Overkill and Excessive Punishment from the school?......edited W/ My Feedback...

The school is spot on - when a child consistently gets in trouble - doing the same thing over and over again - and the typical punishments do not work - it is appropriate for the school to try something else.

She is not learning the lesson that needs to be learned. I think I am reading 5 incidents in one week - that is really a lot.

Please go talk to the teachers and principal - you really need to hear the adult version of the incidents.

Good Luck

sounds to me as if they ought to up her consequences until she starts listening better. when my kids came home in trouble several days in a row there would be some pretty serious consequences from me.
khairete
S.

Yes, you are wrong in your thinking. Your daughter has, in a very short time, shown herself as a trouble maker, physically violent, and non compliant.

Instead of getting mad at the school figure out why she is acting out.

Perhaps I am reading this incorrectly, but it seems you are more worried about the punishment and the actions of others than you are about your daughter's acting out.

On Monday, she and another classmate escalated a fight the teacher had already tried to put out.

On Weds, she threatened another child. Your comment is "She didn't (hurt the other child), she just said it. I have no idea what, if anything, the other kid said for mine to say this." Mom, this is a threat. Kids cannot threaten each other at school. People should not threaten each other, period. With zero-tolerance policies, this IS a big deal.

On Thursday, after showing disobedient behavior on two out of three days of the week, she disregards the teacher's direction to stop what she was doing, which the aide felt was problematic.

Time for you to talk to the principal, in person. I wouldn't want to be hearing these repeated episodes and NOT talk to someone in charge. I would be very concerned that my child was in trouble this often and talking to the teacher or principal, at this point. It sounds like the principal is trying like anything to get her attention. You don't want to hear this, but you need to be a team with your child's teacher and principal so that you can help your daughter. She needs to be able to function at school in a cooperative manner, and not addressing this is only going to worsen the situation.

Please take the time to think about this from the perspective of the teacher, the kid that was threatened, the aide, the principal. You might come to a different conclusion.

You're wrong in your thinking. Your daughter (within s short time) proved herself the be a habitual trouble maker. A violent one, at that. SHE took away her right to "decompress." It doesn't matter if she didn't do anything, she threatened violence, and there has to be no tolerance for that.

You are doing her no favors, by defending her. She is floundering, and having serious problems at school. You need to have a serious discussion with her teacher and principal, and get to the bottom of this. She is headed down a road, that will only get worse. It sounds like you need a new thinking plan.

What is she like at home? I'm willing bet she has problems there, too.

UUUMMMMMM NO!!
If she were actually learning the lesson ---- "don't hit -- don't kick -- don't threaten -- ect she may have gotten to go out and play. But she is not learning the lesson. She needs to understand that she will not be allowed to hit, kick, threaten ---- this is also known as bullying.

How would you feel if your child was the receiver of her actions. What would you want the teachers, aides, and principal to do if your child was the one being hit, kicked, and threatened?

I"m sorry this isn't going to be what you want to hear,

but I"m really sure the principal isn't out there hunting down kids just so he can waste his time writing up thinking plans for them, He's got better things to do and probably more enjoyable things to do.

This is happening to your precious little girl because of her behavior. If you know of another alternative that they could do so that she follows the rules then just say, Missing recess won't deter her but she loves Music class and if she has to miss that she will for sure STOP KICKING kids in line.

If she has a medical reason for not being able to control her impluses, follow directions, or remembering the rules then please tell the teachers and admins and they will be more than happy to work with you to get her where she needs to be so she can do what she is supposed to do at school which is LEARN.

seriously, A little cooperation and conversation with the people taking care of your kid can go a long way, Help them to understand what her problem is, or have a talk with her yourself so it is very clear that you expect her to behave appropriately.

i'm sorry this one pushed a button for me that i didn't know i had, and sometimes on here there will be people all up in arms that anyones precious baby has to listen to anyone at all and they can just do what ever they want. so I was probably anticipating some of that.

Bottom line work with the school they want what is best for your kid and I"m sure you do to, being known as the "bad" kid isn't what she needs.

Holy Cow.

I have a friend who has had to leave work and make arrangements because her daughter is so out of control at school. She's also out of control at home, so it's an obvious pattern. Nothing new.

Don't laugh, I've been home with pneumonia, but I watched a Dr. Phil show about out of control kids. I believe he said that statistics show that 85% of little kids who get sent home or are in trouble all the time at school end up in Juvenille Hall. Parents feel guilty for working or not giving their kids enough and as a result, they don't discipline their kids. They also don't want anyone else disciplining them either. So....as a parent, if no one has a grip on a 4, 5, or 6 year old, who is going to have a grip on them when they are 14, 15 or 16?

I don't think you should be mad at the school. I think you should talk to them because the "thinking plan" thing obviously isn't working. Losing recess isn't working. You thinking that they are being unfair to your child isn't working.

Your daughter is 6, not 3. She is not a toddler. She is in the first grade. Give her some credit. She is well capable of understanding behavior that is expected of her and what the consequences will be if she chooses not to behave in the expected manner. She's old enough to understand that if she can't get along with certain kids, she can happily play away from them because they aren't worth losing her own recess over.

Cause and effect.
Choices and consequences.

I'm 49. I was raised old school. If I had to sit with the principal because I wasn't behaving at school? OMG. That would be nothing compared to the talk in the car when my parents picked me up.
That NEVER happened, by the way.
I raised two kids as a single, full-time working mother. We all had our jobs to do. Mine was going to work and theirs was going to school, doing their work, following the rules, having manners that I so staunchly taught them at home.

I mean no offense to you in any way, shape, or form, but seriously....the school seems to be trying to help your daughter understand a concept that all children, as well as adults, have to understand. You have to behave yourself in social situations. Like it, hate it, it doesn't really matter. You still have to do it.

If you're not enforcing this at home, you're not doing your child any favors.

Again, just my opinion.

What I am reading in your post is minimizing and rationalization of your child's unacceptable behavior. She has gotten in trouble three times in one week and the normal consequence isn't working. Sounds like the school is committed to nipping this behavior in the bud from the get-go. Good for them! Especially because all of this is happening during recess, restricting recess seems like an exceptionally logical and related consequence. Basically, the message is "if you cannot control your behavior during recess, you will miss out on recess for a few days and see if that will help you remember to control yourself." I disagree with taking away recess as a punishment in general, especially for academic issues, but this seems pretty fitting to me.

If I were you, I would worry less about the principal and more about what is going on with your child. Is she having a tough time transitioning into 1s grade? Is she stressed out about something either in or out of school? Because her behavior is not acceptable and must stop, yesterday - this is not pre-school and she is not 3. I have 4 kids and the first time one saw the principal was in 7th grade. Most kids can control their impulses at this age (at least in school - then the acting out starts when they get home from school)...find out why she's having a tough time with that in school and see what you can do to help her control her own behavior.

sounds reasonable to me.
She's repeatedly had trouble with behavior at recess so she's having recess taken away. She's only 1st grade and been sent to the principles office more than once in a week. Not good, something needs to be done.
If she was playing with a ball and throwing it at and breaking things in your house with the ball would you let her still play with the ball or would you take it away?
If you don't get this behavior under control you may have a budding bully on your hands.

Well, I understand why you are concerned, but she is getting in trouble by not making good choices during the unstructured recess.

If she has to miss several recesses so she DOESN'T get in trouble again, maybe that will have more effect than standing by the wall, and having a "thinking plan" .... that apparently hasn't gotten her thinking enough on how to avoid her poor choices.

They tried several interventions... they haven't worked, so they have to step it up to the next level of intervention.

The kicking, hitting, pushing and such needs to stop... it doesn't matter if she pushed in retaliation, or initiated the pushing, it needs to stop... and this is what they are doing to try to correct it.

You need to support the school in their effort to help control your child's behavior.... and maybe add some consequences at home if she continues to get in trouble at school.

You're getting all of this from your daughter? Get it straight from the principal before you make any judgments. You're assuming that your daughter "must" have been antagonized by other children each and every time, but the common denominator in every instance of misbehavior and verbal violence has been your daughter. Being sent to the principal's office daily for misconduct is serious, it's not "she didn't even do anything."

Therefore, rather than just take your daughter's word for it, get the actual story from the teacher and the principal. And maybe, just maybe, you ought to discipline her at home for her misbehavior at school. She sounds like she's becoming a bully.

Your daughter has been sent to the Principal's office 3 times in the same week. There is a problem there. You need to concentrate more on what is causing this bad behavior.

Dear mama, it sounds like you are in denial. Stop making excuses for your kid. She has the makings of being a bully. Do you want that? Kids are often different people when not with their parents. Instead of getting high & mighty & defending & making excuses for your child, you should be trying to figure out why your child is so out of control at school.

Personally, I think the principal is well within his rights to punish her the way he has. This type of behavior needs to curbed as early as possible, or it will escalate into more. Are you punishing your child at home, too? I would be.

You stepping in & resolving her conflicts with others for her is not doing her any favors. She needs to be taught how to effectively resolve conflict without being aggressive. You'll have to accept the fact that your child's behavior at school is an issue to get it under control, though. I'd also bet, based on your lack of acceptance, that your daughter is not as much of an angel in class & at home as you are saying. Take off the rose colored glasses, my friend.

Nope, it is not too much of a punishment. She didn't learn from the consequences yet, it is very typical to lose recess multiple days for physically acting out. Your daughter should be learning how to control her actions through these consequences. She apparently sees recess as a way to act out inappropriately. Of course, she should not have recess, she can't behave. In my school, she would have already received ISS for at least half a day.

You did not mention what consequences she is getting at home. If you don't support the school and you are leading her to believe nothing is wrong, she will continue on this path with no recess or sitting with the principal or worse - detention or ISS.

She's not getting that she has behavior issues. She's 6 and in 1st grade, she should know how to act appropriately after being told to correct her behavior.

Believe me, the principal has better things to do than have to sit with your daughter b/c she can't control her actions. Quit worrying about others and whether she is getting recess - which is a privilege, not a right - and focus on your daughter and correcting her behavior.

I actually think you're not taking it seriously enough. It sounds like your child is on target to be a bully, and if I were the principal I'd be tired of it too (obviously, what they've tried isn't working) so she has to sit out. She ought to have to sit out, and you ought to follow up with punishment at home. It honestly sounds like you're trying to downplay the fact that 1. your child is being violent and 2. she's threatening other children. I'm sorry if that's harsh, but that's the reality.

I do hope things get better. I just think you need to really reinforce at home that it's not okay to behave this way, and that people will not like you if you do and you'll have a hard time making and keeping friends.

(One more quick note...just in my yard, I have a "no stick" rule...and if I see a child playing with a stick and they don't put it down, they are KICKED OUT of the yard. At this point, everyone knows the rule, and they won't even pick one up because I no longer give warnings. I actually have a cousin who fell on a "harmless" implement like a stick and LOST HER EYE. It's dangerous.)

Here is my take on it so far:
You said that on Monday she and another boy were fighting about being in front of the line. Your words were, "One hit one, the other hit back."
So... why don't you tell us who hit whom first? I am going to assume one of two reasons: A) your daughter threw the first punch, or B) you don't know the answer.
So... if it is B, why don't you know? It seems relevant.

The rest seems to have been covered adequately by some of the other moms.

And generally, I don't agree with losing recess time, either. But when I am usually against it at this age, is when it is associated with academic issues... left homework/redoing something/talking in class/etc. Losing recess does nothing to diminish those things, and can worsen a child's ability to be quiet in class. But to lose recess b/c they are hitting, threatening bodily harm, and ignoring directives on the playground? Yep. I wouldn't want MY child on the monkey bars with your daughter...

Well... obviously, the punishments for each individual offense aren't working, as her behavior hasn't changed.

Common sense would say that if one form of discipline isn't getting results, then you up the ante or find a new discipline. Schools are so limited in how they can punish children, that this is one of their only options.

I'm sorry, Mom, but I don't think you are taking this seriously enough. The thinking plans aren't working. In fact, she seems to be getting worse. What do you expect from the principal? He has to do something to prevent her from becoming a huge discipline problem. To be honest, what she needs is to run around in big circles to wear her out some, perhaps a couple of times a day, BUT, without getting to be with other kids. She SHOULD be missing regular recesses until she gets through her head that she can't misbehave like she has been doing.

Talk to the guidance counselor about a way to get her some hard running when she has recess taken away from her. And don't EVER act like threatening to push someone off the monkey bars isn't bad. It IS. I had a pack of girls threaten to knock me off of the uneven parallel bars in 9th grade, and they were suspended for it. The only reason your daughter isn't in MORE trouble for that remark is because she is 6.

Dawn

I would love to know just what a "thinking plan" is?? Anyhow, it sounds like your daughter does have some behavioral issues and you are trying to deflect some of the blame and accountability away from her. Thats ok-I would probably do the same thing. Just make sure you don't do it in front of her. One of the worst lessons that you can teach a child is that it is always the other person and that they are the vicitm of misunderstanding and bad discipline.

Is there anyone in your neighborhood that you can get to put her on the bus? I know several moms who are happy to make a couple extra bucks by doing this.

wish we lived closer to each other.....i do in home care....but a 40 minute drive is a little too much. have you tried leaving little notes in her snack or lunch....letting her know that you love her or have a good day....just a thought!!

.

Schools have zero tolerance. They have to to protect all of our kids. Telling someone she will hurt them is bullying and is equally punishable. Act like you support the schools decision and this may all end, tell her it's not fair and you are setting her up for failure.

Oh my. I wouldn't know what to do. My son had some problems with a child bullying him and him responding in kind or not quite in kind but responding at all in 1st grade. It was a nightmare. It wasn't several incidents over a few days though. My son would still have to write out something saying that if some child was bulling him he basically wouldn't take it upon himself and he'd go get a teacher.

But it sounds like the lines are blurred or at least with what you've given if you child is the aggressor or not. I'm guessing because the principle has thrown their hands up they believe your child to be the problem.

I'd call and say there needs to be solid parameters for punishment. You can't just go well I don't want to deal with it today so no recess. The child should be told it did A so B happens. It should be concrete and in my experience it always has been. I'm surprised your principle is just kinda making it up day by day. I'd ask for a face to face meeting and I'd want some parameters set up. Maybe also letting your daughter talk to the school councilor. Maybe there is some bullying going on at school that she doesn't know how to express to you. Regardless I would get this nipped in the bud. The older the child gets the worse the punishment and lets face it if you daughter is seen as a problem it's amazing how fast the grades start to reflect the teachers opinion. What might be an A paper will certainly not be for a problem child.