it will be traumatic for them. I'm not saying they won't get through it but I am saying it will be a trauma. Your kids need to see how other people see you. For their sake too the dad needs to stop badmouthing you, but there isn't much you can do about this. I think counseling could give him an outlet for his anger and help him realize the cost of not forgiving, and maybe you two can work past it. Has he mentioned divorce? Is this what he wants? I'm not a family counselor but I really think that is what your family needs right now. And don't think you can't afford it; there are sliding scales and payment plans for that sort of thing. Sometimes even your husband's employer will pay for it.

My heart goes out to you. There's nothing you can do about his behavior. He's going to do what he's going to do. It definatly is sad that he chooses to be so selfish to not even think what he's doing to his children. He can be mad at you all he wants, but he shouldn't bring the children into this. He obviously does not know how to deal with his anger and grief. I say grief because he's loosing his family and he doesn't know how to deal with it. Is he a believer in God? Does he trust that God can make all things to HIs Glory? I will keep your family in my prayers. Good Luck. Leave your husband to God. Pray for your husband even when you don't want to. God will bless you in your obedience.

Hi T.,

A pornography addiction changes everything. (Don't feel bad that he hid this from you. He's embarrassed as he should be. If he told you willingly, he has made an effort to let you in.) I guess you know this is not a regular kind of addition. It's more emotional and ONLY men can truly understand it. It truly skews the mind. I'm not sure it can really be overcome, only managed. That does explain the last few years of the marriage not being as happy...this is something that eats away at a marriage.

First of all, YOU need to protect your kids AND your husband from it the best you can. Put a filter on your computer and KNOW where he is ALL the time. Tell him you are willing to help him IF you want this marriage to work. This will also be ongoing. You cannot be exposed to pornography as a man and not have it affect you. Remember the little Sunday school ditty, "Be careful little eyes what you see!" This is exactly why....

You don't have to "down" your husband to the kids but they do need to know the truth. Daddy is having some problems and Mommy has to help him. We're all human. Reassure them that they can tell you anything and everything. Tell your husband that he cannot tell the kids bad information about you anymore. Hold him to it. I think this is where you have to be in the driver's seat of the marriage for a while. (If you are not in a good church, you probably should find one. The fellowship of other men will help him. And you'll all benefit.)

T., I have seen very unhappy marriages become happy again when crises happen. This is definitely a crisis. Honesty always helps. I'll be praying for you and be glad to talk to you privately if you like. Remember you always have the support here in mamasource too....

God bless,

M.

Hi T. - You can only control your own tongue. Please hold it and spare your children the baggage that they don't deverse or need to carry throughout their life. My advice is to ask yourself who is the adult here? BE ONE! I am recently divorced and my husband have agreed to be mature about this subject. We are both the parents and the children love both of us regardless and unconditional. That should not change because of selfishness or defensiveness.
I know many grown children of divorced parents and have asked them what is the number one thing that upset them about the divorce. They ALL say when a parent speaks bad about the other one. PLEASE DON'T DO IT FOR THE INNOCENT CHILDREN'S SAKE!
L.

Hi T.,
I have been married for thirty-six years and have felt several times that I wanted to call it quits.Inthat process I have learned some things that might be helpful to you.Know yourself and where you come from.Understand your beliefs and stand by them.Do not be brought down to a different level by argueing.If you can not communicate how you feel and what you believe to your spouse verbally write him a letter.He will have to read it over and over to get it but spell it out in detailwhy you feel the way you do.If the response is not what you can accept then seek professional help.Accept the fact that your children will be affected by this divorce and try to educate yourself on how to explain it to them and deal with their feelings.Deal with the emotional part first then deal with the legal part.Always realize that damage is being done by you not being happywithout a lot of your control. So take control and show your love and understanding to your children and know that you can provide them a better life without the turmoil that anger and fighting cause.You really have to get in touch with your soul to make this transition work. My prayers are with you, C.

Good morning T.,
I went through a horrible divorce, after going through a horrible 15years of marriage. I can imagine what you are going thru. I do not have advise for you, because there is nothing that I can say that would problably make you feel better. You and only you know what you are going through, but if you need to talk to some one, I can listen!
Kisses to your kids.