I'm actually asking this for my sister who has been divorced now for 4 years. In their divorce decree it was stated that they would follow the standard visitation guidelines for child custody. I'm not sure what custody she has but I know that she has the children full time but he has the right to know about medical and school.
So my question is this, does he get them on his birthday? Like I've said before they have been divorced for 4 years and this is the first year that he has come to her and said that he gets them on his b'day. He said that his lawyer told him that was part of the guidelines. We have looked at her copy and cannot find anywhere that it specifies about a parents b'day. We can see where it talks about the children's b 'days but not parents. Also, is there an updated version of the Standard Visitation Guidelines and if so when was it updated? I've tried to look it up online but I'm not sure if I'm getting the most recent version. If you know of a site please let me know.
Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thank you!
Thank you everyone for all the advice. I agree with those of you that feel the children should come first. Unfortunately in my sisters case both she and her ex tend to forget that. I was merely asking the question to find out what the guidelines stated and to get an updated copy. Thanks again.
I have been divorced for 6 years and my papers state that the parties should give special consideration to make the children available to attend family functions significant in the life of the children or in the life of either parent which may inadvertantly conflict with the visitation schedule. When it comes to a significant thing like that it would definately be better for the children to be able to enjoy the celebration.
In my custody agreement, it clearly states that each of us is to have our son on our respective birthdays. We live far enough apart that it is not always possible, but I do believe that it is part of the "standard" language.
I agree with what other people have already said. It's important for kids to have a relationship with both parents and the less fighting and legal wrangling, the better.
My advice to you is to stay out of your sisters business and not add fuel to any fire that might be between her and her ex husband. Let them work it out like adults.
Best of Luck,
Revised Answer:
Is this guy flat out evil or something? I mean, is he some sort of perverted murderer, child molester, drug dealer, illegal guns dealer...Is this guy a hardened criminal???
Honestly, what in heavens name is wrong with a guy wanting his children for his birthday??? It really just does NOT matter if he asked for them before, he's asking now. This is the children's FATHER for goodness sake.
Just because you CAN make things difficult and nonsupportive of the child/father relationship and just becuase a Mom wants to have complete control of her children as if it's a source of power and the children are her sole "property", does NOT mean she is justified.
Unless this guy intentionally put the children in harms way, unless he's proven to literally neglect the children in his care, there is absolutely NO reason he should not be allowed to share his birthday with his children. I'm sure your sister does. And as I orginally posted, the guideline is the MINIMUM visitation, it was put in place for the petty, ridiculous, immature folks who choose to continue their irrational disputes with each other onto their children. (Though I realize it's really easy to be that person, I, myself, have this little song and dance with my exhusband who desires as little time as possible with our children and this "minimum" thing is MORE than he takes advantage of.)
So, my vote is, unless she has a legitimate fear that her children are going to be harmed, neglected, or hidden away, OR the children are afraid of him because of his own actions, she has no real reason to keep them away from their father. In my estimation, the more she can do to foster a good relationship with them, the better a mommy she is.
*********************************************************
I've given you links to read how the Utah Courts have it written. This is by no means ALL the visitation possible. This simply means that if the two parties cannot agree, this is the minimum the custodial party MUST ALLOW the noncustodial...which also doesn't mean this is the full amount the noncustodial will put to use. You'll see here that birthdays and holidays are alternated each year.
OVER:
http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE30/htm/30_03_003500.htm
UNDER 5:
http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE30/htm/30_03_003505.htm
Here is the law http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE30/30_03.htm
Hello well the way it works for us is the ex gets his birthday usually from a.m. to p.m. unless they do overnights. The mom of course would get her birthday the same schedule. Holidays and such override the regular schedule. Most people alternate holidays. So one year she would have Christmas Eve then he would have christmas day and the next year you switch. I think they are allowed one week vacation is standard. I dont know where to find the guidelines they might be on your states, county web site under self help tools. The important thing to remember is this is about the kids and what they would want and what is best for them. I know it is hard when you have a ex that didn't take interest and then he does. But as long as he is not hurting them I can bet they would want to see their dad on his birthday. I can speak from experience. I have been divorced for 10 years my daughter will be 11 in August and the sooner you can get along the better. Tell your sister good luck
I've never heard of a custody agreement that includes the parents birthdays. But if hes a good father to the children I can't see what the problem is. I presume they are both in the same area and he has regular contact.
A very close friend of mine has been in a custody/access battle for the past three years. Both parents are being extremely difficult and childish. They both love their children dearly but seem more interested in scoring points off each other than what effect it is having on the kids. I have had the oldest daughter (12) in tears on my couch because she can't stand the constant bickering between her parents. Gently advise your sister to use some commonsense in her decision.
J.,
I don't know what is legal, but I know what feels right to me. If a father feels that the best birthday present he can receive is being with his children... your sister should count her blessings. In a world were more and more fathers are disconnecting with children after divorce, this is truly a wonderful birthday wish. My wish is that parents would stop looking at their "legal rights" and focus on what is best for the children.
With my whole heart, C.
Owner of Loving Connections LLC
What is Loving Connection? Caring enough to share your whole heart!
What your sister has is an agreement that was set up and it she that is the primary parent and her ex is the secondary, does he see the boy at all? I have the same with my ex as he lives out of state but I am the primary parent and we figured out the visitation ourselves.
My first question is, is it a big deal he goes with his dad on a birthday? Are you talking the boys or the fathers bday? I think when things get petty like with visitation that is when the kids get hurt the most. Be grateful he wants to see his son!! Why is it a problem if he does?
There is never usually "standard" guidelines and if so these smaller things are probably in hopes they would work it out. Most courts figure if it is a regular visitation schedule and will write that in. If there is not one, then both parents should really get it written up if it is a problem like now.
Bottom line, ask your sister if it is a big deal. Does she trust her ex with their son? I think any child would benefit from time with their dad and maybe it is something that isn't a big deal. Children shouldn't be caught in the middle of power struggles between grown ups.
I have a friend I work with and we checked the visitation and it does not say anything about a child on the parents birthday. It was last revised Dec 12th 2008. Hope this helps.
Well, the visitations guidelines are just that.....guidelines. What the Judge meant when he said your sister could follow them was for her & her Ex to get together and work something out, based on what the guidelines consider fair and equal. My guess is that after 4 years she's a little miffed that he simply informed her that he would be taking the kids on his B'day, instead of asking. His lawyer is partially correct though. He can/should have them on his B'day, but he should request it of her.
The question is really this....In the 4 yrs since the divorce, has he had his weekend/holiday/summer visitations..has he asked for them at all?? If not, then she could rightfully claim abandonment, and not let him see the kids at all.
You don't put a lot of detail into what has happened over the last 4 yrs, so it's really hard to say what rights she would have. But, it would be in her best interest to sit down with the Ex & lawyers, and come to an agreement on a visitation schedule, and file it with the respective lawyers. That way if one of the parents defaults, there is proof of an agreement.
Either way, concerning the immediate issue, she still should contact her lawyer, and see what he/she has to say.
Good luck to her, and kudos to you for standing by her and being there as a separate sounding board
http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE30/htm/30_03_003500.htm
These are the MINIMUM guidelines for the state of Utah for children aged 5-18 - remember the guidelines are different for every state. But I actually agree with everyone else - of course I would agree the children should spend each parents' b-day with that parent, even though that is not in the guidelines. Wouldn't your sister want to have the kids with her, even if that day would fall on a day assigned to their dad?
Get rid of the lawyers and start acting like grown ups. The best thing for the kids is that the parents are mature and make decicions in the best interest of the kids. Let the poor guy see the kids on his birthday, he doesn't need some lawer who by the way charges huge amounts of money for just the most minute thing's from e-mails to one minute calls( you could nicely fund the kids college funds, medical savings accounts and so on with the crazy amounts of cash they get). Lawers are so advesarial, it just really bugs me when people use them in custody issues, this is a family relationship, not crime. Just let it go and try to trust each other to make decisions for the best interest of the kids, all the time! The kids will model this behavior, so if that's the life they want for their kids then that' what they are demonstrating.
J.,
I don't understand the trouble with a father spending his birthday with his children. It sounds to me as if the parents are using the children as a way to hurt each other. They need to understand that this is about their children and not them. Sorry to be harsh, but I don't think divorce is an excuse to use children as a pawn for paybacks. The fact that he has never asked before is not relavant. What is relavant is that he now understands the importance of special days with his children and everyone should be thankful.
