My daughter is almost 4 years old. She has basically slept through the night since she was born. Lately, she gets up 10000 times before actually staying in bed for the night. We put her in bed at 8:30 everynight after a 7pm bath and some time just playing a game and wrestling with Daddy. She has every excuse under the sun to get out of bed; her pillow is not right, her head itches, she is thirsty, hungry, has an upset tummy, has to pee, has to poop, you name it we have heard it. We have tried getting mad but that just makes her upset and wanting the other parent to come help her, which if we say no, she throws a hissy fit and starts screaming which wakes up her 10 month old brother. He goes to bed at 8pm so that we have a little time with her to play a game. She eats normally, doesn't have anything unusual, all bodily functions work good, so there is no problem there. I just really don't know what else to do about it. We are dreading night time because putting her to bed has become an hour long battle and sometimes even longer than that. Extra info: we had a baby boy 10 months ago, there really haven't been any jealousy issues there. I am 28 years old and my husband is 31 years old. We both work full time and there have been no schedule changes for the whole school year. Thanks for your help!
Thank you all so much!! The wrestling before bed just kind of happened one night and she loved it so they just kept it up! I have talked to my husband about it and he agreed that it should be done before her bath and not after. I am stopping by to grab some Lavendar essential oil today on my break from work and I have epson salt at home because both my kids have ezcema! I also loved the idea of a pass or 2, I am going to make those tonight! Thank you much for all your advice!! I can't wait to try to get this problem solved, she got up 5 times last night, including once at 2:30am and decided she was going to sleep in our bed, which has never been allowed! Thank you all again!
Melatonin....it can be given as young as 2 years!!!
You can buy it at any health food store or the Vitamin shoppe... 1 to 3 mgs is fine!!! I give it 45 mins. before bed time!!! Or go to the Homeopathic isle in Vitamin Shoppe they have calming drops that you can give in juice too!!Love, G.. :0)
P.S. Oh and Epson salt in the bath tub relaxes the muscles and prepares them for bed!!!1/2 cup per bath!!!
You need to stop entertaining her complaints-- ask her if she needs to pee/poo/have a drink/have a snack before you put her down, then do *not* entertain her excuses. If you must, sit in a chair in front of her door, and when she pops her head out, without a word, pick her up and put her back in bed. If she screams and wakes the baby, so be it-- she'll only do it for a night or two, then everyone can go back to having nice, pleasant evenings.
Good luck!
Do you ever watch supernanny? This is one of the common issues she deals with. She suggests creating the routine in the evening that would encompass all things that she might ask for. Also, add in the 20 minute warning... "__________, your bed time is in 20 minutes. You need to start cleaning up, go to the bathroom and brush your teeth. (Whatever you need her to do before bed.)
Then when she gets in to bed, read to her, tell her goodnight and turn out the light and leave the room. When she gets up to do whatever, you simply say it's bed time __________ (whatever her name is) and take her back to bed. The next time (and each subsequent time) you simply walk her back to bed. DO NOT TALK TO HER IN THE PROCESS! It may take time to get her to understand and the hissy fits may continue, but eventually she gives up. Do not smile, do not laugh, but don't get angry either.
This seems to be a stage that 4 year olds go through. My 4 year old has also recently started doing this, even though her 1 year old sister goes to sleep 90 minutes before she does and she gets full focus attention for that time.
Getting up a lot is to get attention, in one respect. But it is also the fact that they are going through some pretty intense psychological changes right now, and is uncertain about the changes. She needs that extra bit of reassurance, but she also needs rules and boundries. Try to find additional ways to help her feel comfortable at night.
A few things that help my daughter are:
1. After we snuggle up and read a book, we talk about what she did that day - starting with breakfast ("you woke up, ate eggs and toast for breakfast, then went to preschool, tell me what you did at preschool, then we came home, ate lunch, looked for lady bugs in the back yard, played with trains and puzzles, cooked dinner together, played with daddy, took a bath, brushed teeth, read a book, talked about what we did today, then went to sleep.")
More than just playing, you are focusing on her and having a conversation with her about what she did and treating it with as much importance as another adult (oooooo). The "then went to sleep" part is also a bit of a subconscious 'nudge' in the right direction too.
2. Snuggle her down in bed, then say "Let's think of five fun things you can dream about." This sets a positive tone for bed and makes her happy just to think about these things, plus you are again giving that subconscious 'nudge' when you talk about dreaming.
3. Snuggle her down in bed, then kiss all ten fingers and each palm. Tell her she can hold on to all those kisses for the night, and that she can have more kisses when she wakes up in the morning. (More nudging.)
If she isn't napping anymore, you may try to move everyone's bedtime a half hour earlier. Sometimes when my 4 year old is over tired he takes much longer to go to sleep. I agree with all the no-wrestling-after-bath comments. I think that's a daddy thing because my husband always wants to goof around with the kids, too. We have had many an argument about it!!
Jennifer S's advice is right on target.
She has figured out that she will get attention each and every time she gets up. Once you turn that off.. there is no point in getting up. Keep walking her back to bed without talking, no matter how many times she gets up! And above all, remember, this too shall pass.
You have your hands full. I was told after a bath you need to keep the mood calming which helps them relaxed not get them wound up again by rough housing. My son is a super active 2.5yo and I let him know after his bath we are getting ready for bed so he knows its time to unwind and he can get the idea that its quiet time in a few minutes. I tell him what is going to happnen. Ok bath time, then we get on our PJ's, then read a book and bed. I will give him a warning after I have tucked him in and kissed him good night, that if he gets out of bed the gate will go up and he lays down saying no gate. I reinforce what will happen if he gets up. 90% of the time the gate doesn't have to go up because he knows what will take place if he gets out of bed. If the gate does go up, I say its night night time I love you and he usually goes right to sleep in mins. He knows he can't win this battle. Once he is fast asleep i take the gate done. Supernanny has a great method which I tried a while back but being pregnant I didn't have the energy to keep putting him back in bed over and over for hours on end in a 2 story house and I m doing this mostly on my own since my husband travels every week for businss. Good Luck!
SAHM, 39 with a super busy 2.5yo son and expecting baby #2 soon.
Dear M.,
Jennifer and Noel have it together! The wrestling with Daddy should not take place before bedtime or bath time. That would be better when Daddy gets home. I really like the timer theory and reinforcing it by sending your child back to bed with no fuss, no anger, and no talk.
I think it's really important to tuck your children in with love, affection, reassurance and prayers. "God with your Angels, please bless and watch over my precious children while they sleep." Or what ever blessing you feel appropriate for your family, then ask her to use her own thoughts for night time prayer.
After bedtime prayers (long ago), my Mom use to say, “Good night, sleep tight and don’t let the bedbugs bite.” I don’t recall having any trauma over thinking I was going to be consumed by bugs…..maybe that was because of the FOUR ANGELS AND MY HEAD AND FIVE ANGELS AT MY FEET. If you remember that one, I know how old your are!!
Hi M.,
My sister went throught this with her older daughter when she was five when her little sister was ten months. Someone suggested to my sister that they put three peices of colored paper on her daughters bedroom wall to represent her daughters three chances to get up. Each time she got up my sister would take down a sheet. The rule was that when all the papers were gone she was not allowed to get out of bed again.
My sister would explain to her before bedtime that things would be taken away the next day if she did not stay in her bed. Such as her favorite toy, TV time, a playdagte with a friend etc... She was also to explain to her daughter why she needs to sleep and that it is healthy for her body and makes her feel happy.
According to the friend who is a child development specialist four year olds need tagible objects like the papers to understand perameters, like a game. Also, answering the WHY DO I HAVE TO GO TO BED? question helps them figure out why there is a bedtime in the first place.
I hope this helps you, my sister did it and after a few days of understanding losing somthing fun the next day is she got out of bed my neice got the hint. The only thing my sister did deal with was that one night my neice was scared and then was afraid to get up and come to get comfort from ym sister. You might want to add to you daughter that if she has a bad dream she can always get up to see Mommy or call for mommy just to cover that base.
I hope this helps and sweet dreams,
N. :)
Hang on, let me get this straight...you give a nice relaxing bath, then you play a game or wrestle. It sounds so contradictory. I think the game and wrestle time is part of your problem. You should do the game or wrestle time before the bath so the child has a time to settle downand get sleepy.
Our oldest was the same way. She would refuse to stay in bed and wanted someone to stay with her until she fell asleep. And it always took her a long time (over an hour) to fall asleep.
We found that my daughter had an easier time staying in bed if she listened to music or books on tape. She also likes to listen to "Five Funny Critters", a CD of bedtime stories for children made by The Hypnosis Network. It says it was developed for children 5-7, but my daughter still likes to listen to it even now (at 10 yo).
It got a lot easier once she was old enough to read chapter books by herself. But that wasn't until she was 7 or 8...
First off, as everyone else has said, eliminate the wrestling with daddy and game playing before bed. "Hyping" her back up after a relaxing bath isn't going to be conducive to sleep.
Here's what I did with all 3 of mine and it worked really well with 2 of them LOL (the youngest has adhd with anxiety so he's a different issue completely.)
We did the whole bath/jammies/teeth/drink/etc routine. Then when they were in bed I always told them "if you're not sleepy you don't have to go to sleep right now, BUT you have to stay in bed and be quiet and make me think you're asleep. You can read quietly if you want, but if you get up or make noise and I think you're awake, we won't go to the playground tomorrow." (Or other activity they really wanted or we had talked about doing the next day).
They loved the idea of "tricking" mom, plus they felt some control of their own sleep and body. And 99.999% of the time they were asleep in less then 30 minutes.
They are now 15, 13 & 10 and still love to read before bed. Heck they just love to read.
Hope this helps.
The one thing from your post that I noticed is that she is wrestling with daddy, which is not a quiet getting ready to go to bed activity. This type of play so close to bed time gets her riled up and adrenaline pumping, which can take a good hour to wind down afterwards.
I would suggest wrestling matches with little brother as an audience around 7 pm (both will have ample time to wind down before bed). Then do bath, story time, brushing and a drink of water, snuggles, potty, etc. Basically take care of any of those requests she is making so she has no excuses to get up or call for you. Give her a "five minute warning" before bed and let her know that this is when she needs make final requests or trips to the bathroom. Tell her that you will not honor any requests once she is in bed.
Also, talk to her about the things daddy does just with little brother, the things daddy does just with her...wrestling. Then let her know that you need "alone" time with daddy to talk and snuggle. She may think you are having "fun" without her, so let her know about the "boring" stuff you do when she goes to bed. :D
Be firm and don't let her up out of bed unless you think there is really a problem. Good luck!
Hi M.,
I HIGHLY recommend reading "Healthy Sleep Habits, Happy Child" by Dr. Marc Weissbluth to understand biological sleep rhythms. I suggest putting both of your children to bed earlier. It sounds like you daughter is overtired. As to your bedtime routine, try having her play with Dad BEFORE her bath, then keep EVERYTHING calm and quiet after bath until bedtime. Playing and wrestling can overexcite her making it hard to calm down. We give our daughter a bath, read two books, go potty, and then cuddle in the darken bedroom listening to music. Once she is in bed, she is there to stay. Your daughter is looking for a reaction/attention and getting mad doesn't work as you found out. I would sit her down before bed and tell her you won't be coming back in until morning and she isn't to get out of bed. There will be NO curtain calls, ect. If she gets up, take her back to bed SILENTLY. Once she realizes she will get no more attention, it should stop. The keys are consistency and staying calm. My daughter is almost 3 and is asleep by 7pm at the latest and sleeps 11-12 hours each night. It takes her no more than 15 mins to fall asleep too. I credit ALL of her sleep success to Dr. Weissbluth's book. He is one of the most experienced pediatricians (in my humble opinion) in sleep and sleep disorders. Email me if you are interested in more info.
Sincerely,
L.
I agree with the other moms. And here's one more thing that has worked with my daughter. After you have tucked her in and you know that she's gone potty, has her sippy cup of water, whatever else she might need, tell her you're setting the timer for 20 (or 30) minutes. Tell her if she needs anything else, you will be back to check on her when the timer rings and can help her with it then, but she is not to get out of bed--she must wait for you to come back. 9 times out of 10 my daughter would be asleep before the timer rang. If she got up to come see me before it rang, I just reminded her that the timer didn't ring yet and took/sent her back, no other discussion. I don't even have to set the timer anymore--I just tell her I'll be back to check on her later, and she stays in bed waiting long enough to fall asleep.
First of all I agree with the others, wrestling and playing before bed is not a good idea. Do you have a bedtime routine? Bath, read a book/snuggle time, pray, kiss goodnight. Another thing that may help I read in a magazine about a possible solution for this. You give your child 3-4 (more or less if you choose obviously) "out of bed passes" and she uses them to get a drink, go potty, etc and you take one away when she gets up or you have to go in there, once she uses them all that's it, no more getting up or calling on you, come up with a consequence if she bothers you after the last "pass" is used.
M., I hate to break it to you, but this is totally normal. You are way fortunate that you have had rest up to this point. What I have done in the past is given my son a banana before we brush and a small drink of water, have him sit on the toilet and that takes a few of their excuses away. Also she may just want some attention and sweet alone time. I feel like it is perfectly OK to lay down next to your child or sit on the side of their bed to help them fall asleep. Most of us adults go to sleep with someone next to us. Also, she is at the age where she will be adventuring out more without mom and dad and she may just need you a little more than befor. Best of luck.
M.,
We are going though almost the exact same thing. My daughter will be 4 in September and her baby sister is 8 months old. She just recently started getting up at bedtime, which she has never done before. I do think it has to do with her baby sister. She adores her, and until recently we've had no jealousy issues. I'm noticing it's harder for her now that her sister is more mobile and interactive, and gets more of the type of attention she gets, rather than just care. I don't have any answers for you... hopefully some of the Moms who have gone before will help us both out - just wanted to let you know that there is someone else out there.
Right now we are just trying to be firm and loving. I'm trying very hard to give my older daughter extra one on one attention with the help of babysitters for our baby, but also continue to enforce the rules firmly. She seems to do better that way. I have definitely found that getting her to bed even a little late makes things much worse.
I've also had some luck discussing her jealousy with her and explaining to her that she can ask Mommy to spend more time with her rather than act out.
(And here come the little feet at 10:20 PM... it's been 2 hours since we settled her in bed).
Good Luck!
A.
Couple of things you can try. Push her bedtime back a little bit, an extra 1/2 hour of being up may just be the difference between getting to bed and staying in there and what you have been going through. Also, after her bath try quiet games and quiet time. Rough housing and active games stimulate her and will make it hard for her to calm down. The idea is to get her to relax and calm down so when you put her in bed she is ready to lay there. Good luck.
Sounds like an episode of Super Nanny....just watch one show and you might get lots of ideas....basically sounds like all of the advice you are getting! Hang in there....
Hi, I have a 7 year old and a 3 year old. In my experience, she's wanting security. Maybe getting a special stuffed animal and acting out a little with the animal before bed will encourage that she is not alone. Also, I know warm lavender baths help and of course a very active day. Reading, running around, and keeping busy should also help. Good luck, I know sleep is important for all of us.
PS I work full-time but my kids understand that when we are together, it is precious time. We love our "sacred" time together.
Only thing I'd add here is that you say she's had no schedule changes this school year.
Maybe it's time for one.
Does she still get any kind of nap?
Maybe she doesn't need it any more.
You don't mention when she gets up in the morning.
With all this up and about at night, is she hard to waken?
In any case, maybe it needs to be earlier, if she isn't sleepy by 9:30.
Even if she doesn't have any overt jealousy issues about the baby, it's amazing what those little siblings can trigger! I'm exhausted just listening to what you guys are going through, and it was all too long ago for me so newer moms can advise you. I think Jennifer S. and Supernanny's ideas are good.
