Appropriate Punishment

Dear M.,

After reading your situation, my first thought was, "At least she came to you help her solve her problem." She could have gone weeks without telling you that she had put something in her ear, and then the situation would be so much worse. A trip to the doctor with an uncomfortable procedure and a serius talk from the doctor about the dangers of putting foreign objects into orifices should suffice for the time being. Especially if she really respects her doctor (sorry, my daughter and I watch WordGirl on PBS). And you don't want her to get so scared of the consequences that she won't tell you when something unfortunate happens in the future. Get too harsh now and she may not tell you when she falls off the jungle gym and breaks her arm; she'll try to hide it from you because she is more scared of your anger and disappointment than the physical pain.

My daughter had a really bad day at preschool last year, and I was the one who had a hard time getting over it. I spent the afteroon admnonishing her about what she had done, trying to convey my anger and disappointment and how bad she had been. Fortunately, the postman delivered a package. She confessed her "crime" to the postman in a pure and lovely fashion. When she did that, I was able to let go of my anger and realize she had been punished enough. I also realized her teacher was the chief instigator in the unfortunate incident.

Don't cancel the trip to the American Girl Store, mostly because I think you'll enjoy it more than your daughter and it will help you reconnect with her emotionally (when I get upset with my daughter, it helps if I do somethng really nice for her, even if it's something really tiny like making a dessert just for her). I agree that if she does something accidently, on purpose foolish again, her new doll will be put away for awhile.

Happy Birthday to your daughter. Mine will be five next week!

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Let's replace the word "punishment" with "deterrent" and focus on ways to keep this from happening again. On that note, I agree with others who suggested asking your daughter why she put something in her ears. Maybe they're itchy inside and she wanted to scratch the itch. Or maybe she was curious about that orifice, in which case a gentle discussion on how the insides of our ears are delicate and need to be protected. Be sure that your own actions are consistent with this discussion: If you tell her that she can't put things in her ears, and then she sees you with Q-tips or you use them on her, then she'll be confused.

As for cancelling the trip, there's the saying, "The punishment should fit the crime." This is true both in degree of harshness and in how the crime & punishment are related. A trip to NYC has nothing to do with her ears, so she might not see how they are connected.

A fitting punishment/deterrent if she were to do it again might be that she has to wear something annoying on her ears, or sit for 15 minutes with her hands on her ears. (15 minutes might not equal the time & effort you spend getting the thing out, but you know that it's an eternity for a kid, especially holding her arms up.)

C.

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Hi M.,

Punishing a child never works. The consequences for her action is going to the Doctor. That is enough. Since your child continues to put things in her ears, get her an evaluation for her hearing.

When you take her to the Doctor, ask for a referral to an EENT Doc.

I also suggest you get into a parenting support group and also take some parenting classes.

www.kidspriorityone.org or ###-###-####

www.chkd.org/classes

Hope this helps. Good luck. D.

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Cancelling her birthday trip to NYC to buy an American Girl doll would be too harsh. Perhaps, when you visit the doctor tomorrow, ask that he speak to her about the dangers of putting foreign objects in her ears, etc.

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I wouldn't cancel her birthday trip! Maybe if it wasn't a special occasion but it is her birthday! Children (some adults too) do stupid stuff at some point and time. I would not think of any punishment unless she did the same thing again! I think the worry of her thinking she might have to have surgery to remove it would be "punishment" enough. I doubt that she will do it again! Maybe she put the foam in for some other reason and it got stuck. You know how some people use q-tips (although your not supposed to stick them in your ear), maybe she thought she was doing something like that? Did you ask her why she did it in a calm rational voice? I know when they do something you view as a dumb move, you can sometimes fly off the handle, but it is best to calm down and talk to her to get to the root of why she thought it was ok to do what she did. anyway, just my two cents!

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her current pain, a trip to the doctor and possible surgery aren't serious consequences? i certainly think this situation deserves some serious conversation (i'd be particularly interested in getting to the bottom of why she puts stuff in her ears....and no, she won't be able to explain it logically)but not seeing why any punishment is appropriate. this feels more like either honest mistake or compulsion, not naughtiness.
hope everything goes well.
khairete
S.

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I dont think it calls for a punishment at all. Kids do those things and as it can be a serious situation for her its just one of those things. I am sure she has forgotten somewhat the drama of TWO-2 years ago. You might have to keep a closer eye on her if she is going to be doing things like that. My sister once stuck foam up her nose and we didnt discover it til days later when she got sick and had an infection in her nose...kids do that.
Most certainly you dont take her birthday away from her, for any reason. I really cannot think of any appropriate punishment other than no beads or foam. You are just going to have to have another talk w/ her and hopefully now at age 5 she will grasp it a little better.

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If her Dr. can't get it out without surgery an ENT might be able to. If they can it will be pretty unpleasant. I would see how traumatic it is to remove the stuff from her ear it may be a natural consequence. She is older now I would sit down and chat with her about why she put something in her ear. Does she have problems with her ears? Do they hurt or pop? I would ask without suggesting what her answer should be I would rule out an underlying cause for this behavior before punishing her. I would only go for the punishment if removing the items is no big deal and you find no under lying cause for her behavior

M.,
I would buy the furriest, hottest, fluffiest pair of ear muffs you can find and force her to wear them every time you catch her putting something close to her ear(after ruling out itching ears/allergy/infection) If it's a habit, breaking it w/ daily consequence may be more effective than taking away the trip.
I have 3 teens now and honestly a big loss of a trip would devistate them...but maybe not as effective on your 5 yr old. Something that reminds her daily would help break the habit and establish a new one......sticking things in my ears means mommy will force me to wear the embarrasing, hot, irritating ear muffs! No more of that, hopefully!
You might start by having her try them on for a few minutes...enough time for her to figure out there no fun...then have a talk w/ her and let her know that she will have to wear them longer each time she disobeys...this is for her safety so she will not need surgery.
Hang in there,
L.

I'm not sure I would punish her. IMO, she's a child and kids are curious. She's exploring, learning and probably thinking she's having a lot of fun sticking things in funny places on her body. She's doing this because she's curious and she's a kid. We've all done silly things while were kids but she didn't hurt anyone but herself. That's punishment enough. Maybe you could get her a book on the body and explain to her about the different body parts, etc? Just think that even though this is an inconvenience for you it will definitely be a funny story you tell her when she's older.

I think that canceling her birthday surprise is a horrible idea. Seriously, that's way harsh. Her memories of doing something special with you will be so much more important that whether or not she learned a lesson in this.

Maybe you're just caught up in the moment and need some time to sleep on it?

I wish her luck at the doctor!

I agree that cancelling the trip is quite harsh. She wasn't trying to be bad/naughty, she made a mistake, albeit a dangerous one. I wouldn't ruin her birthday which is a day which is supposed to celebrate your love and acceptance of her.

My four year old swallowed a penny about a month ago. She was going throught this phase of mouthing everything, and it got out of hand. Right now, if I see anything near her mouth, play stops - we have left the playground, and several toys were taken away, and I took her piggy bank out of her room (no more pennies). It took about three days of consistency, but it worked. She has stopped. And I have caugh her in the act of almost doing it and stopping herself. I think that is what you are going for here. Get her to break the habit or temptation so you can trust her to be safe. Not just make her feel really bad.

My point is, you should tie the discipline to the crime. Maybe take away every arts and crafts type item she owns to be earned back. Supervise her like a hawk, catch her playing appropriately and praise her, and discipline her immediately should you see the behavior again. You want to make that little voice in her head say "oh-oh, don't do that" if she puts something unsafe near her body. I am not sure that taking away a trip for a special day will do that effectively.

Unfortunately, I think this is the age where kids try this sort of thing. It is a big deal, but I thing you need more long-term and deliberate consequences. Also, take her to the doctor's office and have them sit down and show her how she could have hurt herself. Ask them to scare her a bit. My daughter needed an x-ray and that helped a lot because she was a little scared.

ANother thought, buy her the doll, but tell her that THAT will be the ears-nose-mouth toy - if she repeats her behavior, that is the first thing to go! Explain to her that you seriously considered not going on the trip and this is what you have decided.

Good luck.

I agree with you, that it is a serious matter, and that your daughter does need to understand that it is not healthy for her to be putting things in her ears. But- she needs to learn. She is still very young, and sticking things up noses, in ears, cutting their bangs, dropping things into the toilet...that is all things that many children do. They are just exploring, and learning. When your daughter had done it the first time, it may be possible that it was a concept a little above her head, and she hadn't really "learned" her lesson. Or in the moment of sticking the foam in her ear, she forgot. Whatever the reason, us as parents need to have a bit of patience in teaching the right/wrong behavior...even when it is the second time around. I agree with the other posters, that cancelling her birthday surprise would be heartbreaking, and is a bit too harsh. I would seperate the two issues....ear and birthday. But do remind your daughter how special the doll is, and that she hadn't gotten one prior, because they are for big girls. Review requirements of being a big girl (mentioning the ear thing), and make clear the doll will be removed from her if she doesn't act like a big girl. Good luck...and take her on the trip, make fun memories together that will outshine the sticky foam memory!
K.

Hi, M. - At 5, I doubt she really understands the ramifications of what she did. I would do something like take away dessert, or a favorite TV show, but not anything harsh, as you said. Save the "big guns" for blatant infractions of rules, lack of respect, etc. Good luck. N. B.

I wouldn't take away a birthday trip or present. I agree with the others, she was probably just experimenting which goes along with the age. I agree that the consequence of the action is the fact she has to go to the doctor and I would have the doctor speak to her and give her examples of the damage that can be done. I might also tell her that because you had to take the time to go to the doctor she will now miss something else you would have taken her to that day, like the park, or a movie or something you normally do that she likes.

I think this is pretty normal behavior, not in need of such a harsh punishment. The embarrasment and trip to the doctor are enough to leave an impression. She's just a kid.

We had exactly the same problem with our 3 old daughter. she swears that she did not put anything in her ears. but of course how else they got there. Fortunatly for us it only happened once.

Personally I think the birthday punishment is very bad. My father panished me like that when I was a small girl and I still remember it and still can not forgive him for that.
Please do not take away your child's birthday surprise.

I think there are other ways to panush her: like no TV for a week/ no playdates for a week (or pick appropriate number of days)/ no computer games for a week. all of these would work for my 5 years old daughter.

At not quite 5, that seems like normal exploratory behavior. I would leave it at just talking to her about how serious it is. Maybe having the doctor speak to her would have more of an effect than any "toy related" punishment. Hope it comes out easily!

Taking awawy a birthday trip is only going to upset the situation for the both of you and is really not needed. I would recomend taking away a privladge like no tv every time she does it or if she can write make her write sentences
at the same age MY daughter had trouble not listening to what she was told and arguing so every time she did she would have to write i will do what i am told . A very simple sentence and it did the trick she is know 7 and all I have to do is threaten with it and it works like a charm. If she cannot write and this won't work have her repeat I will not put things in my ears 5 times every time she does this . It worked on my niece who is younger. I hope one of these will help.

I'm putting my vote in with the ladies that say canceling the trip is a little harsh. I like S M's suggestion about making the doll her "currency" and make sure she knows if she does stuff like that, you won't feel she's a big enough girl to have a doll like that, that you'll take it away until she's older.

I'm also applauding Leigh R's response, especially the second and third paragraphs.

I would think that the doctor's visit would be scary enough, but you mentioned she's done it before. It's probably just impulse control that all little people need to learn, and you can help her with that with some of the other excellent suggestions people have written here. I think the trip to the American Girl store may be a once in a lifetime sort of thing you might regret if you don't do it.

Kids just do stuff like this. My daughter swallowed what turned out to be a nickel on new Years day. After five days, the last three on double adult dose of Miralax, she finally passed it. Is your daughter climbing to the roof and trying to jump off? Is she running out into the street? Climbing trees and falling out and breaking bones? Cutting herself? Just to give you a little perspective!

If she was doing it every couple of weeks, and/or it was obvious she was doing it just to tick you off, you'd get her to the doctor to find out why. But two incidents two years apart is nothing to worry about. Relax!!!!

-S. K

I would check with the doctor first to see if there is a medical reason why she is doing this. Is there something in her ear that is irritating her to make her put things in there or is it just a habit? I would check to see if there are coverings for her ears. Does she do this subconsciously? If there is no medical reason and she does this consciously and it is not a habit, then I would look at punishment. If this next incident with the sticky foam costs you time and money, I would associate it directly to the time you had to spend in the hospital with the trip and the money you had to spend on the surgery to the cost of the doll.

Wow, your girls are something. My daughter did that once and had to go through getting something removed from her ears at the doctor's office. It scarred her so bad that it never happened again.

Taking something away never worked for her. But what I did do often as punishment is make her help me clean up around the house. Things like I gave her a spray bottle and she washed windows and helped me wash the walls down in high traffic areas. We dusted and did laundry.

To this day she and my nieces laugh about their cleaning pusnishments (they are 21 now). A day of labor always seemed to work with them.

i would thik anything that happens at the drs office would be punishment enough.

I think that the doctor's appt and having it removed will be punishment enough. You can talk and talk at this age but she is curious and will forget and do it. I think cancelling the birthday party is way too harsh.