Mastiff Growling/snaping at 8 Month Old Daughter

Dogs gotta go. Probably unable to be around small kids & babies. Dog has no life if you separate, then dog gets ignored. You could try extreme training but that's costly and then do you really want to take the chance?

As much as I agree with the other moms who have responded, I will try to offer a suggestion that might help you. Have you taken the dog to the vet to see if anything is physically wrong? It'll be expensive to do a full blood panel, but if they find a problem, maybe it'll be something that can be corrected.

If there isn't anything physically wrong with the dog and you decide to keep it, I would highly recommend making alternative living arrangements - some dogs do well outdoors (with proper shelter) and maybe that would work.

Hi Corie,
I'm sorry you are having to deal with this new and very stressful situation. I decided to respond to this post as we had a carin terrier we had to get rid of. I took that dog to training classes for a whole year. I did dominance exercises with him and everything else I was told to do and bottom line, he could not be trusted.

He always had trouble understanding he was not the top of the pack so that was his nature from the very beginning. Not like your dog who seemed to enjoy the socializing with children before the baby came along. Although babies are very different from young children. Babies are noisy, unpredictable and also compete for attention. Attention he used to get probably a lot more of before the baby came..

He was the top of the pack before the baby came and now this baby is on the scene and in his personal space 24/7 and well.. the baby should be your top priority but he may be struggling with that or physically ill.)

The first time our problem dog growled and snapped at me, he was history. There was no way that I was going to EVER. EVER risk his disfiguring or hurting me or the kids or their friends in any way.

There is no way you can be next to an animal 24/7 to insure they aren't going to do something out of character. Humans and animals can't possibly be put in the same category as far as reasoning and intelligence. No matter how much we love them and they are a part of our family, surely you don't put them on the same level as your children do you?

How on earth do you attempt to reassure your dog that the baby's screaming is fine and he shouldn't get upset about it? Either that is annoying the heck out of him, he is jealous about the attention the baby gets or he is physically ill or in pain due to something else and frustrated about that.
That dog is reacting that way for a reason and your responsibility is to find out what that is. I know that is why you posted this question but I'm telling you, take him to the vet ASAP!
Putting the dog in a different room when the baby is out and about is the safe, intelligent and responsible thing to do. I think you are losing your perspective here. Isn't the safety of your child the MOST important thing to you?

It sounds like your dog is not appreciating this new being in his personal environment. This could be for any number of reasons. I would discuss this situation with your vet. Perhaps the dog is not feeling well and having some medical issues. We all tend to get cranky when we aren't feeling well or in pain. Until you get to the bottom of what is going on with the dog, I would URGE you to keep them separate. I wouldn't get so bogged down in the emotions of worrying about what the dog is going to think. If he interprets the separation as punishment, then so be it. You aren't abusing the dog or hitting it or screaming at it. You are just looking out for the safety of your child.

Hope you get to the bottom of it. You may in the end have to get rid of the dog. And this isn't because you don't love him but that you love your child MORE. You will never forgive yourself if that dog hurts or possibly kills your baby. Animals are just that, animals. They are unpredictable and you can't reason with them like you could possibly do with a human. He is just an animal, he doesn't know any better. But you should.

I have lived through this myself and though you don't want to hear it you need to give the dog up. Besides living it my husband is a vet and I was a vet asst. Dogs don't think like we do as far as he is concerned she is a pup in the pack that is taking away from him and may someday challenge him for position. You and your husbands are alphas he probable sees himself as beta and your daughter is a a pup that with all the attetion she is getting will take his place as beta and lower his standing in the pack. As large as you dog is I do not think you could properly get him to believe that your daughter is the dominant over him and again if you did he may still see her as a threat and try challenging her for position again. As long as he sees her as a threat he will continue to go after her. Right now it sounds as if he is just gving warning but it will most likely escalate because your daughter does not know the pack responses to show submission, and even if she did I would not recommend putting her in that position. I had an Argentine Dogo which is a small mastiff breed. When my daughter began walking he became threatened by her. He snapped when she first walked to him and once when she walked to my husband, We then made a tough desision and gave the dog to my husbands parents. We did not like the idea of keeping him locked up in one room of the house to keep him away from our daughter and we were afraid that there would be a time he was faster than us and she would be hurt. I understand some of this is hard to believe since you stated he is good with other children and has shown no agression there but they are not his "pack" and they go home to other houses, therefore they are not threats to his place in your home. Again my dog was also great with other childre letting them climb on him and playing fetch and such, but it is different when it was in his own home. If you decide to give him up go with someone you know and trust and preferable has no kids at home. Able(my dog) was once again fine with my daughter while she was with my in-laws because she was no no longer in his home and a threat to him. I hope this helps.

1st, I want to respond by addressing Shawn and Celeste..why did you two even bother respondign to this post when you offer NO helpful advice? And how dare you even say something as ridilcous who is valued more, the dog or child??? Next time, keep your offensive comments to yourself if you have no real suggestions or advice to offer.
C., I would suggest the vet visit as well. You never know if something else is bothering your dog. And, they might be helpful in figuring out this new behavior as well. Good luck!

you have had lots of responses and i don't have the patience to read them all....so i apologize if this is something you have heard in the past response. me and my husband had 2 shepard lab mix dogs that we rescued. they were our babies and we loved them to death. when i got pregnant the vet adivsed us that the dogs would have a period where they would feel jealous and may act out. everything was going well with just a touch of bad behavior things like chewing on shoes and peeing in the house once in a while. until my daughter started crawling....that is when trouble started. the female Layla was so gentle with her and i think she almost mothered her to a degree....always making sure my daughter was in her sight and when she cried she would walk around nervously until we picked the baby up and settled her. but the male Luke was kinda not interested in the baby anymore, he just would watch her crawl by him and then look the other way as if bored. one day he began to growl when she crawled by him and she didn't even have to touch him or anything.....i had to find them both a new home because i can never take the chance that he might snap at her and hurt my daughter. now like i said i loved both these dogs and saw them at their worst when they were in horrible health and grossly malnurished, we took them to a vet to get checked and adopted them and nursed them back health. i would do anything for them! and the best thing i could do for them was to keep them together (because thats how we found them wandering the streets) and find them a loving home with no children. some dogs just aren't equipped to handle children and they love to have all the attention of their parents!! and i think your dog is one of them, you can find him a home with no children (since this is his only real problem) and make sure you find him a loving home. the behavior may be able to be corrected.....but who knows for how long. you can't make someone like cake if they don't like it. and you don't want your child to get hurt because you were too stubborn to make the decision that you know you have to make. just think of the latter, once he does bite and hurt your daughter, you may have to put him down instead of finding him a home with no children. good luck

No matter how well you think you know your dogs, you have to realize that they are animals and therefore unpredictable, even the one who so far has shown no aggression. I'm sure you don't need to be preached to, but you should never never leave an animal alone with a child, no matter how gentle or trained your dog is. If you refuse to get rid of the dog, you should at least accept the fact that he will need to be kept away from the baby at all cost to keep her safe. She is your first priority, and as a mother, you need to do whatever it takes to put her needs before that of your dogs.

Hi C.,

Wow- You sure received a broad spectrum of replies!

I have a girlfriend who had an Akita Inu. The dog was beautiful and normally was well behaved. My friends son was playing on the floor and the dog (for no apparent reason) bit her son in the face, chomping down over his nose and forehead. The dog literally ripped off her sons forehead and crushed part of his nose. It was AWFUL. The little boy needed emergency surgery and has a heck of a scar now.

My friend's husband did not want to put the dog down, so they had a meeting with the vet, behavior classes etc. They THOUGHT everything was getting better with the dog.

My friends sister was at the house and she went to pet the dog, leaned down and the dog bit her in the face, he tore her lip off......She needed emergency surgery and has had to have cosmetic surgery (for the scaring). She is a really pretty girl so it's really a shame that the dog did this.

My friend and her husband finally decided that they had to put the dog down. It wasn't an easy decision, but it was necessary.The dog had a history of nipping, but had never "hurt" anyone.

I know you know this, but PLEASE be careful. Dogs are animals, they can be unpredictable. You said your 8 month old daughter is beautiful.......I can't imagine the pain/guilt you will feel if something happens to her because of the dog.

Also, you had mentioned not wanting other children to get hurt- You also should remember people are lawsuit happy now- You never know what someone will sue for- (If you own a home) Make sure your homeowners insurance covers accidents that could be caused by the dog on your property.

It sounds like you have all your bases covered- I hope the dog learns that he is not the boss.

Take care-
MV

I understand that your dogs are like your children, but come on!? What is it going to take to make you rethink your decision? Think of your baby, who does not have the strength or the sense to fight back. GET RID OF THE DOG! I know you don't want to hear this, but as another poster said, you did post on mamasource. Most mothers would put their child before the dog.

We had a similar experience with our dog when our daughter became a toddler. The unsteady walking would turn our Keeshond into growling with her mouth closed. We kept Xena behind a gate for a while but I thought that is no life for a dog. She was our child before our daughter. I think this may be part of the problem. Our Shitzu who was our serrogate after losing a baby ended up biting our daughter in the nose, no blood. He could have easily chose to run away but didn't. They both ended up going to their respective breed's rescue places. I cried alot when each of them left. We loved them both dearly but I knew if the Keeshond decided to bite for whatever reason, our child would be scarred for life. We now have a dog that is a mix we rescued as a puppy. It is her dog and she has an unbelievable relationship with her dog and a complete love of dogs and animals in general. I think the outcome would have been different if she was severely hurt by a dog. I know it's tough but you are your child's best defense. Good luck!

I just have one question for you. I am not being mean, but what would you do if your bull mastiff (which is a seriously big dog) does bite your daughter?

The reason I asked that because she had cover everything else I had just wanted to know if she had also considered that. Not to be mean. I understand pets are very important to they owner or else they would not have them. My intent was not to be mean but to gather more information before giving her my own ideas or advice.

I read all the replies posted so far...and as someone who was in a similar situation as you I'll reply...

We had a dog who was fine with our "baby" when she didn't yet crawl or walk. Things changed once she became mobile.

After talking with our vet about growling and snapping, both to me and the baby (mind you he was MY dog before I got married), he said perhaps it was a territorial issue, perhaps it was a dominance issue or it was possibly an issue with some unknown/undiagnosed pain/arthritis issue.

The vet said that since we couldn't be sure, that our best bet would be to put the dog down. He said if we were the only owners of the dog and this was happening to us the dog couldn't be trusted with another owner either.

We didn't put him down, instead wanting to call behaviorists and anyone else would could help. But no one could (that we could afford, and we were willing to resolve the issue!).

The fact of the matter became that things just got worse. We tried walking the dog more (to give him individual attention and exercise), to give him lots of praise, everything we could think of to relieve the anxiety and tension about what happened to our beloved pet. In the meantime we kept him separated from the baby at all times and NEVER left him alone with her. However even with the gates up in the house, the minute the baby crawl/walked to the gate, he would STILL snap at her fingers and scare her.

In the end, we had to make the hard decision to put him down. Things progressively got worse with him eventually biting my husband and there was no deciding between our child and our pet (plus I was pregnant with #2). Although I felt guilty - I KNEW it was the best thing to do. If a dog cannot understand his place in the family pecking order, then you need to put an end to that relationship.

As you have already stated, getting bit by a dog is hard enough. But you need to keep your children safe first and foremost.

Good luck and keep us posted on what happens. Please do keep him away from the baby at all times. It's not worth an "accident" to find out what you'll do.

BTW - my vet said, "Please put the dog down before you have to call a plastic surgeon before you call me next time."

Now, my vet knew me and this dog for years. If HE was suggesting this, I knew in my heart that it needed to be done.

Good luck with your situation. Hope it works out. I'd rehome the dog because I'd just be terrified of the what ifs. I did have a dog that I spent months in training with and she still bit my husband on the hand. He was bit as a child by the family dog also.

I have two labs and they were my first babies. I had them for 8 years before having my daughter. Many people will think I am crazy, but here we go. One time, my female lab snapped at my daughter when she was about 8/9 months old. She just snapped at her because my daughter was crawling around her and probably being generally annoying. After the snap, I grabbed my dog and beat her. For the first time in her life the dog was hit. I never hit my dogs and even with potty training, I used the reward system. Even while I beat my dog that horrible day, I was crying about it. But, the bottom line is that I am the boss, and the dog needed to know that snipping, snapping was not acceptable behavior. The good news is that my lab never snapped again. My daughter is now 5 years old and that was the ONLY time I ever had to hit my dog. I thank God that it worked out, because if it didn't, I would have had to place my first baby (the dog) in another home. Let me add that I do not advocate hitting and that I do not believe in hitting as a solution to every problem. I just think that I let my lab know that I was the top bitch in the house. Good luck with your dog, you will find a solution to the problem. Please, just do not ignore it.

Hi C.. I was in a similar situation and hired a behaviorist that came to our home and worked with us. it really helped our situation. I highly recommend him and thought his pricing was very reasonable for the service he provided. Check out his website http://www.canisfamiliaris.info/
Good luck!

My response is a bit different then the others. I applaud you for not taking the "easy" way out and giving up on the dog or putting him to sleep. I have worked for vets for years and I can't tell you how many people have put pets down because they didn't want to take the time to get to the bottom of the problem and fix it. It used to break my heart. I do think for the time being you should keep the dog and baby separate. I do think you need to speak with your vet. It may be a physical problem. Dogs alot of times don't show pain (as I'm sure you know).
But if the problem isn't physical there are other things you can do. If it's just about the dog having anxieties about babies you can speak to your doctor about having the dog on an anti-anxiety medicine (such as Xnanax) until your child grows out of babyhood. Or a canine behaviorist or a trainer that specializes in things like this (or in rehabilitating animals) may be able to help you. You sound like a great Mom to both your child and your pets!
I have an almost three year old daughter and her best friends are a 120 lb Rott (that belongs to my mom) and an Am Staff mix (that belongs to my brother). I completely trust the Rott with my daughter. The Am Staff is still a puppy so we are still training him on how to be around my daughter (he is sweet as can be but he's a jumper) but he is really good with her as well. My daughter crawls all over the dogs; pulls their ears, tails, etc; sticks her hands in their bowls while they are eating (we all do that); takes balls and toys right out of their mouths; runs all around them screeching and stuff; and they don't do a thing to her. They love to play with her and snuggle with her. We have worked extensively with the dogs to get them to be that way. The Rott is all hand signaled trained and they both know they are NOT the alpha in the house- the Rott knows my Mom is her alpha and the Am Staff knows my brother is his alpha.
I say just keep working with the dog and enforcing that you are alpha (I don't agree with hitting the dog- that can cause aggression. Plus you don't want him to obey you out of fear. I think that is a terrible thing to do to an animal- to make him afraid of you). I'm sure having big dogs like that for the period of time that you've had them- you and your husband know how to assert yourself as alpha. And speak with a professional, starting with your vet- he/she can probably recommend a trainer/ behaviorist. Although- if you'd like- a friend of mine had great results with his dog's trainer. If you'd like I can get you that info- just PM me.
Good luck and I hope it all works out for you.
BTW Yay for you and your husband working with the rescues! It's an awesome thing you are doing! Also yay for you not letting your childhood experience keep you from enjoying animals.

*EDIT* I didn't get to read Lora's, Toni's, MS's, etc replies before I posted mine. Good thing there are some helpful replies for you. I have heard wonderful things about TOPS as well. I know someone who takes her Bull Mastiff there and he loves it there.

Hi C.- I am also sorry but I have to echo the last post. I am a mom of 4 and watched as my neighbor's malamute snapped at my 4 year old daughter( who was told by the grandmother that she could pet the dog-she leaned forward to hold out her hand and was almost bit). I explained that I understand their dog is their baby but the damage a dog can do to a baby or small child is irreversable. I am still friends with my neighbor and our children are playmates- but I will NOT let my daughter over her house unless the dog is in the garage. I know it is hard to hear but I have seen the damage a much smaller dog than yours has done to a child(permenant physical and emotional scars) and is that a risk you are willing to take.
Good Luck with whatever you decide.
B.

We have a Mastiff as well. You are doing the right thing. However, I am concerned that your mastiff Capone is it?? might be in physical pain of some sort thus the growling. Maybe it is something that your vet hasn't picked up. Otherwise, if he thinks it is a behavioral issue then I would talk to an animal behavioralist.

We've used one with great results on our two dogs. We have a 2 1/2 year old daughter and 7 month old son. One dog is a German Sheperd and the other English Mastiff. Dr. Bob Andrysco. His email is Petshrink.com Dr. Bob's Pet Solutions. Located in Fox River Grove. Great to work with. He helped us.

We have neighbors with 2 mastiffs and I know they are the most loving dogs ever! They has one dog they purchase as a pup when their children were preschool age. Then they bred her and they kept one pup who is now larger than her! I now they have said since Mom has had her pups she is a little different around others. I think she has like a motherly instinct.
Just a guess but maybe becasue your dogs were laready there and the baby is crawling and confortable around the dogs maybe they view her as a playmate. The snap could be like a snap of I don't want to play now, leave me alone.
I have a Pug who cries when my 6 month old cries to let me know hey take care of him he's my buddy! It's actually kind of cute how he tries to mother him as I do. Pugs I think are just a small version of a mastiff. As far as comments from people, I think I would say some of those things too had I not known someone with a mastiff. When you see one from a distance or just hear how big they are they sound scary! But the big babies are probably nicer than a chihuahua. I would still use caution until baby is bigger but to me it's the same as putting your 6 year old child in the room with a dog. You really can't trust anyone but you as a monitor. Good Luck !

C.,

Just responding to let you know that I feel soooo bad for you and your family!!! I have 2 dogs, have had dogs my whole life and I understand the feelings we have for our dogs. They are part of the family!!! I got lucky with my 2 dogs and my 2 year old. They are doing ok together thus far. My shitzu-poodle mix isn't really fond of her (unless my daughter is feeding her), but my lab actually likes the baby. Our dogs aren't young either...my first babies also! I think a behaviorist is in order before anything drastic even gets discussed. They may even recommend some type of anti-anxiety meds for the mastiff. I know there is a dog behaviorist in Naperville. Ask the vet for recs..sorry, I lost his name. I just wanted to let you know that I feel for you....Hope all works out...keep us posted! Some of us do care about you, your dogs, and your baby!

C.,

Ok. I'm a dog owner (two German Shepherd's 65 and 95 pounds). Sydney (65 pounds) is going to be 12 in June and she's my girl. I had her before I met my husband. I did extensive, advanced training with her at TOPS in Grayslake. (They train police dogs). I could walk her without a leash, get her to sit, down, come, heel with only hand signals, have her come running to me full force on a "come" and down her at a line, instantly. She is also VERY protective. I was engaged before and ended it while still living with him. One night we were yelling and Syd was laying in the corner. Scott (ex) came up to me and grabbed my shoulders. Sydney flew up and jumped in the air to bite him. I heard her jaws snap as she missed his neck by inches. From that day, I knew that I had a loyal, but dangerous friend on my hands.

Fast forward eight years...I was pregnant with my first son. Sydney was even more attached as I was pregnant. I would sleep on the couch and she would sneak up (not allowed up there!) and lay on top/next to me and sleep for hours. She followed me around and had to be touching me wherever I was. In truth, it was so awesome to see her so in tune to my pregnancy but I was scared to death that she wasn't going to accept the baby. I read books on what to do. I talked with her trainer (whom I became friends with) and tried hard to prepare her and myself for the addition to the family.

All of the worrying ended up being just that - worry. She's been fine with not only son #1 (almost 3) but our new son (8 months - like yours). That being said my husband and I have two rules:
1) I don't let either dog alone with the boys - ever. Not for a second and 2) ANY act of aggression from either dog towards the kids will result in getting rid of them. No questions asked at ALL. I absolutely will not take the chance of my children being hurt. I wouldn't be able to live with myself. One bite from a 210 pound Mastiff could kill your child. Not scar her, not scare her but kill her.

I truly believe that you have to come to terms that your dog (animal) may not be able to stay in your home - for the sake of your child. That being said, it sounds as if that really isn't an option for you. So, I offer these suggestions:

1) Get your dog checked out at the vet for everything. Maybe something is bothering him and he is in pain and cranky. A dog his size is probably considered "old" at the young age of 5. My mom has Great Danes and she's on her 3rd now and Sydey was around to meet all three of them.

2) Talk to a dog behaviorist ASAP. And I don't mean a PetSmart dog trainer (no offense meant for them) but a true professional who has been training for a long time. (Like the Dog Whisperer!). I'm not sure where you live, but the trainer I used from TOPS was Phil Behun. He now runs a kennel in Poplar Grove, IL. I haven't talked to him in about a year or so, but I could get in touch and see if he can help you.

3) Until you get the situation resolved, please PLEASE separate your dog from your baby. The split second it takes for your dog to bite your child isn't enough time for you to do anything to prevent it. Even if you are in the room with them.

I wish you the best C.. I KNOW you are in a really tough situation. I hope you can come through with a solution that is best for your daughter.

T.

EDITED TO ADD: Hard to believe I have more to say, right? When I was reading about "dog behavior with a new baby" something that was mentioned more than once was that issues tend to arise once the baby becomes mobile. A squealing, crying, laughing baby rolling around (or crawling) can be read by a dog as an injured animal (prey). If your dog loves to chase balls, cars, birds, animals - whatever - he has a high prey drive and could be having a hard time with the baby for that reason. Just a thought. I'll shut it now.

I would get a professional trainer involved immediately. The first call would be to your vet for a recommendation and also an evaluation. The dog could have been fine with the other children because no one was on his "territory" during those fun swims but being in the house he is most likely seeing it as his domain and that needs to be corrected. He doesn't own the house. I know how hard it can be. We worked with our dog for over a year before breaking down and putting him to sleep. My husband and I could manage his agression (snapping and growling) but were worried he would get out of the yard or something one day and something horrible would happen. There is a place in Grayslake called TOPS that is well knowen (and also does not hesitate to use physical force if necessary) and a place in Palatine called A Closer Bond (I don't believe they use force). I would try to find some one familiar with your breed - try calling a rescue group for a recommendation for a trainer.

I didn't read all the other entries, I can only suggest Comfort zone with D.A.P. for dogs.

http://petcomfortzone.com/comfortzone_dap.htm

You might want to try the diffuser. It will calm you dog, it works like MAGIC! It truly is a miracle. I have used it for my cat whom is a member of my family and I thought I'd have to get rid of her. I have a friend who used it for her dog and it worked as well.

Good luck!

Just wondering if your dog has gotten any better with the baby or if you have found out if there is an underlying issue. I have 2 rotts and used to get tons of critiscm just for having them(although they have NEVER shown one sign of aggression towards my 4 kids at all) so I was just curious as the outcome of your problem.

I'd definitely have the vet check him out again. My old landlord had a pitbull that was a big teddy bear, and all of a sudden she started getting mean - it turns out she had a tumor in her stomach that was causing her a lot of pain.

Make sure anytime he does this to day 'aht' and take him out of the room. He'll soon get the idea if he growls at the baby he's not allowed to be with his people. Also when you go to feed him, make believe that you're taking a bite and then feeding a bite to your baby before giving it to him.
When you walk him, make sure the baby's carriage is more forward than he is, make him walk behind you and the carriage. These are all suppose to make him realize that the baby is above him in the pecking order. Also put something that has the baby's smell (good odor) in the place where he sleeps.