How Do You Expose a Self Employed Ex.?

Hi H.,

I have a similar situation with an ex who owns his own co. and is currently paying nothing! I'm not managing and recently filed a contempt to see if the court system will really help us straighten this out. Anyway, in your situation I would subpeona his credit card bills, you'll be able to show what he's spending money on and how much. You can subpeona his rental agreement or mortgage agreements to see how much he's spending on where he lives. And, you can write in your OSC all the information you know about the kind of business he does on the side. The more details, the more convincing to a judge. Hard to catch a liar, I wont argue with that, but at least expose him and everything he has, it will be harder for him to hide everything from you. Best of luck! And, don't give up, he owes it to his children and to you... S.

p.s. one more thing... the living expenses you says he writes off, when it comes to support those are called 'add backs'. So if he writes off his car, gas, food, etc. when they add up his income to see what support he owes, they add all that BACK IN to come up with his earnings, so don't forget to do that!

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Put that first paragraph down on paper, and give it to the judge, maybe you could even mail a copy to him ahead of time, so that he will already know when the time for the hearing comes.

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Hi H.:
What you can do is take your husband back to court. File the paperwork before his upcoming court date. You can do it yourself through a courthouse. Just call or go down to the courthouse and they will help you fill it all out.

Once you have the request for a hearing to "up" his childsupport you can tell the judge the situation and the judge could "subpoena" all of the employment records,including the past earnings from his business.

If for some reason they decide to merge your court hearing as one, or if you don't get a court date before his, than make sure you attend "his' hearing and ask the judge to subpoena his employment records and past earnings. If they do this, they will have the exact amount of earnings he has been making.

Good luck and do it now, don't wait.....

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I dont have a similar situation, but some of my own thoughts as a business owner.

The judge will totally see right through all this. And if you have a attorney you can probably get his bank statements and that will prove otherwise. Since I am a business owner there are ways to be paid without an actual paycheck that is tax documented. I pay myself through accounts payable and of course have to cash it or deposit it into a bank account. You cannot hide money from the IRS no matter what business or personal. Now, if he does cash jobs that could be hidden if a invoice is never generated. That would be one way that he can claim poor.

Good Luck and I hope this helps.

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You can pull his articles of incorporation or dba yourself. It's public information. Contact the California Secretary of State, corporations division in Sacramento. Dbas are filed locally, if he has one. His name should be on the paperwork somewhere. If you need more time, file a continuance for the court date. That is within your right. This is a tax fraud issue as well as dead-beat dad case so it would be great if you could pull the necessary paperwork as exhibits to support your claim. What does not being an American have to do with anything? If you are here legally it really isn't an issue.
Good luck.

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Is it possible to ask for an extention on the court date? Have you called your area D.A.? Can you request his income tax records? Social Security should be able to help unless he is doing it all under the table. In that case, i don't know what belief system you have but, Just know that what goes around comes around and if you handle this like a real woman and don't get crazy... it will catch up with him one day. If you respond with your e-mail i'll try to find some time to share my story.

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Do you know how he obtains his self employment income? Do you know how he is paid? Do you know any customers? If yes, document this and turn him in to the IRS. You can get 10% of the federal income tax owed AND he never will know who turned him in. That's one course of action. Otherwise, get as many witnesses as you can to come in and give contrary testimony. Also get video and pictures of his lifestyle legally of course. A couple of disposal cameras showing his car at job sites, with customers. Just some ideas. Good luck.

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Dear H.,

I am no help here. I have three children, 19,17, and 15. I have been divorced two years from their father. He has claimed zero income (for the purposes of income tax) for about 6 years. When I asked for child support, I very nearly had to pay spousal support instead - and I am supposed to be grateful that he dropped it. He is supposed to have visitation from Friday night to Sunday night every other weekend, but currently only takes my youngest (the other two want nothing to do with him) every other Sunday - for breakfast or lunch. So I have 3 kids, full time, he only feeds one of them once every two weeks, and I receive no support! Where is the sense of responsibility for the children they made?

I looked at the other responses and see that many of the mothers are advising you to get a good lawyer - I would stress the word "good" - ask around and get references. My divorce lawyer was a wimp and wouldn't fight for anything - just told me he could, but more than likely we wouldn't get it and it would cost me more money. - Maybe ask some of these moms for their lawyers' numbers.

I wish you the best!
B.

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Well, I went to court and asked for more support. I asked for his tax records as one of the sources of his income. It was quite revealing. Instead of a cut back, he had to pay more.

You may need a lawyer, but it will be worth it if the tax records show his real income. As a self-employed person, he must declare what things he uses as deductions. Some of these deductions are government allowed exemptions. You will want to watch for that because he may declare them in court as expenses. An exemption is not an expense, but money back in his pocket.

Hope you find this helpful

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In order for them to do a relief you have to fill out paper work. MY ex wanted this about a few weeks ago. He wanted to get his lowered. Well I am disabled and dont work and my fiance well he does work. If you want him to continue to pay child support and not get it lowered you will have to do work. How else is the county going to know what is going on. They wont. So if you really want the child support then do your homework. I have to mine when it was time for court. He wanted to pay me 250 a month I said no and I fought it I got phone records and messages and I proved to the judge that he was scum.

So my sons father is "self employed" And well child support says that you keep them updated on where he is working ETC Well I got tired of this. He owes me 36567.00 And his payment is 666.00 a month.As you can see he does not pay well he does sometimes.. What you have to get is a bank account statement or his banking acount number. And it does not matter if it is with the company. They will do a bank lievy and not notify about it. Cause if they did he would take the money out of the account. Once they do the bank lievy he will probly close that account. And go open another one. If you go to his house like I do to my exs I do a little snooping. I DO NOT OPEN THE MAIL. The mail is already opened. Maybe this helps you maybe it does not lol.. Good luck

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Hi H.
I know you have had a few responses on this and there are some really good points.

Don't know where you live, however call child support services. Stay annoyomous, ask them if someone is self employed if all income is included when calculated for child support ie his car is a tax deduction. however he has to make the money to pay for the car in the first place.
I own my own business and the way it works when tax time comes is, I make x amount of dollars then the deductions are applied..if he is self employed supinoer (sp) his company records ie the company books. Company tax return. if he doesn't have any his screwed him self. If he say's he pays $200.00 in rent (really in this market) request copies of his cancelled cheques to prove it. If he owns any stocks anywhere they are considered income. (been thru this with my ex)
I also am not American but you have all the rights of one so don't worry about that.

D.

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if you know this for sure, then you must have some way to prove it, too :-) the judge will see that those numbers have to be fakes unless he is skin and bones. maybe the judge can look at his tax records for previous years and see his income. maybe you can find out his tax information somehow...gotta be sneaky.

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I am surprised the judge accepts evidence of your husband's paychecks alone. Most courts require documented earnings and will have them subpoened from the employer. You may ask the judge to have the court issue a supboena for his earning record from his employer and also request copies of bank statements and W-2 information. Finally, at the time of the hearing, ask for a continuance to obtain the items mentioned above.

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Here is my advise and take it from a woman who was married for 11 years with 3 children the same age as yours. This will be an uphill battle, but don't give up. Be diligent...in the state of California, a child support order means almost nothing. Get an attorney and have him/her file a summons. Your ex will have to provide the court with a list of assets which will include bank statements for the past 12 months, pay-check-stubs for 2 months, and a tax return for the past 2 years. He will have to fill out an income and expense disclosure and he only has 30 days to respond. If he does not give the court what they're asking for, there will be another hearing. Be patient and don't give up. It took me four years before I started receiving regular child support checks that have been garnished from his paycheck. If he files taxes and there is an existing child-support order; you will receive what's owed to you and your children.

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If I were you, I would take pictures of his shoes, watch, overall appearance as well as the car he drives and him place of residence. Pay special attention to high ticket items like flat screen t.v.s, artwork and stereo equipment. Present those photos at the hearing...

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Well, for one thing, H.,

It is not your business to expose your ex husband, you need to just settle down and stop this fretting. If you don't need the money, then let it go.

The Judge is not as naive as you think, he will probably catch on, if he doesn't, then just deal with it. It is not your job to be judge and exposer. The ex is hurting himself lots more than you can hurt him.

He can't possibly have a good relationship with his children, and the more you bring up the weakness of the father, the worse it hurts the children. My motto is children first. Getting back at exes is last.

C. N.

The judge should probably have him bring his tax returns, more than likely the REAL info. will be on that!

Hey H.. If you are going directly through the child support in los angeles county. They should have requested a copy of his taxes he filed with the irs. You also stated his pay checks are doctored. The child support ###-###-#### is to retain a copy of his ACTUAL paycheck from his employer, which will show his correct earning (not doctored). Hope this helps. Good Luck to You!!

Hi H.
I would be glad to discuss your situation with you. I am a divorce mediator with 12 years of experience. Please call me at your convenience at ###-###-####
L. D

If he is renting, get the number of the manager of his building. Ask the manager to send you a form showing what the rent is in the building. Or, you might be able to look it up online? If you know the name of his apartment complex, they probably list themselves.

I am in a similar situation I subpenied (?) his bank account information and it told the truth for him. They all slip up and the right thing catches up with them. The judge will not believe him they have heard every story. After all that we went through my ex is now dying of cancer. I have to explain it to my daughter now.

What is your Ex's employment? If he is self employed, do the people who hire his services get invoiced from him? Your lawyer can request tax documents from his business and from his personal taxes.

H.,
the judge isnt stupid....believe me, he sees this stuff everyday, im not too sure but if you are under oath, and let the judge know you are positive he is doctoring his pay, it will be looked into further!
L. f

I was in this same situation with my ex about a year ago. I finally did the homework my lawyer was suposed to do and caught him in the lie.

The first thing you need to do is Talk to the IRS and request his tax number, Do the same at the state level.
If he does not have a tax number with either one then make sure you are documenting every last thing you do to catch him, as it will keep you out of trouble if he ever accuses you of helping him hide money from the IRS (as my ex did).

Next thing to do is Google his name as well as that on the business he owns. Sometimes this will bring up quarterly cost and income statements for their business. It will also tell you when he started his business (most of the time)

Check him out on Myspace. This is where I caught my ex actually bragging about how "stupid the judge was and how he could have said he was homeless and the courts would have believed it. The best part of checking them out this way is the pictures that they post. My ex had posted a few picturees of his last trip to Germany and his new BMW along with captions of when he became the proud owner.

I was really upset when I took a look at how much I was paying my lawyer ($250 an hour) when he was unwilling to do the homework that took me less than 5 hours to do.

In case you are wondering my ex was paying $44 dollars for each of his 3 children a month before I got the evidence needed to take to the judge. He paid this paltry amount for 8 years. Now he is paying $512 for each.

I hope this helps you and your family
H. Stanley

My sister dealt with family court and child support issues and generally speaking the judges will see through this and should require more of him. I assume you will be attending the hearing? If so, you should ask the judge to speak and let him know what's going on.
Good luck

If he is self-employed he has to provide copies of his tax returns for the last three years. Also, if you know the name of his clients or vendors, you can subpoena the records which will show how much they have actually paid to him. Subpoena his bank accounts to see what his deposits are and how much of a draw he is taking from the company. You can also request that the judge impute his income at a rate that is reasonable for a full-time person in his profession.

If he files tax returns they should be brought before the judge. If he doesn't, turn him into the IRS. Then he will have to pay them plus interest and pay you.

An attorney should take care of this for you.

If you have an attorney ask that he/she request copies or your ex's last 3 year's tax filings - OR copies of his last year's pay stubs directly from his company's payroll office or payroll processing company (mine uses ADP)!! My ex used to work for a really small family-type company that would lie FOR HIM! So if they use an outside payroll company it is actually better - but it will require a court order to get that information out of them!
If you do not have an attorney go through legal aid and get the forms to file to the court yourself requesting the same information. You might need to include a letter stating that you have received information from an anonymous source (or old friend) within his company who has stated that what he is reporting is not truthful, and that you would like to formally request an audit of his earnings from his payroll company so the courts may determine his actual income.
If this doesn't work you than you really will need to get an attorney and let her handle the detective work. Mine never reported what he honestly made either....my kids are 27 & 28 and he STILL owes me a few thousand that I'll probably never see. GOOD LUCK!!
BLM

Hi,

I assume you have a lawyer... If so then they need to have his bank acct and tax returns for the last three yrs sopenia.
I agree, its not your current hubby's responsibilty. Good luck. Let us know what happens.