R.T. asks from Oxnard, CA on November 29, 2007
GATE Student with a Learning Disability?
I have a sixth-grade daughter who is currently enrolled in Honors classes due to being assessed with a high level of intelligence in both Language Arts and Math by her previous school. She is smart, but very unfocused. We have struggled her entire school career to get her to just stay on task and write the answers down as soon as she gets them. For some reason, she feels she has to wait for someone to tell her that it's correct and still seems to debate with herself over whether or not she should write anything down at all. She struggles with the process of writing, still pushing down very hard on the pencil, and frequently spelling words incorrectly in a sentence despite the fact that she scores well on all her spelling tests. Her math skills are very difficult to assess since there are days it seems difficult for her to remember basic multiplication facts. All of this seems to be compounded now, since we moved over the summer. A new city, a new school, new friends, and then she was transferred to the Honors classes at the very end of last quarter, so her entire world has shifted multiple times in the last six months. She is in danger of failing one of her classes and scoring poorly in the others because she has not turned in her homework consistently. We have been up until after 11:00 the last three nights trying to get her to finish her homework. I strongly believe she is capable of handling these classes intellectually. I just don't know if, besides the obvious emotional strain, there is something keeping her from finishing her assignments in a timely manner. Is it possible for a child to have a learning disability and still be a GATE student? I don't want an excuse to give her teachers, I just want to help my daughter get the most out of her education and ease the stress she is currently going through. If there is another way to help her learn better, I want to find it. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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S.D. answers from Los Angeles on November 30, 2007
Does it seem as thought she is not doing things because she is a perfectionist and doesn't want to be wrong? Perhaps she needs to learn not to be so hard on herself. Maybe you could have her go work things out with a counselor. It may help her learn some study habits and to learn how to let go of the need to be perfect all the time.
Also, while it could be that she is struggling with ADD, do you think that maybe she is just highly imaginative or creative and gets stuck in her train of thought? My dad is a genius engineer type and he is frequently in his own world because he is thinking too hard.
Just be open minded about the cause I guess and try exploring different methods to help her.
Best wishes, S.
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M.M. answers from Los Angeles on November 30, 2007
ABSOLUTELY~!! Try these websites: SENG (supporting emotional needs of Gifted children), California Association for Gifted Childrens, and, National Association for Gifted Children. Very, very common. Good luck!
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J.R. answers from San Diego on November 30, 2007
Yes, you can have a GATE child w/ a learning disability. What does she say when you ask her why she isn't getting her assignments done? Talk to her teachers. You may want to ask for a Student Success Team meeting (SST). This is a formal problem-solving meeting involving many different professionals at school but talk to her teachers first and see what they suggest. Good luck!
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C.P. answers from San Francisco on November 30, 2007
Oh my! This IS ME in the sixth grade. (No, really, I am stunned at the similarities).
My sixth grade year was the year my Mom pushed for me to be tested for learning disabilities. She was right! I have dysgraphia, and difficulty transferring written information from one page to another. The difficulty I had writing, plus being a bit of a perfectionist contributed to my late and absent assignments. I was never proud of my assignments; they were never to the level of what I was comprehending in my brain.
My Mom pushed to have me evaluated over the objection of many of the teachers and administrators ("But C. is so smart, I am sure of she just _applied_ herself more she could do better") and I was given extra help in school (an extra study hall with staff who were used to kids with learning disabilities), but what really made the difference was my Mom. She helped me with my homework until I went to college. She typed for me as I spoke out loud what I wanted to write until I could do it myself. I had to learn punctuation all over again. I used music/singing as a tool to help me understand where the punctuation marks and capitals went. I stopped worrying about wasted paper and began to solve math problems, one page for each problem. so I had enough room to figure in the margins. Because my learning disabilities were documented, I was able to take tests un-timed- the extra time boosted my grades considerably. By my Junior year of high school I had caught up to my peers in the gifted program. I received the English award in my Senior year and took the SAT's un-timed, and did well!
Get your child evaluated for a learning disability (mine is in writing), get her some counseling (I went through a deep depression and was suicidal for my year abroad in the 8th grade). I disagree with with the suggestion of some of the other posters that your child may have ADD. ADD is a specific disorder that definitely has an impact on academic success but it is a whole different "animal" from dyslexia (a reading problem) and dysgraphia (a writing problem). You may also like to read-up about learning styles. I discovered I am a strong auditory learner; I can make connections better and faster if I concentrate on thinking- not on writing during lectures. Diligent note taking actually hinders my comprehension. I now take fewer notes and remember better what was said- because I am not distracted by trying to write (my more challenging skill). Your child is going to discover her strengths too and learn to use them to her academic advantage.
I am very proud of my academic writing as an adult. Without fail, I get glowing recommendations on my technical writing skills, so there is hope if you can get your child the right help. There is nothing wrong that cannot be overcome with hard work, patience and loving understanding from a caring mother. I do not write with the ease that others do, and I will never write for pleasure, but I am proud of my writing skills. My handwriting is still terrible, but it is legible. I have a special spelling book that I carried for my written work in college exams. It is like a dictionary but no definitions, just the spelling of the words. It was a Godsend. It is on my desk right now- I still use it- even here in the days of instant spell check.
Write me privately if you want more details about exactly how I overcame my learning disabilities and finally found my self esteem and academic success.
Warmly,
C.
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S.G. answers from Los Angeles on November 30, 2007
I hope this helps: both of my children are extremely bright and my oldest (now 15) has been in honors/gate classes since she was in 4th grade and totally thrived. My son, on the other hand is probably more intelligent, but has ADHD, and wasn't able to read well until he was in 3rd grade. He has struggled at school with his inability to stay focused, lack of organization skills, and pretty much lazy attitude. Even though we knew he COULD do the work, we did NOT put him in the gate classes because we knew it would be a struggle. I think it's okay to say "let's do what we can" instead of making things unnecessarily difficult. We struggled all the way through elementary school, but now he's in 7th grade, loving the Jr High atmosphere and getting straight A's. Because he is capable, some of his teachers are giving him the gate/honors coursework to keep him challenged. Has she ever been tested for ADD or ADHD, etc. I have a friend who's son has not been able to get his classwork done in the time alotted and thus it became homework on top of the homework he already had and they could never get thru it. She finally had her kid tested (6th grader) and they've put him on a low dose of meds for ADHD (same as my son) and within days she and the teacher both saw an improvement in his ability to stay focused and get his work done. Perhaps the classes are just too much for her at this time (keeping in mind her hormones are probably all over the place), see if you can switch her to regular classes for the remainder of the year to help her regain control. Once control is lost, it just tends to spiral and get worse. I strongly believe it will get better as she finds her way and matures. I seriously doubted there was any light at the end of the tunnel for years, but I'm finally seeing it! Good luck and God bless.
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V.M. answers from Los Angeles on November 30, 2007
I totally feel for you. Your note reminded me of my son who is now in 10th grade. Both my kids are GATE kids and only 14 months apart, but what a difference. My daughter stood here and listened to me read out loud your concern and we both said "This reminds me of Jeff" (my son). I too struggled with him because he was obviously smart enough, but hated to write. The math teacher would ask them to show their work and if they didn't they'd get marked down in grades. Jeff felt that wasnt' fair so long as he got it right why does he have to show how he got the answer. He does things in his head much better than on paper. (I'm the reverse of that but love math too). So I just kept reminding him that he's ruining his grade when he doesn't show his work. That I know he knows how to do it but he should prove it to his teacher by doing what he asks. Show the work. He fought it all the way, but ended up with a decent grade. I figured that so long as he could show me that he really does know the material I wasn't going to be upset if he decided not to be anal about showing his work. The next year he found a teacher who told him that so long as he gets the answers right he doesn't have to show his work. This worked well for him.
So hang on, it's going to get better, not all teachers are the same. Some will be able to better tell what she's going through than others. I say, so long as she can tell you she knows the work and understands it, then you can relax. Be glad she's smart. She may just be bored. Jeff was.
Let her have some freedom and give yourself a break from worrying. She's just a kid still, so let her enjoy life a little, you are doing your best, you can't MAKE her do the homework, but you CAN give her little prizes when she does. If the negative scolding doesn't work, try a positive approach and let her know that you know she's trying and when you see the slightest improvement make a really big deal about it. Celebrate! Give hugs and tell her how proud you are of her. She could be looking for attention too. Tired of being good all the time. Kids are like that.
I wish I had this site when I was going through things like this. I hope it helps to know you arent' alone. :)
PS. Jeff took Digital Electronics, Biology, Algebra 2, and honors english 9, in 9th grade. All advanced classes. He didn't get straight A's, but about half A's and half B's. The Digital Electronics class earned him college credits!
This year he's taking Principles of Engineering, Chemistry, Geo/Trig (Geometry& Trig), AP Honors History, and Honors English 10. The POE (Principles of Engineering) also earned him college credits. So why did I worry back in middle school when he was not doing his homework? ;)
Wish you the best!
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J.J. answers from Redding on November 30, 2007
Hi R.!
I am not a Mom, but I am an educator by profession. I also work with the movement arts and am very interested in how the brain works. When I read what you right, it doesn't sound too uncommon, based on my experience, especially with other emotiona stresses right now, chiefly among them, the pre adolescent on set....
My suggestions are to also look at what sort of physical activity she has, her large and small motor skill coordination, and other mental/physical integration activities she has. Google brain gym for kids, qi gong, or yoga. Learnign to breathe and relax while using a tool or skill is very benefical. She will press less hard on the pencil. also brain hemispehere integration can help with bringing forth information in the brain to spoken or written word. These things can help support her academics.
Of course diet is often an enormous factor in ability to focus...
Yoga also develops ability to concentrate and focus and bring about greater awareness of one's body and environment.
Often students even gets bounced bewteen special ed(learning disabilities), and Gate, because there is often misunderstanding about SPECIAL needs of ALL students. Some of the most brilliant achievers in the world were considered disabled in their learning. These are the same gifts as those her get the label the other way, the baby genius. Autism shows us extreme high levels of intelligence that is out of this world.
It seems you have a good attitude about wanting to support her with a way that serves her learning style and personal needs. Continue to stay hopeful that she will have what she needs to grow beautifully. Its important for her not to feel bad about the situation. Compassion, even if you are at wit's end.
I am oin the McCloud area and I homeschool two children and work with people of all ages one on one. If you are interested in talking some more, contact me.
Blessings!
J. devi
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K.L. answers from San Francisco on November 29, 2007
As a special education teacher, know that it is entirely possible for an extremely bright child to have a learning disability - often, the two go hand and hand. Even children with severe disabilities and special needs have extreme brightness in one or more academic subjects. Don't let this scare you though: has your daughter always been this unfocused, and had this much trouble staying on task? If not, bright children often become bored and completely lose any motivation to do schoolwork, stay on task in class, or attend to academics in any way.
If she has always seemed this way when it comes to school, I would strongly suggest that you have her evaluated by your school district. Talk to a teacher that you feel knows your child well, and see what she thinks about your daughters performance and habits in school. By law, your school district has to provide assesment of children for learning disabilities, free of charge: you might want to speak to the child psychologist/school nurse/principal to put you in touch with the school district to arrange for an assessment.
I was a gifted child, skipped a grade in elementary school, and was always in the same gate, honors, and ap classes throughout my school career, always travelling through these classes with the same group of "bright" children. Now, as a special education teacher, I suspect that more than a few of them may have suffered from sensory integration disorder, aspergers syndrome, and even mild autism.
Speak with that teacher about your concerns, or go right to the principal. Try to get her assessed as soon as possible.
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S.L. answers from San Francisco on November 30, 2007
Dear R.,
Yes it's possible for child to be gifted in may areas and challenged in others. My oldest son is extremely gifted, but very challenged with organization and focus. We had him tutored for two years with a great tutor who focused on how to solve a problem and how to approach a written assignments. Kids that can jump from question to answer never learn how to go through a step by step solution process. They are so bright they don't learn how to learn, as other kids do, they just know they answers. That can work for them up through fifth or sixth grade but then more complex problems are given and they get frustrated and confused. They can also have real self esteem issues because of the great difference in what they could always do so easily and what they are challenged with now so we also had our son see a therapist/counselor for awhile to help support him through this tough time. He is now in seventh grade and doing very well. He still needs support from us as most kids do, but the counseling and tutoring made a HUGE difference.
Hope this helps.
All my best to you,
S. L.
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D.M. answers from San Francisco on November 30, 2007
Your daughter sounds just like mine and I recently found out that she is Dyslexic. This is not just looking at letters backwards, etc... I have learned that it is a whole different way they look at things in life. I have found that with Dyslexia that they need to visually picture things ( ie: if you see the word CAT your mind pictures a cat ). Also, school books on tape, or record them onto a tape yourself helps immensely. Have your daughter read along with listening to it.
You can ask your doctor or check out the dyslexia center's website (www.dyslexiacenter.com ) They are located in Las Vegas, recently moved from No. California and I believe they have tutors all over. They are a wealth of information and are world known. Has worked miracles for my daughter, it may help you! Good luck ~ D.
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M.F. answers from Salinas on November 30, 2007
I can tell you I was that kid. Not exactly the same issues, but basically. I was a GATE student in honors classes and yet teachers constantly told me I was not living up to expectations. I would lose focus and often not complete work that would have been seemingly easy. I was 22 before anyone even thought of assessing me for ADD. It can often be much more masked in girls. I am not sure if that is what is going on with your daughter but sometimes getting an assessment or knowing where to start can help. There are many choices other than medication, and lots of medications that don't make your kids nutty like you hear. If someone had sat down with me at her age and helped me to understand my brain a little better, life would have been much easier, but I turned out fine anyway. Maybe that's why I am a teacher now... Good luck.
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