Seeking Help with Clingy and Emotional 4 Year Old

I would give my right arm to have my daughter seek me out to play. She's autistic and 90 percent of the time doesn't give a rat's butt if I am here or not.

Unless, of course, she wants a pudding cup or a piece of paper to sit and wave back and forth. Even then, she won't call me "mommy" and seldom makes eye contact. I'm working on not giving in to her unless she makes some attempt to acknowledge me as someone to relate to, and not just a vending machine or an art supply dispenser. It's progressing slowly but steadily.

I'm not saying "my pain can beat up your pain." It might be helpful to count your blessings that the behavior modification could be a tougher road to hoe. Good luck.

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I agree with Nik T and Donna W on this one. My son is 5 and he is very similar in the crying part and needing attention when he is bored. If he isn't bored, he is fine and doesn't need my attention so much. But, he gets bored kind of easily. I know this is hard, but you need to start letting her cry more. With my son, in the car I just tell him I cannot help him right now because I am driving. I then explain to him that I don't want to get in an accident because everyone will get hurt. Then, if he chooses to cry, then he cries. I try to not let it get to me, but it does. Then, I find, when we do get somewhere, I am frustrated and short tempered. I try to remind myself to not be this way. I have read the Spirited Child book and thought it was ok. My child is more sensitive than anything, so I am planning on renting some books on the sensitive child from the library. The thing is that I know he is sensitive and that is just his personality. I don't want to change that, I just want to toughen him up a little bit. One thing I found that helps is me setting some time aside every week where my son and I get some one on one time. I also try to save my "chores" until after the kids go to bed so I am spending more time with the kids. My son seems to really nag me when I am spending a lot of time doing chores and not sitting and playing with him and his younger brother. I also have started a reward chart if my son doesn't cry for certain reasons. He cries all the time it seems, over every little thing. I don't understand why, but I have tried to reward him for not crying when he doesn't get his way while we are in public (things he needs to not do when he enters school). I am also trying to be very consistent with disciplining him if I feel he is crying for a very inappopriate reason. If he is crying because I am tying his brothers shoes and not his (he's a big boy who ties his own shoes now), then I time out him. I don't do it if he is crying for a good or somewhat good reason, but you know, the really ridiculous ones. I also make sure I praise him often and tell him often that I love him. I give him tons of hugs and kisses throughout the day. He gets very jealous when I spend time with my younger son, but it is important that he learns that he is not the center of attention all the time. So, I am trying to reward him and praise him a lot and that is helping with him not being so sensitive. I don't know if this is an option, but do you have a friend of your daughter's you can invite over more often for them to play. The mom can come also, of course, and that will help you as well. Make sure you keep her in activities as well. The park districts have many options for their age. Don't overschedule, but give her a class or two where she goes by herself. That is important for her to be without you for part of the week. Then, the most important thing, is for you to do all you can to get your own me time. When your hubby gets home from work, tell him he has the kids for an hour. Then, you get away, either go shopping or go take a shower or something where you are away from the kids and can't hear them. This will help you tremendously to not be so irritated every time she "acts up". Go to a lot of MNO's. If you aren't already part of a mom's group, join one. There are many benefits for your kids and yourself. You need to do more for you so you are more patient when the kids are around. Good luck, and hugs!

get and read "How to Raise Your Spirited Child" by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka. seriously, this saved my life with my highly sensitive daughter - which is what it sounds like your daughter is!
you might also try asking her to think more for herself - so instead of saying no in the car when she says she's hungry/thirsty/needs a kleenex, ask her how she can get those things. or have her pack a little travel bag that stays by the door. she is certainly old enough to take responsibility for her needs in those categories, and it will probably make her feel better all around.

S.:
I am a former SAHM and what I use to do is provide my son who was a where are you now child, with a toy of some sort that would occupy his time. Try to chose an age appropriate toy or learning object that will both stimulate and occupy without your assistance. Try to get something that offers several levels of learning possibilities. You may find, your child is bored and needs something to keep her occupied as you go about your day. If there is a Pre-school store in your area, I would suggest taking a trip to that store, with your daughter and get something that is going to make her think, make decisions and stimulate her without your assistance. The more she learns these activities on her own, the less she will want you in her space. Hurray and you get your time back.

S.,

Wow, you got a lot of responses, seems there are lots of clingy, crying 4 yr olds around -- I know I have one too!!!

I have to challenge the idea that she does it more with you than with Dad due to your putting up with it. I believe there might be another reason - not sure what, but there is probably something she thinks that she needs that she's not getting from you and she just cannot articulate it (of course that does not mean you are doing anything wrong).

I often sense from my 4 yr old daughter that she wants to still be the baby when she acts clingy - so I indulge her. I will hold her like a baby, talk baby-talk until she just starts laughing because it is so silly. For some reason this will snap her out of the crying and clinging and she will then just naturally drift off and play independently after I just smother her sickeningly with attention. ;-) I'm probably not doing something right, but it works for me.

Getting her to do things 'with' you is also a great idea - and this often works well for us too, especially with cooking.

We make deals, like 'if you let Mommy just finish the laundry, then we can sit together and do your stickers for 20 minutes.

But that being said, it's just her and me at home all day right now too and there are some days when I honestly cannot get hardly a single thing done because she insists that I 'play' with her all day long or it is just constant 'my nose hurts, I have a boo-boo, I think I am going to throw up, I am thirsty, I am hungry...', well- you know. (I can't imagine going thru it with a 17 month old there too), so I hope you will give yourself a pat on the back and try to get her to laugh when you can.

cheers,

W.

I'm wondering if something internal is going on. Does she have any health issues, possible allergies. Does it seem worse sometimes than others. We had some behavior issues and it ended up being connected with nutrition and food allergies. Not that this is a cure, because after dealing with this behavior for so long it turns into an environmental situation with acts that have to change within the family. I represent a nutritional product that has changed our lives. It is called Reliv. You can check them out on the net. Let me know if you have any questions, ____@____.com luck, G. Chambers

It may start with baby steps at home - she will cry and be upset, but you have to let her work it out. Make it so that she has to occasionally play on her own. Explain to her what you will be doing, you will be close by and give her the toys and such and let her go. She will start to build the trust that you are there even if you are not directly playing with her. With my daughter, I would work in the kitchen, place her at the table with some crafts and she would either do them or not. If she fussed about me being right there, I explained, I am here, talk to me while you work and mommy will work too. When you are taking care of the baby, have her take care of her baby at the same time. As far as the doorknobs, I think you may want to buy the attachments that go on the doors that you have to squeeze to get then open to avoid little ones opening those doors. It is a phase, but you can not continue to play into her. Just keep reassuring her and lovong her and she will start to separate. She needs to understand that people the leave, I.e. Her brother, they do return. You will return when you go to do something, she will learn. You will exhaist yourself if you keep playing into her. Okay to let her cry and find her way. Hard to do, but they are fine.

Hi S., I am a SAHM and I also have a 4 year old daughter, and one thing is for sure, she is more emotional than her older brother. I also have 10 month old twins, so my one on one time with my kids is really limited. I try to do lots of things together as a group and one of our favorite activities is reading together. The twins just love their board books (already!) and big sister listens to the stories too, even though she has heard them thousands of times! Reading is great because everyone is included. Since your girl longs for your attention, you could try making her your designated helper. It allow her to feel important and it would be helpful to you. Now that the weather is getting nice, take walks together, and you will have some time to just relax and talk with your little ones. Relaxation for yourself is so important too, because the kids quickly pick up on when Mom gets stressed or anxious. I hope this helps you S.. Remember, they are little for such a short time, enjoy the most you can! H.

I'm sure it has crossed your mind that your daughter is using her creativity to come up with ways to get you to give her your 100% attention. There really are differences in how much some kids need attention, can play by themselves, etc. How does she behave at preschool? So with her sensitive nature and your tolerant one the situation has gotten out of control. First, step back and look at your behavior to discover any little messages you are sending to her that encourage her demands. Then try the things other mothers will be telling you that have worked for them. My advice is to say that three year old girls cry a lot, and if she is four you are nearing the end of this phase, especially since it has become too much for you and you are looking for help. Being overprotective (which in my opinion many SAHM's are) can add to this problem.

S.,

It may be part of her personality to be a drama queen, attention seeker. My middle child is a bit like this, though now she's 10, the whole game has changed! :)

I would also suggest that you find ways to keep her occupied with side-by-side jobs. maybe while you are doing laundry hand her clothes from the washer and she can put them in the dryer. My 17 mo. old LOVES this game :) He even pulls out the dryer sheet and throws it in for me :) I know it can be frustrating to deal with an unhappy kid all the time. when my son starts winding up, he is either tired, hungry or thirsty. I would try offering her a snack between meals (you may be doing this already) - I notice that hunger and thirst can turn them into little monsters. How about some videos - I know it's taboo to plop the kid in front of the TV, and I don't suggest using it as a babysitter by any means, but Cinderella and Sleeping Beauty were life savers for me when I was a single mom with a 2 yr old and 9 month old... They wouldn't watch the whole thing, but I got a good 45 minutes to do things.

I think the independence will come... she may just not be enjoying herself since her brother went to school... it's an adjustment for her too... i'm sure they played a lot together.

Hello S.,
I can somewhat understand what you are going through. I have a son who will be 4 next month. He has 3 siblings around him but he really fights for attention. As mentioned by some of the previous responses: If she wants to be by you give her a job to do. My son helps me with laundry moving things to the dryer, folding the clothes (while not always perfect he is trying to help and it makes him feel good and we are together chatting and such while we do it) He also packs a bag just about every time we leave the house. He takes a cup and a snack bag and also has a box of tissues back by him. Put the responsiblity on her so she learns to do things for herself.
I still have a few issues with my son I am trying to work on, but these little things help with some of the times he needs me. (And a little TV time isn't the end of the world!)
Good luck

You might want to try putting her in a class or two. Whatever works for your schedule. My daughter (who is now 6) was also very clingy. I signed her up for a begginer ballet class when she was three and before I knew it, her attachment to me decreased. Summer classes should be starting soon. Check with your park district for classes that you think might interest your daughter. Just make sure it isn't a "mommy and me" class. That would defeat the purpose. Good luck!

Wow! That sounds really frustrating. I can hear the desperation in your e-mail. I don't have a good answer for you, but I'll keep thinking. The one idea I have is to try wearing your 4 year old in a sling or carrier of some sort. (a backpack is nice because you can continue on with laundry, etc) It kind of boils down to your daughter needing your attention. Wearing them in the sling gives them your attention, makes them feel secure, and though it may not be the most convenient, hopefully it will fill her need right now. Hang in there! I'll pray for you by name tonight.

Dear S.,
Honey, I feel your pain. My son is 4 1/2 and he is clingy and cries about something every chance that he gets. I have a 17 year old daughter also and they are constantly at each other throats about everything from him being in her room or him hitting her for no reason. First of all I constantly tell him that sometimes I need privacy and that he should respect that. He is always busting in the bathroom when I'm in there and if I lock the door he bangs on it as if he's caged up on the other side of the door. I also provide him with plenty of DVD's that I personally showed him how to use the remote control to start, stop , and pause whenever he wants. This seems to make him feel like he's a big boy and the fact that he has his own t.v. in his room it gives me a break from him for a while. The pulling over in the car is unnecessary. I tell my son I can't drive when he yells and we are going to crash if he keeps it up! If this doesn't work then I tell him I'm going to put him out of my car if he doesn't be quiet. He tried me one time and I pulled over and started to get out of the car, you should have seen how fast he was apologizing saying he'll stop and he's sorry. Of course I would never have put him out but you have to make kids think you will do some things at times in order to keep them in check. As far as one on one playing with your daughter that is unnecessary too, kids have a vivid imagination and some of them just need to use it. My son's dad will sit for hours on the floor playing cars and trucks and games but I don't do that. I give hugs, kisses, and fix bumps and bruises. He knows I don't like that type of thing, not saying that I don't play with him sometimes, but he knows it's rare and he treats it as a special thing when I do play on the floor. When he's being a brat and cries about playing then it's bedtime. When bedtime is at 5:00p.m. it doesn't take long for him to figure out it's not worth the tears! Tough love is still love indeed and if you want to keep your sanity and be the best mom you can sometimes you have to be consistent and stick to the rules that work for you then you can deal with new dilemmas. Good Luck!

I know it's hard to listen to her cry, but don't give in to her tantrums! My daughter is like that, too. She never wants to play by herself and gets really emotional when she doesn't get what she wants. Maybe sit her down and talk to her about it. Find out if there is a reason for why she is acting that way. Maybe she's jealous, or feels left out - she sees that you drop what you are doing to help the baby with whatever she needs, so maybe she feels that's the only way to get your attention. Next, explain to her that this is unacceptable behavior and that there are going to be consequences if she doesn't stay calm (time-outs, etc). Explain that you are exhausted and that you can't keep doing this with her and that she needs to start helping you and stop fighting with you. Also, explain that the baby needs to be attended more often, because she' so little and can't do much by herself, but also that it won't be this way forever and that she will start being able to do things on her own soon. Then maybe try a sticker chart or something, and everytime she "keeps her cool" she can have a sticker. After 'X' amount of earned stickers for the day, she can have an afternoon (2-3 hours maybe) of undivided attention from you - that you and her can go/do something just the 2 of you. Make sure that she understands that she needs to earn that time. Try playing games with her during the week too. Often with my daughter, I only need to get her started on something (Painting, coloring, playing with play-doh, etc) and then I can walk away from her. The project will usually keep her busy for 30-40 minutes and then I can go switch the laundry, clean a bathroom or whatever. Also maybe try giving her an extra 5 minutes before bed and read her a book that she picks out - that way it's just for her. You'll be amazed at how little you have to do to make them happy sometimes!

Take a deep breath, stay calm, and do lots of praying!!! Good Luck!

My kid isn't born yet but I'm a preschool/kindergarten teacher and I'm familiar with your problem and can tell you it's pretty common. Here are my thoughts. First, she's probably acting clingy toward you and not your husband for 2 reasons-- one, you're the one she's with all the time and she's just used to you, while your husbnad, I assume, is at work. So you're like part of the furniture in her world, ya know? Her oxygen. Second, she might be clingy toward you cuz you indulge it. Geez if she falls down the stairs when you don't come for her I can understand why! Maybe she just craves your attention and will do anything to get it or feels totally unbalanced without you.

It sounds like maybe what she needs is some structure. In the car, put kleenex and a sippy cup that won't spill in the back seat and show her where it is so she can get it, and no matter what, if she asks for help, tell her she has to do it herself or she has to wait and do your darndest to ignore the tears. Sometimes birds need to be kicked out of the nest to fly! At home, maybe schedule some alone time every day in which she's in one room playing for-- even 10 minutes-- not that long at first-- and set a timer where she can see it so she knows she must spend that much time on her own. Give her plenty to do in that time so she doesn't come asking you for stuff. In school, I tell my kids they must go to the potty before class and bring their water bottles to their seats so they have no reason to leave the room. Then if I get a kid who raises her hand every other second to ask a question or gets out of his seat all the time to hug me or something, I explain gently but FIRMLY that there will be time for questions and hugs and stories but not now. It takes a few weeks, but they get it. You can do something similar at home.

Ironically, monasteries work that way! All these grown women in monasteries have times when they're silent for a few hours, can't communicate with each other, times for work, prayer, and socialization. And those are grownups! Something about human beings craves structure!

Good luck! You also might think about asking her preschool teacher for some pointers; she might know your kid well enough to come up with better solutions than I.

I hope you get all kinds of great advice. Just from what I'm reading I would say you are inadvertantly encouraging her behavior. I'm not saying ignore her by any means...but try making her feel like more of a big girl. Let her have a half an hour of TV time where she picks out what she wants to watch. Let her help make dinner or help take care of the baby. Make sure she knows that "baby" behavior means she can't help with the big girl stuff. Make her feel important. Put your foot down on safety issues. She does not open that basement door period. My four year old is the exact opposite. She's the boss of the world and doesn't need anyone else to play. I'm sad sometimes that she doesn't "need" me. But the fact that your daughter doesn't act like that around your husband means she will change her behavior for you if you change yours for her. Let her draw and read and praise her for that. Hope this helps a little.

She doesn't do this with your husband because he shows her he is the boss not her, with you; you allow her to boss you around, you give in to her ever command. Take charge or you will have this even in adult years. There is a website called Kaboose that gives great ideas for entertaining kids. Or even the Disney network. You can find so many ideas on line. But don't buy into her tantrums or you will lose control forever.

my now 7 year old did a lot of that as well. he was 20 months old when his brother was born so I put michael in daycare a half a day 2 times a week so I could bond with baby- I just felt I couldnt do it with all his needs- which he almost still needs at 7. I didnt learn until Michael was 5 he has vision problems- even though he tested fine on his vision test. I can not imagine how insecure that made him feel. he goes to OT once a week now for eye exercises. so I would recommend talking to your ped and ask for a PT and ET eval. good luck!

S.,

Been there, done that. I was a stay at home mom for 8 years before going back to work. I have 4 kids ranging in age from 10 to 3. My daughter, who is now 5, was like that from the time she was 2 until she hit about 4 1/2. I thought I was going to lose my mind! I feel ya! What worked for us was giving her chores to do. We sat Katie down and explained to her that we needed her help to take care of the family. She liked that idea. So, we made a list. While mommy is doing this, I need you to.... (I'll list some suggestions)
1. while Mommy is downstairs doing laundry, I need you to entertain your brother and read him this book. (even though she couldnt' read, she told him the story by the pictures.)
2. While we are in the car, Mommy needs you to watch out for X (a red car, a blue car, a sign with the letter A in it etc...)
3. Mommy needs you to help make dinner. She can tear up lettuce, measure out grated cheese. count baby tomatoes. Put silverware on the table, count out and arrange napkins etc...
We found most of what worked was distraction, and also, she needed to feel she was in control of something. (you know how us girls are with that! lol)
The other thing we realized was that she had trained me and knew if she cried hard enough, I woould give in. That is why she never pulled that with Dad. He didn't give in.
So, when she started to get out of control, I had two actions to pursue. 1. tell her I could not help her if she was crying and I couldn't understand her. 2. Was to put her either on the stairs, or in the other room and let her know she could have some time to pull herself together, then we could discuss what was really wrong and what she wanted. (that didn't mean she was going to get it, but it helped her to talk about it.)
If that didn't work, then I told her, this is the way it is, I understand you don't like it, but X has to get done. And put her in a safe place, ie: on the stairs, in her room, on the couch. and walk away. Tell her you will talk when she has calmed herself and whatever you do, don't give in!!! (I know that is so hard when your baby is freaking out.) But crying really won't hurt her. It's much more painful to you and she knows it. (a very hard lesson for me)
And trust me, I'm NOT an advocate of "let them cry it out." But sometimes, they are so emotionally "wrung out" it's all they can do.

this is just our experience, and by no means advice. Just what worked for us. Good luck, I know how you feel. Our house has been much more peaceful since we got her under control. She still has her moments, but she's still little and it's hard to controll emotions that you can't identify, for anyone, much less a 5 year old in a house full of boys!! lol

How frustrating for you! Maybe you could try signing her up for a class this summer. One it would give you a break, two it would help he gain some independence and three it would help her regain her since of security that you always come back. If not a park district class maybe a mom's day out program even one day a week I know that there are several good ones at some local churches. Plus they are used to dealing with separation anxiety. Hang in there...you are not the only one! :-)
H. H

I have a 4 year old daughter also! Maybe try to give her jobs, ya know help out! She may need to feel important or stand out alittle! Being mommy's little helper might work, fold clothes, sweep, clean windows (that's my daughter's favorite). When my son was born we had to set aside "alone" time for my daughter! My husband or I take only her with somewhere (the store, bank, etc..) It's not so much where you take her, it's just "alone" time with just her... to listen, talk, laugh. Hopefully that might subside direct attention all day! Good Luck!

This isn't much help but I will say this, I had a son like that at the age of four and he went to the military. I am the one who cries everyday. In other words, you might not like this now but the time will pass and you won't be necessary anymore. Unless there is something unusually strange later on. My son is almost five years older than his brother. I am trying to understand your situation and I know it is hard but you don't realize how this will go away. I am sad all the time. I wish to have those days back. If you don't want the baby to fall down the steps and you have to do the laundry and your daughter wants to be with you is there a reason why you can't have her join in and help and put baby somewhere within watching distance? Or do the laundry at another time? She sounds so insecure that perhaps a couple of weeks of really one on one would help. I think extra days in preschool is helpful to you as long as she doesn't think you are getting rid of her. You might be doing a lot of things with her there but she isn't really together with you. When was the last time doing the laundry felt like fun? I do not mean to hurt your feelings but this time truly passes and she isn't going to want to be around you later on and as in my case I am worrying everyday about my son's life if he will even be alive tonite.Maybe you could get someone to watch the baby for a little bit and enjoy time just with her. To quote that old poem "Babies Don't keep." Instead of trying to stop her from not letting you do things, perhaps you might focus on what things you can do with her and do the other stuff when big brother or dad are home. Even stores are open 24 hours these days.Maybe just leave the baby with dad and run out for milk with her. You didn't say what the things are that you absolutely have to do that you are in the car with them. Unless it's an emergency perhaps limit those trips for awhile. Good luck!