Child Still Requires Naps, I Have to Lie With, Always End up Yelling, Feel Bad.

There's a pattern:
naptime
make mommy read
make mommy lie down
make mommy get to her breaking point
sleep

I suggest removing the middle three. She needs to learn how to fall asleep on her own, and thats not something you can "do" for her (reading, snuggling, lotion, yelling).

Or you can keep doing this a few more years. Everyday. Day in and day out. :)

My son used to roll around, play a little, and sing or talk to himself and then all of a sudden he would just be out like a light. You just need to take you out of the equation. Read, hugs and kisses, and let her be.

Set a timer. Put her in her room and tell her to be still, look at books and not to come out until the timer dings. Set it for her sleep time amount plus 20 minutes for time to settle herself.

Added - I didn't say your QUESTION was ridiculous, L.. I said it's ridiculous to yell at your child to get her to sleep. There's a big difference. You have at least 14 more years of living with your daughter, and yelling at her daily is going to bite you in the rear more than you know. I have older teens. I know what I'm talking about. My kids have friends who treat their parents like hellions because of all the yelling they grew up with.

Sometimes we need to hear it from someone else to make an impression. Don't yell at your child for not sleeping.

Original:
Well, I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. You YELL at your child because she is resisting her nap? What?

Think about what else you are going to HAVE to yell at your child in the future to get her to do. The list could be endless! You don't have to yell at her for this. You choose to yell at her.

Tell her that from now on you will read her two stories, and then leave her alone. Tell her that if she does not sleep, that she will feel tired later on, and if she misbehaves because she is tired, she will have to go to her room every time she misbehaves. Then DO IT. No yelling. No arguing. Instantly say "You must be tired because you didn't take your nap. You have to go into your room." Every Single Time.

She'll be awful for a few days. Then she will start taking her nap. Meanwhile, make sure she cannot come out of her room for the entire time that she would normally sleep. She will have absolutely no incentive to stay awake if she can't come out of her room and if you are not in there with her.

You do not have to yell at her. She needs to take responsibility for learning to self-soothe. You haven't allowed her to learn it. Instead, you have conditioned her to finally "let go" by yelling at her.

How would you like it if the only way you knew how to go to sleep is to be yelled into doing it?

Dawn

Roxy is working you. Read her one story, turn the lights off & leave the room. Has she only been like this recently, or has this been since birth? I'm going to guess that you've been probably catering to her at sleep time for her whole life. Kids need to learn how to self soothe, and it's really something that should be taught as a baby, not as a 4 year old. However, she needs to be taught & now is the time. The yelling - would you really want to sleep if someone was yelling at you?

It's my personal experience & opinion that when a child is consistently fighting nap time, maybe their sleep needs are changing, and they may not need the nap anymore, and instead an earlier bedtime. Have you tried quiet time, instead of nap time?

The yelling is her cue that it is NOW time to fall asleep...before that mom isn't really serious.

You need to change the cue...Roxy you have five minutes until time to go nap...Roxy now it is time to read our one book, when the book is done Mommy is going to leave you to nap...Our reading is over now lay down and close your eyes. Then leave her to fall asleep.

She will either play until her nap time is over or she will eventually fall asleep. But put it on her and do not yell. If she stops napping then well I am going to tell you what you don't want to hear...she has out grown her naps.

At four...my daughter would nap maybe once every month to six weeks or if she was sick.

Change the cue...

How much is she sleeping each night? 12 hours? If so then she doesn't "need" the nap. And at 4 she should be almost finished with naps.

She is playing you and you are allowing it. If you really want her to nap, read her a book and then walk out and shut the door. If you want her to nap for an hour or two, tell her you'll be back then, as you both need quiet time and alone time. Even kids need that.

Right now you are allowing her to control everything. You're the adult so you are the one who needs to change/stop this pattern.

Stop laying down with her. If she really needs the nap she will fall asleep on her own, without you having to force the issue.

Honestly she can go without a nap, but it would require you to rethink your day and bed time, plus put up with a slightly cranky child until she adjust. Once she hit's kindy, there are no naps. it would be better to work on quite time versus nap time.

What kind of daily routine do you have by the hour? Is she up at X, lunch at Y and nap at Z? Do you two go outside and play or walk or to the park to burn off the extra energy?

These are things that help a child to get tired and take a nap. Also, what kinds of food do you eat -- processed or homemade? If it is processed it could be all the extra chemicals.

Just ideas that come to mind. Set up a new schedule for you both. Include your household chores and time with daughter. Take out the yelling and become matter of fact with no emotion. When it is time to do something do it and that is it. If it is not done then a consequence. Get her ready for school next year. Because she will have consequences if she does not listen from the teacher and her classmates.

Yelling does not accomplish much but high blood pressure and feeling bad because you yelled. Some children are just more stubborn/high strong and want to do things their way. You can use a mommy voice but not the normal mommy voice. Find one that means business without yelling and use it.

Good luck to you.

The other S.

PS This is your first question which is a good one. But you must remember that there are many people of different backgrounds, ages, and experience that have stopped to respond to you with what is/has gone on in their parenting. Yes we have many ways of responding what we say we mean honestly and please read through the harsh ones and find a nuggest that will help you from outside the box. Please do write more and don't run away from us. We are from 18 to 60 plus here both moms and dads.

I'm a tough love kind of parent. I'd either take out the nap and have personal quiet time.. or I'd make her go to sleep on her own. Give her the option and see what SHE wants to do. Maybe you think she needs a nap but she just wants quality time with you. At 4 she should be able to verbalize this. And you need to quit yelling. It's not serving a real purpose here. Good luck.

Hi L.,

One question-- does your child know how to fall asleep by herself, or are you laying down with her until she falls asleep at night as well? This would help me to give you a better answer to your question-- I'll check back on this later, because 'not napping' and "doesn't know how to fall asleep alone" are two different problems.

The yelling is her signal that the playing and easing into sleep is over. It's part of the routine for her. It's time to change the routine. It sounds to me as if you need her to nap more than she does. :-)

I have to say that I find it very unusual for a child older than 3 years old to still be taking frequent daily naps. The only one of my children who napped through 3 years old was my youngest. Every now and then she and I still take a good nap together, and she's 7, but it's just how she's made. My eldest daughter HATED napping and never really did. My middle daughter stopped napping as soon as she turned 3 years old. Every one of my friends' children stopped napping when they turned 3 years old or sooner.

well, she has you trained that you 'have' to stay with her, that she 'has' to go to sleep, and you have trained her that she 'has' to be yelled at before she'll do it.
you guys all need some serious retraining.
first off, if she has to be yelled into a nap, she's transitioning out of the need. let her have a rest, and if she falls asleep, terrific. if not, she must stay in bed and be quiet. if she wiggles or plays with her stuffed animals or reads, let her. she's not a baby. she'll sleep when she needs to and you MUST allow her to learn how to relax herself.
stop lying down with her. clearly it's not relaxing for either one of you. change the routine into short story, brief snuggle/back rub/skritch, then get out.
stop yelling. you are teaching your 4 year old that the only way to make yourself heard and understood is through volume. you do not want her to internalize this lesson.
you're the adult. you're the mom. you're not helpless and you're not being forced into this by this small girl. take control. calmly, lovingly, competently.
khairete
S.

Have you tried "quiet time" where she has to stay in her room and play/read books/lay down, but she doesn't actually have to sleep? What time is her bed time? Could you forgo the nap and back up her bedtime by an hour?

I prefer my 4 year old to nap, but when he doesn't, we just put him to bed at 7pm instead of 8pm.

My niece used to come home from Kindergarten and take a nap (1/2 day K)....If she needs sleep, let her have it, she may be growing.

My dd is 9 and I still have to lay down with her at night - it's one of the few times we sit and talk so I don't mind... I find out more stuff about school, friends, etc that I'd never know otherwise.

Try rubbing her back (also lightly scratching her back)...these things help wind them down.

Before you know it, you won't have any time with her, enjoy it now.

We do the quiet time in the room. Sometimes he falls asleep, sometimes not. You can't force a child to be sleepy, but you can ask them to play/rest quietly in their room on their bed for an hour. I know it's frustrating, but if she isn't functioning without a nap and she won't fall asleep during the day, than maybe try adjusting her bedtime sleep hours. At night, we sometimes have to give our boys melatonin, which is a safe and natural supplement that helps them calm down and feel sleepy. They would be up all night long without it. Also, she needs to learn to fall asleep on her own. It may take some crying for a week, but don't lie down with her, she needs to learn to self soothe.

You think there is no way to not nap, buts it's about total sleep time. It takes a few weeks to adjust but once they start getting all their sleep at night, it's all good.

My 2 year old doesn't nap, he sleeps 12-13 hours at night, and he has quiet time for 1-2 hours every afternoon.

I know you asked for no more answers, but my suggestion is a bit different than other posters.

I can understand your predicament. My son was a kid who needed his naps...desperately. Fortunately for us, we had spurts of difficulty, but for the most part he went to bed willingly.

My daughter is the exact opposite. As soon as she could get out of her crib, naps were over. Even though she probably still needs them. Bedtime was a nightmare too. Getting that kid to stay in bed was an huge task. It drove us crazy. And similarly, it wasn't until we "lost it" that she'd stay put.

I got exhausted by the routine every night and needed it to stop. And yes, I realized my behavior was ridiculous and unproductive...I was frustrated and desperate. After trying (and failing) with a few ideas, we finally decided to take a more positive route.

I bought a toy I knew my daughter wanted..bad. I simply put it on the fridge where she could see it, but I didn't mention it. When she asked, I told her she could have it, but she would have to earn enough stickers for it. And to get stickers she had to go to bed like a big girl. We made a chart...nothing fancy, just something I made up on excel. I covered it in contact paper so we could remove stickers easily. She got a sticker (if it was earned the previous night) before bed each night. That way we could remind her about expected behavior.. The first one was a freebie. Just to get her excited about it. If she got out of bed, she lost the sticker. The first few nights we gave her three or four chances...the sticker seemed to help motivate her. The next few nights she got two or there chances. Then we went down to no chances. That first night she lost two stickers. You would have thought the world stopped turning or something, the way she reacted. We weren't harsh, just matter of fact. We simply reminded her that she could try again the next night. After a few nights of losing stickers, that's all it took to motivate her. And once that chart started filling up, she was even more motivated.

I am not usually one for bribing my children. But this worked. It took the screaming out of the equation. It made my daughter realize her choices had consequences. And those stickers were consequences SHE cared about. I was a bit concerned that one she received her toy she'd revert to old behavior, but she never did. Now we still have a rouge night here and there, but nothing like it was before.

Good luck mama!

p.s. I know you didn't ask, but work on weaning her off the naps at the start of summer before she goes to school full time. My son's preschool teacher recommended that to us. I am so glad she did, because I was planning on doing it just a few weeks before kindergarten (we go full time here). It took a while for all of us to get used to life without the nap. And kindergarten would have been an even harder transition if naps were still an issue.

hmmm, you have conditioned your child to respond only to the yelling.

It's that plain & simple.

Please watch the "1-2-3 Magic" video & learn how to regain control of your child. This video will save your relationship! Peace to you. :)

Yep - sounds almost identical to my 4 yr old son. We don't nap every day. Sure he's a monster on those days he doesn't nap, but man does it feel great when I can put him to bed an hour or two early and husband and I can watch a PG+ movie together on the couch.

But what I have found on those days that he (or I) really really need a nap - I tell him "You don't have to sleep. You just have to rest your body for 5 whole minutes. No talking, no moving, resting your eyes, resting your voice, resting your whole body for just five minutes." Well, every time he lays that still with eyes closed of course he falls asleep and stays asleep for at least an hour or two. And yes - I lay down with my son too. We read one book, then have our "rest" time where we relax our bodies and give our eyes a few minutes break..... ie, he falls asleep.

@Hazel's thought - my 4 yr old goes to bed at night all on his own. Has since he was 9 months old and I let him learn to fall asleep on his own. Naptime is just different for us. Maybe it is for L. and Roxy too. My son used to tell me "But it's not dark outside yet. It's not time to sleep!" So naptime became a "let's rest together on the bed for a few minutes" type of thing.

Don't yell. Even if she doesn't fall asleep. I think your best bet is to break this pattern. She has learned that she can wiggle and fool around until you yell. So change it. Perhaps you can bring some paperwork into the room or a book and tell her if she is quiet you will stay in the room, but if she wiggles around you will leave. Then, when she wiggles...... leave. No yelling, but she must stay in her room for say an hour. If she is a nightmare latter...... so be it. My guess is in a day or two she will want you to stay in the room and force herself to settle.

Sounds like how my daughter was at night, when she was napping in the day. We had to stay with her; after the books, prayers etc she'd still be wiggling and playing, and I can so identify with your frustration. Eventually would hold my arms around her in a loose restraint, not tight but just so she couldn't move around, for about 30 secs - she'd cry and complain and then I'd let her go and she'd fall asleep. I felt bad too but she seemed to need this to calm her down.

I hated the "still needs nap" phase -- once her naps were out of the way, bedtime became so much easier. She is quite cranky from 6 on, but by 7 we're doing the bedtime routine and she's soon asleep.

Try an earlier bedtime or instead of calling it a "nap", call it a "quiet time" in her bed.

She is allowed to look at her own books, but she must stay quiet in a darkened room in her bed during quiet time.

I used to play a book on CD or some quiet music during this time.

Sometimes our daughter fell asleep and sometimes, it was just a quiet time for her.

I just want to chime in real quick because you asked if anyone is/had been in your shoes and YES I have been/am. I have to use my not-so-nice-mommy-voice at bed time every night and I hate it. I hate having to yell at my children at a time that is supposed to be peaceful and comforting for them. Bed time is supposed to be a good time. I yell and yell and yell and they run around like hooligans and fight and push and jump and run around until I have had enough. It escalates you know? I try to tell them over and over and then after about A. hour or longer of them goofing off I am done. and I start getting more and more stern until I just yell and then yell some more then they normally get it. sucks and I am sorry this is happening to you at nap time. and I really do not have a solution for you because I put my kids down (2 and 3) at the same time every night, together, and I know this is my problem. I should not be in there with them and I probably should not put them down together but everyday I say I am going to put the little one down first then put my 3 year old down and LIFE HAPPENs! I hope it gets better for you and your little girl soon.
-Best,
C.

Maybe play a game and "freeze" each part of her or tuck her in really well so she's less able to move around. Then say it's time to sleep and leave and then if she doesn't sleep that time, then she needs to try again later in the day. I tell DD that if she isn't sleepy at that moment, she can tell herself stories or read a book or some other still, quiet activity. I think she can go to sleep, but she is going to see how much attention/snuggling she can get until you get frustrated. So cut it off before you get to that point. I know you want her to nap, but it may take a few napless days (I'd put her to bed earlier on those days) to get a new routine.

I read through most of the responses but not all. I can also relate about some of the advice not quite being what you hoped it would be or that you were disappointed with the comments from some people. I do apologize for that. I've asked several questions and I've had some GREAT responses and some that I choose to ignore because people will judge. Just don't give up on this site.

We are all different and we all do things differently.

NOW, onto your question. Several years ago I was a care provider. I took care of a baby with downs syndrome and would often watch his four year old sister and their grandmother. She had a stroke a few years before that and was unable to handle both of the kids. She could hardly handle the girl.

Well whenever it was her nap time she would fight it. Every day. You let her cry and her grandmother would tell me "It's okay L.. She doesn't need a nap." Trust me this girl needed her nap.

So when it was around that time I would go back in her bedroom with her (luckily her brother was often sleeping around this time too) and we would sing silly songs together. She really liked the bumble bee song. We would read a few books and then I would tell her "Puppy is getting sleeping" Puppy is her stuffed dog that she has had since she was born and she carries it every where with her and she sleeps with him. What I was really saying was Jena was getting sleeping. but as soon as you used the words sleep, nap, nighty night etc she would throw a fit and scream at the top of her lungs. So instead it was puppy is tired. And she would response with "Puppy isn't tired" So this went back and forth a few times.

She knew that I was there to also watch her brother and help her grandmother if she needed it, so once I knew she was starting to get sleepy I would tell her that I was going to check on her brother. And I'd leave the room but when I heard her starting to get restless I was back in there to reinforce everything. I knew better than to let her cry/scream because then her grandmother would tell me that she doesn't need a nap and all of that.

But the puppy trick worked for her. So just an idea.

I stopped the nap at 24 months. They would just SCREAM in their crib, forever. I said, no more! If they are tired they can cat nap in the carseat. I realize kids get cranky, but nap battles can be brutal. That's just what worked for us.

Well my kids still napped at that age and needed to. When they were tired, they would even actually tell me "Mommy I'm tired, I want to nap..." and they would start walking to their bed etc.
It wasn't a battle.
Sorry you are going through this.
Sometimes my kids did want me nearby.
But I would, sit in a chair by their bed, and read a magazine.
With no talking, and they would wind-down and settle in by themselves.