Last year I took my daughter to an in home daycare where the lady was sleeping while watching several children, let them play outside unsupervised with a 5 foot pool in the yard, fed them peanut butter and jelly with cookies EVERY day for lunch, and let my child swim in a dark green algae infested pool frequently! Needless to say I spread the word to the other parents about what was going on and left the daycare. Obviously the sitter wasnt too thrilled because she lost several kiddos that way, but she was was a licensed daycare and I paid her to care for my child, turns out that was the last thing she was doing!! Anyway, point is, my daughter's daddy asked the babysitter for her social security number (because she did not have an Employer Identification Number) and she told him that "that thing you had a child with cost me a lot of money and I almost lost my only form of income, I dont trust her with my social security number, sorry, you cant have it." Regardless of whether or not she did wrong or I handled the situation wrong, since she was my daughter's provider I have to have that info to write off her child care expenses on my 2009 tax returns. Can she legally deny this information to me??? Is there something she can provide so I can finish my taxes? Thanks in advance!
Thank you ladies so much for all your input! After contacting her and telling her that if she refused to provide some sort of identifying information such as her SS number or her EIN I would be forced to report her noncompliance on my taxes which could lead to some rather unpleasant contacts from the IRS. Needless to say, she gave me the info! Thank you moms for giving me the confidence to confront her on this issue!
One NEVER EVER gives out their SSN. I own a business (not child-care) and do not have an EIN as I am a sole employee. And EIN is used by the IRS to track EMPLOYEES of a business and how the BUSINESS reports its EMPLOYEES to the IRS. It is NOT for an individual to use to report expenses such as this.
You have rcvd some good info how to report this expense below.
This 'sitter' needs to be reported to the state w/written documentation.
I'd call Topeka child care licensing dept and talk to them about it! I'm so sorry this happened to you!!
This is from the IRS.gov website about your situation:
My babysitter refused to provide me with her social security number. Can I still claim the amount I paid to the babysitter for child care while I worked? If so, how do I claim these child care expenses on my tax return?
Yes, if you meet the other requirements to claim the child and dependent care credit, but are missing the social security number or other taxpayer identification required ID number of a provider, you can still claim the credit by demonstrating "due diligence" in attempting to secure this information.
If a provider of child care refuses to give the identifying information, the taxpayer can still claim the credit however, the taxpayer must provide whatever information is available about the provider (such as name and address) on the form used to claim the credit Form 2441 (PDF), Child and Dependent Care Expenses, or Form 1040A, Schedule 2 (PDF), Child and Dependent Care Expenses for Form 1040A Filers). The taxpayer should write "see page 2" in the columns requesting the missing information. The taxpayer should write at the bottom of page 2 that the provider refused to give the requested information. This statement will show that the taxpayer used due diligence in trying to secure and furnish the identifying information.
For more information refer to Form W-10 (PDF), Dependent Care Provider's Identification and Certification, the instruction for Form 2441 (PDF), Child and Dependent Care Expenses, Publication 503, Child and Dependent Care Expense, or Tax Topic 602, Child and Dependent Care Credit.
Just a side note-If you ever run into that kind of a problem with a childcare provider not providing care or acting recklessly, which I hope you do not, in addition to warning current clients, please call your local child protection/regulatory agency (in IL it was Department of Children and Family Services-DCFS, in AZ it's Child Protective Services-CPS) and report the provider. By reporting her, you can ensure someone will check-up on her facility, whether licensed or unlicensed. By reporting her you will hopefully prevent her from providing negligent care to any other child in the future.
Good luck with your taxes!!
You can still claim her. If you cannot obtain a SSN for her, you just have to provide the information that you know, like her name and address. You may not be able to E-file without it, but you can do it the good old fashioned way on paper. Sorry that you're going through this. I'm a provider, so I understand your frustration with this "provider".
I would call the county daycare license center and speak to them. She should be REPORTED! And I would ask them if they could help you in dealing with this issue about her tax number as well.
I did daycare for 5 years. I had a TERRIBLE mother who took advantage of me every chance she got. I wasn't very good at confrontations so I decided to give her a 2 week notice and get rid of her. (This was in November.) Her son was terrible too! Well, I gave the notice on a Wednesday (bad idea since I didn't get paid till Fridays.......) She read the note, slammed the door, and never returned. I knew I would have her when she needed my id number for taxes. Sure enough, she called me come Spring because she wanted my info. I refused to give it to her until she paid me what she still owed me from that week. She hung up on me. Then she called and threaten me though..... Said I was a terrible provider and all my families were leaving me, etc. Nobody ever left me, by the way.... I hung up on her...... Two days later I recieved my check in the mail. I sent her my info ALONG with a letter from my lawyer about harrassment. I never heard from her again.
Can she legally withhold the info. I was told by my lawyer that I could NOT. But how to enforce it, I'm not sure. Your tax person should have some ideas. Otherwise, I'd call one of the old families and ask them if they had her number and could share it with you so you could claim your childcare.
To the poster who said people don't use their ssn. MOST providers do.
I had a sitter that wouldn't give me any identifier number since what I figure she didn't claim what I gave her to watch my kids when i worked. So what I did was I included it I had an accountant do my taxes and he put it in.
As long as you know the amount you paid, you don't have to have her social or federal id number! You just check the box that says provider refuses to give info.
if she's a licensed daycare provider there has to be a way to get her license number... just like any other licensed professional... i'd call DCFS since i THINK they do the licensing and ask them
The only info you need for your taxes on this woman is her first and last name, her address and how much you paid her the IRS will find out the rest for you. Good luck
I have over 10 years in child car and been the baby room worker up to owning my own center and even worked as an assistnt director in a nation wide chain. Home child care regulations are MUCH different for home child care than it is for a child care center. Licensed Home child care is way laid back. You can go off and take a shower, take a nap, let the kids do all kinds of stuff that could never happen in a regular child care center. The thought is that you would take care of these kids just like you would take care of your own kids. I have seen some really bad ones that were never closed and some really fine ones.
Talk to a professional who does taxes for a living. Just call and ask what to do if they refuse to give you infor. To be truthful, I don't give out my SS # to anyone for any reason. There are alternatives resources for you to use to get the same outcome. As said before, just check the box, list her name and information, etc...I don't have the SS# for every babysitter I have used the past year and still plan on putting the amounts in that I have paid. I just don't know which way my husband does it.
It is quite possible that she is not legal in the country or not really certified with the state. You should called whomever certifies in the state and explain your situation and see what they say. Perhaps they have her number if she is legal. The other parents have good ideas, too. Good luck. Put it down anyway, to with her name and address and whatever information you have. If she is a homeowner she will not be moving too quickly anyway.
I am so sorry that you had to go through this. Glad you found out before anything serious happened to your child or someone elses. I was a daycare provider in KS before moving back to Mo. I don't know the laws about her refusing to give you her social but that's how I always did it with my parents. If I were you I would call her one last time and ask, if she still says no, then I would threaten her that you are going to call the county that she is lisenced in and report her for the stuff she has done. Then they will come out and investigate her. That will cause her more problems that I am sure she doesn't want.
If that doesn't work and she's still not giving you her info, can you call other parents and see if she gave them the info?
I would also call your tax person and ask them what they recommend to do.
Good luck!
Is she licensed by the state she has to have some kind of Employer Id number, What you can do is contact IRS and ask them what you need to do to get your credit since she is refusing to give you this information Especially if she was paid by the state for any of her kids.... for her horrible daycare from the sounds it is good that you spread the word... Good Luck
I would suggest asking her to call your accountant and give the accountant the information, rather than you. Perhaps she would feel more comfortable.
I did daycare for 5 years. First of all if you are going to someones home you don't ask them for their Soc. Sec. number. Are you willing to give that to your sitter also? And you NEVER give out that info. If you are going to someone's home you are already getting cheap daycare, and your child is getting one on one attention. Do I believe the above post, absolutely not! If anything, most of the sitters I know are great and love children...Now the parents are another matter. I belong to a group of sitters, and we blacklist BAD PARENTS. In almost all cases a parent that gets angry, threatens, etc. is because of payment issues. If this sitter was so bad she would never have kept her child with her past one week. Do you really believe she was sleeping with "several" kids, and everyday was pbj with cookies, lol. From experience once the sitter called her out for non payment OR behaviour issues with her child...she became angry and lied to the other parents. I actually had one lady do this, and explained to all my parents that she didn't pay her bill. Also, when you go out of your way to libel someone, believe me they can do the same to you. I knew one sitter that called their creditors, cps, irs, and yes many of us sitters look our parents up in the county records and know who we are letting inside our home FYI. And to the numbnut above, if the IRS audited her...you would also get audited...and if they find a mistake on your taxes...so it goes both ways. I've seen that happen to one of my friends. The lady that was falsely lying I sent a letter from my lawyer to her office that if she didn't cease and desist her libellous accusations we would file in court. That was the end of her, and fyi I always claimed my child care; but you learn in the first year you do not want nuts to get your ssn. Many people look up their sitters, but remember many sitters also have your personal info because it is all on the internet, so appreciate a good sitter and don't treat her like your personal employee. She will likely dump you pretty quick. If you need a tax i.d. and are more concerned with that, then there are many public facilities. I used to work in those as a preschool teacher and they are not very good imo.
I suspect she isn't a legal citizen and hence the reason she won't give it to you???
also, if you know any of the parents still/formerly using her, you could see if they have the info, although it might be better for you to just go ahead and follow the other advise about putting her name and address and saying she wouldnt give you the info. Thank goodness you got your baby out of there!
