Two Very Different Children and Homeschooling

Check out Leaves of Learning .. www.leavesoflearning.org ... you can do full time or part time enrichment... we're pulling our kids from public schools and enrolling them at Leaves full time in the Fall. Can't wait!

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Hi S.,
I am a veteran homeschooling mom (20+years now) and everything that has been said already about learning styles is true. HOWEVER....BEFORE you go making decisions about changing curriculum or placing her in school, please consider exploring whether or not she has a physical issue that is contributing to her reluctance to work/apply herself. Everything is or can be different with every child, from personalities to learning styles to intellegence levels/etc. Perhaps a visit to the opthamologist is in order. Sometimes there can be a visual tracking issue which makes reading difficult, if not impossible. They can asses that, and then give you exercises to improve that. It can makie all the difference in the WORLD to their abilities, their motivation, and their accomplishments. Wishing you well...I would respectfully disagree that a child will learn better from an outside source, than a parent. You are your child's best teacher. If you can potty-train a child, everything else is gravy!! It may be a challenge, but you are the one person who loves that child more than anyone else in the world and will not ever give up.

BTW..loved reading your birth history. Are you a practicing midwife? I am a student midwife, doula, cbe as well as a homeschooling mom.
Blessings,
D. Easthon CD(DONA), LCCE, ELCS, CHBE
Waterbirth Credentialed
Community Outreach Director, Dayton Area Labor Support
www.heart2heartbirthmatters.com

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S.-
Have you considered a Waldorf Curriculumn? My children attend Spring Garden Waldorf School in Copley www.sgws.org. Each of my three children have a very different approach to learning and this method of teaching seems to work for all of them.

Remain positive. Your concern comes from a place of love and concern therefore you will find the best solution.

Have a great day,
L.

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Dear S.,
I just want to commend you for homeschooling your children. She might need a different approach to learning right now. Try to determine what kind of learner she is.(kinesthetic, visual, auditory etc..) I think you can probably look online and find a test to determine what your child is. I took a course but is was about 13 years ago. I'm sure there is more out there now. It does NOT mean that your child is dumb she just cannot learn the same way others do right now. Kids who start out like this can surpass others later. You might want to attend Homeschool conventions where they address some of these issues. Don't give up your child is worth it. L. J

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Hi! My sons sound very similar to your girls. My oldest was reading at 3, and incredibly bright, so I decided to look into homeschooling, and now he is 10 and is able to work at his own level. It has had it's ups and down but I think he is getting a great education with me. My 6 year old is a little delayed and hates to do school with me. At 5 I put him in a small Pre-K program 4 days a week instead of school. That was very successful for him, so I put him into the public school for K as a 6 year old this year. (He just turned 7, but there are other older kids in his class too.) It has been such a relief for both of us that we are not struggling together to homeschool. He is much more willing to work for his teacher than he is for me. He has had a very good year. Sometimes I think personalities just don't match up for homeschooling. I've seen so many times where I've tried to show him something and he just won't hear it from me, but if his teacher says the same thing, he gets it. I have found most people to be really cool about our decision to have one child at home and one in school. Most people just say that I'm a good mom for knowing what will work best for each child, and giving them the environment they need to grow. I do hope to bring my younger son into homeschooling when he gets a little older if it looks like it will work for him then. We take it year by year. Good luck!!!

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I always hated school growing up, but I was pretty smart. They held me back in k and put me in reading readiness. It really didn't make much of a difference. If you know she is smart, then don't hold her back. Just try to make it more fun. I play learning games with my kids. There are computer games that incorporate math and other literary skills. Perhaps that will help. There are also multiple online websites that incorporate learning. You can borrow learning software from the library. You can go to bookstores or Wal-Mart to find software as well. They work just like games. My boys love them. Since they are only 4 and 5, they don't quite understand it all... but it's still fun for them to play with the computer, mouse and try to answer. I help them navigate a little bit too.

Maybe if the information is coming from someone else it will help her. Sometimes kids respond better just because it's not coming from mom. Perhaps try to find a hands-on learning program, a program that focuses on math and science, something like that for her in the school system. There are multiple magnet schools, imagine schools, montessouri, and faith based schools to consider.

My kids are very active and hands on. My first son seems to only learn by seeing others or actively doing it himself. Whitney Young, Weisser Park are good elementary schools in Fort Wayne Indiana. Call Student Services for you local school system and ask them about different programs. Perhaps call the principal or go online to learn about the academics, how they teach, etc. Perhaps putting your child in school will help since she will have a social network, peers and other activities that she enjoys at school. Having those fun outlets may help her ease her mind into welcoming learning.

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Hi S., first off I will tell you we have two son's who are different from each other. OUr oldest son is very smart and our youngest son hated school from the first day of Kindergarden to a graduate from high school. When the youngest was in the 4th grade I had a conference with his teacher and did she ever put me straight!! she said your sons are two different people and you can not expect them to be the same as the other. Well! The oldest now writes composes and sings for TV and Movies. The youngest went on to school in Arizona and when I talked to him on the phone I was shocked at how intelligent he sounded. Today he has his own Custom Guitar Building business and sells guitars out of the US as well as in the US. I was told also that when the younger sees praise for the older one it makes him feel like he can not do anything right and then your youngest one now is young enough she doesn't see the difference between his/her older siblings. Hang in there and don't compare one against the other all will work out. Good luck.

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Speaking from experience and as a homeschool mom of 3 (23, 20 and 17)the thing I would NOT do is put her in school - especially if you are home schooling the other 2! My 2nd was completely different from my first (and like you, my 3rd was more like the oldest). I'm not saying there couldn't be some type of learning disability; but, it really doesn't seem like that is it from what you have shared. My 2nd sounds very similar to yours! Even writing her letters backwards! Then - it seems overnight she changed! My husband said "whatever you have been doing is making such a difference... " I responded "nothing - I've done nothing!" If anything I did the opposite and didn't make an issue of things...I didn't compare her to her siblings...didn't push anything! We just let her show us her readiness!
I think your last sentence shows your heart - you know you shouldn't put her in school :-) But, "just spend more time forcing her to do schooly stuff" isn't the answer either...I would just say spend more time with her ... especially this S.! And, I agree with what Marianne said about acknowledging her strengths! And, praising her in the areas she excels!!!
Enjoy!

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I am new to giving advice,however have you maybe considered a virtual school that involves the computer and interaction with other children her age. A friend of mine is a teacher with Connection Academy and I had the opportunity to view one of her Live Lessons. It was good stuff. I wish you the best.

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Hi S.,

I have the EXACT same problem with my children. Mine are younger versions of yours, but same issue. I worry the same way. Olivia is 6 going on 16 and emma is well, 5 going on 5. She doesn't have the attention span. She's not ADD or anything, just different and stubborn. What I have found for her is the reward system works for her. I have flash cards of sight words and we will together make a train of cards on the floor. She will start at the beginning and sound them out and work all the way around until the caboose. At the end there is a reward- for her candy or a treat is the world! She is of kindergarten age this year, but my husband and I have to remind ourselves that our oldest is mature per say in academics and we are always comparing our other 2 to her. Oops, I shouldn't do that. I am getting cought up in how am I going to teach both in a decent amount of time because they each are on such different levels. Also, things that don't seem "schoolish" like computer websites such as www.starfall.com are great ways to sneak it in. I know you and I don't want to plumpen up our kids by rewarding them candy or junk all the time, but it can be anything. Is she antsy? Have her sit on a ball while she does flash cards. Is she in lala land? Have her dress up while she reads. One clever game I liked with all 3 of my kids was the carnival games. For math I had different levels for each of the kids and they won a "ticket" in the end for each task completed and could turn them in for a small prize. They didn't even know they were learning because they were so focused on the end result. It was fun for them. We also do a lot of field trips-if you will- for hands on. They gather more than you know. Also, does she admire her older sister? At times probably- have her older sister read to her. Sometimes if it's not mommy they cooperate better. I am new at all of this, so I am up for many challenges as well. I hope any of this helps.

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Have your six-year old tested for dyslexia.

I wish I could offer some advice, but I have none to offer. Just know you are not alone. I decided to give homeschool a try with my daughter this year for her 2nd year of preschool. I wanted to see how she would do before kindergarten. I ended up very frustrated and she did also! I ended up enrolling her in a preschool for the last 2 months of this school year and she did great. She really did resist learning from me but does not at preschool. This still does not make my decision any easier because I really do not want to send her to public school! I really have to make up my mind before fall but I am looking into other options like homeschool groups, ect. I do not know if I can give up yet? I think you have to pray and follow your heart on what is best for your child. You will know the right answer. I wish you the best!

My son is very much that way. We have specific times in which we have to learn but otherwise I feel school can get to him more because it's a different location and he knows that what he has to do there. He has had some absolutely wonderful teachers that have really worked with him. He is extremely smart but just doesn't want to work at it.

It is very normal for children to be vey different. Home schooling works well for many children but,in my opinion, not all. I have friends who have found that there are some children who cannot deal with Mom being the teacher, too.I would think a traditional classroom atmoshere but would not want the child to feel like she is the "different" one. Also, we all have strengths in areas and other areas that are not as strong.I would also be careful about forcing her. Maybe you could think of ways to use her area of strength and incorporate other things that you want her to learn, maybe spelling math words, reading story problems, doing grocey shopping lists and helping with the final costs of groceries etc.

i decided to put my son in kindergarten this fall for that very reason-- i was seriously debating homeschooling (i was homeschooled from 2nd grade-high school and it was a good experience) but i think he will learn better from another person. he resists my attempts to have him read, etc, and is very bright at math, much like your daughter.
i think that a teacher will have an entirely different relationship with him than i do and there will be no struggles because he will want to please her... so i don't worry about him resisting learning in school.

why not do school for a few months or one school year, and then re-evaluate the situation? then you and she will know what environment she learns best in because she has experienced both. also, after some time in school her resistance to you might change.

there is also the whole un-schooling movement, which you may be interested in. i don't know much about it, but i think the basic idea is that kids learn through play and exploration and life, not through workbooks and sitting at a desk. sounds like something she could thrive in.

i think, though, no matter what, that you shouldn't try to force her. if you keep her home, figure out how to work with her interests, create and find games and fun ways to learn, and don't compare her to her sisters-- let her be herself. if you send her to school, pay attention to what she struggles with and help her figure it out.

i have learned that if i just back off and let him do this thing, he learns naturally. he just resists the force. he wants to learn in his own way, with his own style. he is now reading, but only when he wants to. if i just let him do it when he's in the mood and praise him and encourage it, it works better than saying "read this now!!" and expecting it on command. it's something that he's learned unconciously-- almost by accident!! because any time i sit down and try to "teach" him he doesn't want to. but he reads signs at the grocery store, cereal boxes, car logos... and now he's absorbed enough of it that he will read a few words in a book to me sometimes.

a random thought-- my friend has a son who they just found out was dyslexic and then everything made sense--why he wasn't reading or writing well, etc. his brain thinks differently. so now he has learned special dyslexic rules that help him use his brain to read and write and he is so successful and happy in school. at her age, it's still totally normal to write letters backward, i'm not suggesting that she is, but if it doesn't straighten out it could be something to check into and would explain her frustration.

I would suggest putting her in public schooling. She might be stuborn because it is you who is teaching her. Sometimes it is better that the leasons come from someone outside the home.
You could also partner up with someone else who homeschools and you teach their child while they work with yours. You could see how that goes but my opinion would be to put her in public school. You could supplement the public school with what you do at home and see if that helps her.

Many children just do better in an academic setting where the teacher isn't a parent they feel they can argue with.

I am thinking she feels inferior to her sister. It might be good to put her in the school system but they may look down on you in general. Many schools do not take too well to home schooling. I am wondering if you did the teaching with them in a different room. Also when it comes to reading a menu ask her how is she going to place her order if she's not willing to read it. Let her be the on in charge of the coupons at the grocery. Many schools now teach sight words and not phonics which I think and so do some of the teachers the wrong way. I had it out once with a teacher who told me spelling was not important anymore. I chewed her out. I said if your using a dictionary and don't know how to sound out words how can you find the correct spelling. She stated EVERYONE has a computer or typerwritter with spell check. I said I DO NOT have either and I did not at the time. My 2 boys were total opposites too. Your not suppose to compare them. That's why I was told I had problems with my youngest. Michael was like your oldest and Greg could have cared less. The grandsons are the same way. Damion is doing great never any big problems but Draven can't keep his mouth shut and was expelled so many times this year Mom is going to have him home schooled. I hope it works. Draven has anger issues and speaks out of turn allot.

It sounds like daughter #2 needs an educational evaluation. Her intelligence (she can do math IN HER HEAD) is just fine, but sloppy writing & letter reversals sound like she may be dyslexic? This is NOT a professional opinion, so please get her correctly evaluated. There may be other issues (poor memory? or an auditory issue? a lack of attention?) which may be uncovered. PLEASE get her fully tested and diagnosed before you make any further decisions!!

If she is dyslexic, she may not know it. She probably doesn't understand that other people see words as only looking one way all the time. She may see words wrods wodrs differently each time. Could you read them as the same?

If she is diagnosed, then you have a new world to discover with her. Perhaps she can do the math in her head because it is not written down. I had a dyslexic child in my student teaching who wrote 41 instead of 14 as an answer. 14 was the answer. Was 41 wrong? Or was it reversed? But if she can do it in her head (perhaps not on paper as easily), she may not be dysnumeric (I think that is the correct term).

Don't just throw her into the water in a public school without any evaluation either. She might lose a lot of time before she gets corrective assistance.

She may be just as bright as her sister, but mystified as to WHY it is all so much easier for the sister. And sneaking reading into everyday activities won't help if she is having issues and difficulties. You can't sneak that stuff, she knows you are doing it. Also, do any teaching without having anyone else around. Performing & FAILING in front of others is embarrassing. Especially if her sister is the "perfect student".

Good luck to all of you!

Hi S.!

Hi from a fellow Homeschool mom. :)

I understand your frustration. I have found out KIDS LEARN AT THEIR OWN PACE. my daughter was the same way. she isn't lazy, she just wasn't ready.

To encourage my daughter I went to www.chuckecheese.com and they have calendars that encourage reading. :) she reads 14 days and marks the days and gets 10 free tokens!

also, try this website - http://www.hebuddy.com/ she can read 10 books and when she gets them done, she will get a free t-shirt! MY daughter jumped at this one. she has read 4 books already. :) I hope this helps and please contact me if you want to chat. :)

OK. To the mom's that forbid homeschooling...
I homeschool because I can give my daughter a better education than anyone else. I don't want my daughter learning about false teaching like EVOLUTION & homosexuality. You do not need a teachers degree to teach your kids. they are YOUR kids! We get CURRICULUM JUST like teachers. and we follow that! we have support groups that have some teachers in it - if we have a question there is ALWAYS someone to ask! She is in Girl Scouts, Softball, Bowling, Bible Class, etc (too many to mention) My daughter can talk better than most adults! Most Adults love having conversations with her. She is 8.

She doesn't have to worry about being bullied, made fun of, etc. I feel that I am blessed to homeschool. It is my passion. I don't want to send my daughter to a public school with a teacher I have never met but once at parent/ teacher night. I will be her teacher. I will watch her learn. I will see if she is struggling and help her move past it. Not someone I don't know.

L. Kay

Sometimes the hardest person to learn from is your own parents. Especially if your daughter senses your frustration with her. Maybe hearing it all from a different adult will help. And if it isn't working out for her at school, you can always try and homeschool then.

A year in public school may do her a lot of good.I was great in math as well but hated reading, we later found out I had dislexia. But I over came it in time, I would have her eyes checked by a professional.

If you do decide to send her to school make sure you send her somewhere that will teach to her style. There are some schools like waldorf schools that it is more homey the way they teach. SOme Christian schools are too strict. Have you considered sending her to any S. camps? They have different camps with different topics: the outdoors/science, science-robotics, theater, music. This may be an opportunity to see how she would do in a school setting. Also realize it also could be that the two of you are not compatible. A few of my kids I could never have taught at home. Every child is different and needs different types of challenges/interests.

You may want to look into a program that the work is not coming straight from you. Like there are some good charter schools or home schooling programs like K12. www.K12.com some programs you do at home and some you do at a school a few days a week. I have been looking into to that because of the differences in my step kids that I am home-schooling. Some programs are quite pricey but some are not. Also, make sure she knows that if she goes to public school, that is about 7-8 hours away from home and if she does it at home it doesn't take near that time. Maybe weigh the costs to her and let her decide.

Hope you find a happy medium.

I'd put her in school but she sounds pretty normal to me. Maybe seeing other kids her age doing the academic stuff will help her be more receptive to it. Most 6 year olds I know would rather play than spend time doing academic stuff. As for writing letters/numbers backwards, that's pretty common even into 1st grade. If she does have some issues, then the teacher would be able to 'catch them' and suggest an evaulation (it's free through the public schools) and she'd get services she needs (by law and they are free to you).

Kids have different learning styles and people have different teaching styles. Maybe your teaching style just doesn't mesh with her learning style. Or maybe she's like most kids and will respond to 'teacher magic'... the ability most teachers (and coaches) have to get kids to things they do not want to do. Kids balk at mom or dad telling them to do stuff they don't want to do but will comply when another adult in authority tells them do it.

Some of it might be the sibling thing... she's doing every opposite of her big sister. I was like that as a kid... I did well in school and studied to 'outdo' my sister and purposely avoided everythign she was good at.

If a year in 1st grade (I'm assuming because she's already 6) in public school doesn't work out then you can always take her out and try homeschooling again.

Have you talked to your doctor about her learning style? Is it possible she has a learning disability with regards to written words? Maybe your doctor can give you other activities that you can do with her that are tailored to her style of learning.

Also, I wonder if she will be upset and feel even more distant and annoyed at her siblings because she has to go to school each morning and they are able to stay home with you every day? Just a thought.

My daughter is the way, my three sons are more like your oldest and youngest daughters. The two older boys both knew all of their letters/letter sounds, colors, shapes,etc before they started preschool, and were reading quite well when they started Kindergarten (none homeschooled) but my daughter just didn't seem to care about any of it. I would say go get your pink shoes please and she would ask which ones those were. We were getting a little concerned about her, thinking maybe she just wasn't very bright, but as soon as she started school and saw that other kids her age knew things she didn't, she caught up very quickly and is now on average with her class, academically. She is not quite where her older brothers were upon entering Kindergarten but we feel she will do fine.
My youngest son seems more like his brothers, he already knows most of his letters, shapes and colors at 2 1/2.
I think some kids just need to have that exposure to school in a more formal environment, even if only temporary, in order to understand the reality and importance of it. In other words, maybe seeing that you trying teach her was not you being a mean crazy mother but you being a teacher would give your daughter new perspective and perhaps even a little more respect.
I don't know if this helps any, but thought I would let you know how different my daughter was from my sons, in the learning style department.
good luck
~J.

I would probably try the 6 year old in school but only IF you could be sure that she would have a conscientious teacher who would insist on her participation etc......AND if she does NOT comply with expectations regarding behavior and/or completing work etc, I would make it clear to her that at the end of the semester/year she would return to your home classroom.
She might do well in a different environment, but you would just have to see......

Dear S. W,

I would agree with others who have suggested getting an educational evaluation ASAP. I would also suggest that you read a book called Upside-Down Brilliance by Dr. Linda K. Silverman. You can also google the term Visual-Spatial Learner and gifted-development for more information as well as practical teaching tips for a visual or kinesthetic learner. Also google www.dyslexia.com for a handout called 37 Characteristics and it aquaints you with traits of dyslexia. An easy read is The Everything Parents Guide To Dyslexia by Abigail Marshall. Good Luck!

First and foremost, she won't really have a CHOICE when it comes to "not reading right now". If they are reading or doing math as a class.....she doesn't have a choice. It's STRUCTURE. Sounds like she needs that.

Might be best to be around other kids her age so she doesn't feel like she's being compared to an older or younger sibling and not measuring up. Being around kids/friends her age many times helps motivate them. IF she has an excellent teacher and teaches them to help each other and how to be good friends, she may find help and enjoy that from someone other than a family member. In this type of environment, they are encourage to help other classmates and work together.

Lastly, I've done screening for schools. Bottom line, doesn't matter if a kid can do all states, capitals and all presidents from 1st to current at 3 if they have NO social skills. I've held kids back because they were too immature to handle the classroom setting regarless of where they were academically. They need to be mature enough to HANDLE things at their age and handle being around other kids. TRUST ME......a child who can't handle this is WWAAY more of a problem than one who needs help with math.

I completely think that you are going to make things worse for her by NOT sending her to school. Homeschooling is a concept I do understand the reasons behind, however, I think it should require a teaching degree, and I think the reasons are more selfish and sheltering for the parents, rather than what's truly right for the child. Even with a teaching degree, I know my own kids wouldn't be as focused with me as they are at school. Being in a school is just different. There's kids around you that create a sort of encouragement and competition to get good grades. A teacher creates a sense of pride in the classroom that kids strive for. I just think that in a lot of cases, homeschooling is more detrimental than it is beneficial. Plus the social skills that come along with being around kids of your own age and learning to deal with daily trials is priceless and essential for building children's character. My 6 year old will say something like "today I heard from ..... that Bradley fell while doing a front flip and broke his arm" This actually is exactly what she told me yesterday in the car on the way home from school. What a great opportunity for me to explain the detriments to gossiping and half truths! I explained to her that she said something her friend said, who said something HER friend said, who MAY have been telling something HER friend said, and how since it was passed along so MANY different times, the chances of the story being accurate were very slim. She said to me "Yeah, I guess the only way I will REALLY know what happened is if Bradley comes to school with a cast on his arm" I explained to her that even if he does, it doesn't mean all of that story was true. She followed up by saying, "yeah, who knows, maybe he fell off the monkey bars!" Now, THOSE lessons are JUST as important as the academic ones she learns at school. School is not just about academics. It's about learning to respect authority, being able to focus when told, being on a schedule, and second most important (next to adademics), how to deal with life. So, I say send her to school, let her be a kid and go through all the trials and tribulations we went through and grew from when we were kids. Can you imagine not going through all the things you went through in school? You wouldn't have learned most of the things in life that molded you into who you are today!

ALSO....."forbid homeschooling"??? Let's not be typical women here by putting words in my mouth. I never said such thing, as a matter of fact, I said I understood the reasons behind homeschooling. I do think that there are a lot of lessons that prepare kids for life experiences that homeschooled kids miss out on, but to "forbid" it? Come on...it's up to the mother on whether or not to homeschool, and she was asking for advice. It's always good to hear different angles and that's what I try to provide.

Hi there:) First off, kudos to you for caring so much about your kids' education!! Well, I have three boys and the situation is the same! I opted to send them to school because I know that I am not organized enough to teach them what they need. But, I was very worried sending my middle son. He refused to do anything academic from about the time we could start learning the alphabet. (I used to teach preschool and thought I'd give my kids a GREAT head start!) I was deeply disappointed and frustrated when my middle son refused everything (including the alphabet!) He was also jealous of my oldest and his academic abilities. So, I would sneak in what I could and hope for the best. Anywho, my point is, he has been in kindergarten for the year and where I couldn't get him interested in letters, reading, or writing, his teachers have! He is a tad behind in my opinion(but the I compare him to my eldest all the time.) But, he has now started asking me to tell him how to spell words, or to write them so he can copy them to make sentences and notes to people. I was sooo excited I almost jumped for joy! He may be a little behind, but what he wouldn't do for me, he has willingly done in school. I don't know what makes it different, but I'm so glad! Each kid is different and sometimes we just need to let someone else give it a try....kids know how to push our buttons and sometimes I think his refusal was because I wanted him to learn so bad....but school was different...other kids had to learn the same things at the same rate and he wasn't the only kid (as in our house) who didn't know how to do things yet. So, you may want to try sending her.....not as a cop- out, but because that may just be what your daughter needs. It's hard to give in on something you want so bad, but if it makes her flourish, then you really have won the battle! And, she may be more open to extra teaching with you more often:) My Alex lets me do more with him than ever, even though he still doesn't like to do too much. But I'm thankful for the little bit of leeway I have now:) Good luck!