Dad's Swinging Behavior Too Rough on Little Joints?

This happened to my a co-worker of mine He accidentally dislocated his daughter's shoulder when she was under 2 yrs old. Unfortunately his wife was out of town when it happened and the folks at the ER had to call Child Protective Services and removed her from their home until his wife came back from her business trip and he could undergo counseling.

My friend's husband dislocated his daughter's shoulder doing this. It wasn't a fun ER visit! She was over two but he might as well stop now before she gets any heavier.

I would have to agree with you and be worried about my husband doing that too. Maybe if you found some reading material on it for him to read that would help better than you just saying dont do it. Or maybe he could go with you to the dr. and have them tell him it's not ok to do.

Sometimes daddies don't think about that kinds of stuff. Good luck!

I truly do believe that she'd cry or show with her facial expression that she didn't like the feeling before there was any question of harm. You may have seen questions from Moms asking ''' How in the WORLD do I get my husband to enjoy my toddler?"" --- you are blessed ( and I hear your concern) ---

Run, don't walk to your phone- ask for an ASAP appt. with your pediatrician 's office or a phone consult with the nurse - becasue your family deserves to be at ease - and enjoying this wonderful time- and I suspect it is possible that the doctor will advice NO swinging from her hands - but whatever the decision - I'm sure you can come to a peaceful agreement - you all 3 deserve that.

Many blessings
Old Mom
aka J.

My uncle dislocated my sister's shoulder when she was little by picking her up to a hip hold by her wrist. She's never let him forget it!!

I would say ask your husband to consider how he would feel if that happened and please don't do it. Roughhousing is wonderful, (especially for girls like mine who don't have brothers!) but doing your best to prevent injury is just part of the deal.

My husband does the same thing with all our kids... it drives me crazy. He found this online and thought it was the funniest thing.... www.break.com/usercontent/2008/10/Swinging-baby-597823.html He thinks he needs to work on our kids to get them to be able to do that.

Hopefully your husband won't dislocate her elbow and have to make a trip to the doctor. That's a hard way to learn the damage you've done to your child. Just let husband know that this happens. Once it happens, it is more likely to happen again. My son dislocated his elbow when I had a hold of his hand and he threw himself limp because he wanted something. It dislocated the elbow and although it popped back in at the dr. it would pop out from time to time and we would manipulate it back in. No fun. My doctor explained to me how fragile their little joints are, so keep educating the hubby.

I agree with those who posted about the POTENTIAL for injury.

But I'd like to also note that it is USE of and STRESS on muscles, bones, and other tissues that make them stronger and more resilient. And a well conditioned little body is less likely to be injured by routine play or falls.

As many moms have noted, elbow dislocations occurred when the child went limp, or when a pull was sudden or unexpected. The trick when playing with a child is keep their muscles engaged during any lifting. With my grandson, I coax him to try to lift or pull himself to me if I will be putting any tension on his arms. And I watch for signs of exhaustion during play, and encourage him to slow down before he gets himself too worn out for his body to guard itself.

Of course, the negative there is that it isn't possible at every moment during a game to know if those little muscles are lax or tired. So moderation is always a good rule.

Thank you for posting this!! My husband constantly does this type of lifting with our 3 month old triplets despite my yelling at him to stop. I am going to read this and the responses to him tonight!!!

Most everyone does it but we learned the hard way that for some; not all, but some their joins can pop our real easy. Our daughter has suffered nurses elbow a few times from others jerking her up using her hands. No fun for the child at all. I would say just try to keep it within reason.

It's probably best not to swing them by the arms the same as you wouldn't want to pull them around by their arms. I do think it's something to ask your pediatrician about (preferably with your husband there), but I don't think you're being overprotective! :)

When my daughter was about 18 months she was playing with her dad and threw herself backwards (as they are apt to do at that age). If he had let her fall, she would have hit her head on the coffee table, so he instictively grabbed her hands. In doing so, he dislocated her elbow. The doctor called it "nurse maids elbow" and said it usually happens when someone is holding onto a child's hand and the child tries to pull away. Some kids are more prone to it than others. There is a heredity factor. If you or your husband has ever had this type of injury, it is more likely to happen to her. The doctor also said that once it has happened it is much more likely to happen again. We, thankfully, have not had a repeat injury yet. It wasn't a big deal to fix, the doctor just popped it back in at the office, but it was very painful for my daughter and my husband felt sick that he had hurt is child however unintentionally.

I'm a physical therapist and Mom of a 2 1/2 year old and I can't tell you how many times I've had to ask my husband to stop this. Our son seems to be having so much fun it's difficult to think that one second things are fine and the next they're not. Though they laugh and smile, they won't be laughing for long when they dislocate an elbow or shoulder. I finally had to print out some internet articles and pictures of "nurse maids elbow" including the causes, which finally helped my husband understand. Though kids tend to heal well, in rare cases there can be other complications that have longer lasting effects.

I think it's wonderful that we have such involved husbands that want to play and spend time with their kids, but you're exactly right about the fragility of the joints.

Good Luck!

Hello Michelle,

Although I'm not Dr. I have 2 litlle ones that are girls as well. My husband used to do the same as yours and I truely think it depends on the core weight of the child if it is hurting the child or not. Heavy kids could be hurt more than skinny tiny kids. Kids are resilient(sp.) if its hurting her she should be saying something or having a scared look on her face. Watch her body language and that should tell. Thanks, Annette

Find out the information from your pediatrician. That will carry more weight (no pun intended) with your husband than just your opinion.

We know that their little joints aren't strong enough for that kind of treatment yet, but husbands sometimes need more "official" notification.

My pediatrician said that lifting our toddler by the forarms and elbows could stretch the ligaments, causing the joints to pop out. It scared us out of even thinking of lifting our baby this way. I hope that everything works out for you, though.

Hi,
I would ask that he not do that.. We were walking / trying to cross the street and my husband was holding my two year old by the wrist as she was pitching a major fit. She went limp to protest and all her weight was on her arm.. A total acident but her elbow came out of its socket and we had to take her to childrens er. they were able to pop it back into place and boy was she crying in pain.. we felt so bad and now if she is pitching a fit and i am trying to cross the street ect.. i carry her in a football hold to insure he arms do not get hurt.. It is a common injury that they cal nurse maid.. the dr... told us never swing her by her arms or anything.
best of luck,
Lenc

Yup, it's a definite no-no.

Among the many problems, the most common is a dislocated elbow (often called nursemaid's elbow) that can happen whenever you pull or hold a kid by the hands/wrists rather than picking them up under their armpits.

The thing that most folks (like me!) don't know until they take their kid to the ER and see the x-rays is their joints until about age 5 are almost entirely soft cartilege. When we saw x-rays of my then 2-year-old daughter's wrist and elbow after her first dislocation, it was really bizarre because there were all these empty spaces where adults have bones.

Once you get the first dislocation (and I assume the shoulder is the same way but I know you can get the elbow dislocated from doing what your husband does), subsequent ones happen more easily and frequently until the joint fully hardens into bone around age 5.

I'm not a doctor, but my daughter's right elbow has been dislocated three times so far, including twice within a month at preschool. In each case, someone had her by the hand and she resisted and tried to pull away. It's a fairly easy fix for the dislocation, but it's VERY painful to the child.

I have a niece whose elbow was dislocated doing exactly what your husband does by her grandparents, and a cousin whose kid had her elbow dislocated repeatedly by a grandparent who insisted it wasn't dangerous.

It's true that your daughter would/will let you know when she is injured, but the fact that so many kids end up in the ER every day from injuries caused by people pulling kids up by their hands should be enough for your husband to quit it.

http://www.emedicinehealth.com/nursemaid_elbow/article_em... has more details about it. Point your husband to page 2 at the above link where it specifically says that what he's doing causes this injury.

Hope that helps!

He's got to be a little bit careful, as a child's elbow can dislocate fairly easy. It's called Nursemaid's elbow and was given that name because the nursemaids would pick the chile up by the arm and the radial head would dislocate. Once it goes out, it's looser and can happen again. I had a friend whose child had this. I'm not an oversensitive/overprotective mom (by any means) but just know it can happen.

I grew up with five older brothers. Twice they dislocated my shoulder by doing this.

Hello Michelle:

Children under the age of 5 should be picked up by their trunk and not their hands or under the shoulder/armpits. This is what I was told by every Dr. that my daughter has ever seen.

Most children LOVE it...the problem is exactly as you're thinking though...their tendons/ligaments stretch. It USUALLY takes several months for them to stretch enough to start popping out of place. But it will happen. (Obviously more strenuous swinging, either in play or anger, can cause it to happen much faster.) The big problem with stretching tendons and ligaments is that they do not heal on their own. They stay stretched. As an ex-gymnast, who had her tendons and ligaments stretched on purpose, I can tell you from first hand experience that it has lifetime consequences.

OR

The less common thing that will happen (more often with boys then girls) is that the muscles start to compensate by forming scar tissue (because the muscles are tearing a little bit at a time). This limits their natural range of movement. If your daughter DOESN'T start popping out of joint soon make sure you're doing gentle stretches with her every day to keep the scar tissue from binding up.

You're not over-reacting. I have to tell you though I not only had to read chapter and verse on 'shaken baby syndrome' to my own husband for months (who liked to bounce our son HARD, and toss him onto the bed so he'd laugh)...I eventually had to drag him into the pediatricians office with me to "demonstrate". The pediatrician's horrified "Oh my god, STOP!" embarrassed him, but it ended the behavior. We had to work with him (my husband) to soothe his ego AND to show him he could STILL play with our son...just not so roughly.

Good Luck!!!
Z

This is one of those things that is perfectly fine and fun until it isn't. Their elbows can dislocate so easily (shoulders not as easily but it happens), and once those ligaments have been stretched, it can be an issue for a long time.

As an adult I had to have a shoulder reconstruction because of loose ligaments and tendons from repeated dislocation. Every time it dislocated, it got looser, and got to the point where if I did something simple like reach back for the seat belt or try to lift something down off a high shelf, my shoulder would pop out & then right back in. Years of physical therapy, 6 weeks of one arm immobilized with no driving or lifting anything post-op, and about 1 year post-op to get my shoulder to where it should be. I wouldn't recommend it, it wasn't fun!

You may be able to guess that I yelled at my husband continually for swinging the kids around by their arms, and eventually he got the message when I had that shoulder surgery with a 15 month old little boy at home and he had to take over all duties involving 2 arms, driving or lifting anything (and you all know that moms of toddlers never do any of those things...).

Here are a couple of links to articles on the subject, if you need help convincing the hubby:
http://www.answers.com/topic/nursemaid-s-elbow
http://www.drugs.com/enc/radial-head-dislocation.html
http://www.allsands.com/health/advice/nursemaidselbow_aaz...

It is unsafe because the elbow (or wrist) can dislocate -- nursemaid's elbow. This causes a great deal of pain, and requires a trip to the doctor to have it put back in. Both of my children have done this (without hanging on a parent -- just an upward movement on their own while playing). Not worth the fun of swinging. Tell your husband to grab under her arms and swing her -- she will still love it (maybe even more as she can swing higher!).

My oldest son had one of his elbows dislocated (nursemaids elbow)when he was three because of this. After going to the hospital to have it popped back into place (which is painful for them) I was told that until around the age of 5 that joint is not totally sealed in and can pop out. And once it happens, it can happened again very easily. Needless to say, our kiddos no longer get swung around by their hands. My hubby now wraps his arms around their chest with them facing away from him and twirls around like that. They still love it!

I know that feeling of apprehension and unease. As a mom of a 2 year old I have been more and more amazed at how accurate my so-called "mothers' instincts" have constantly been, in myself as well as other moms. In my experience up until now, this kind of powerful feeling has RARELY, if ever, been wrong. Every situation is unique in its own way but in my observation there has almost always a very good reason behind these instinctual feelings! And judging from the other responses you, the mom -- once again -- were right!

Fathers' roles as parents are usually to take risks and be the more rambunctious and entertaining parent, but there must be a limit to all things. You might want to discuss respectful parenting with your partner. If there is something that is not incredibly necessary and one partner very strongly objects, it is the right thing to do for the other partner to desist doing it! Or at the very least, to check it out before continuing... don't you think?

We had to go to the ER to have our son's elbow popped back in (funny thing is, it popped back in by itself on the way to the er, but we wanted him checked out anyway, to be sure of what had happened, yes, nursemaid's elbow). He was a little over 2 yrs at the time. It happened because my daughter was trying to help him climb up and was pulling by his hands and he relaxed. If he had kept his muscles tight, it probably wouldn't have happened. So this might be why it hasn't happened yet with your husband... but it only takes one time. It's very painful and as someone mentioned before, once it does happen, it can happen again more easily in the future. So, we're more careful now.

Good luck convincing your husband.

My daughter was about 20 months or so when DH lifted her off her stool after brushing teeth (he was gentle) but she was really tired and didn't use her muscles to help and both her elbows came out also called Nursemaids elbow. It is very common, but not good and very stressful since it hurts and they can't move their arms until it's fixed. It is easy to fix once but once it happens, the next time the elbow comes out easier. The tendons aren't mature until around 5 years old.

So, yes I would ask him not to do that, they can still have fun without pulling up on her hands.

he needs to be careful. The father my children dislocated my sons elbow by doing that same thing. Take your husband with yoy to the pediatrican and ask him/her so our husband can hear the answer as well. Good Luck

I would ask your pediatrician. I was always told that that was bad on them and would pull their arm out of the socket. My kids are 10 and 7. But I would just ask just to make sure. Good luck.

It actually can be harmful. They can dislocate a joint without really knowing it. you should bring your husband to the pediatrician and then pose the question. That way he will hear it first hand from a professional. You can always talk to your pediatrician first to make sure, but I'm almost possitive this is not a good idea at such a young age. Kids are fun, but they are not toys. Tell your husband to be careful.